Chevy axing Camaro

[Aaron]

Rumor is 7th gen is delayed and 6th gen running through 2026.

 

I’ve seen this movie before.

 

Hue hue hue

[BuckeyeROC]

New platform and electric for the 7th gen, if they build it.

 

I'd rather they just kill the Camaro than slap the name on an electric CRV clone though.

[STEVE-O]

Id rather see them make a electric s10 (again)

[RyM3rC]

New platform and electric for the 7th gen, if they build it.

 

I'd rather they just kill the Camaro than slap the name on an electric CRV clone though.

 

+1

 

what's the problem? MPG targets or low sales?

[Crossle]

SUV's for everyone!!!!

[zeitgeist57]

SUV's for everyone!!!!

 

Edited January 1, 2021 by zeitgeist57

[gillbot]

They need to axe most of their lineup and start over.

[BuckeyeROC]

They need to axe most of their lineup and start over.

 

 

Agreed, but I think that's true of all the manufacturers.

[BuckeyeROC]

+1

 

what's the problem? MPG targets or low sales?

 

Sales suck. I think they are banned in California and Washington now because of the copper content in the brakes.

[10phone2]

pricing for most new cars makes tater sense.

[Not Brian]

The new ones look like shit, weigh two tons, and cost 50 fucking grand for what should be a simple fun car. This is why 4th gens are skyrocketing in value.. the future sucks.

[gillbot]

I like the Charger/Challenger lineup but their prices are tater and those pigs need a diet.

 

Camaro is WAY overpriced imho but the engine/platform has potential. If GM would actually try instead of riding on the other manufacturers coattails that is.

 

Mustang. Just LOL.

[BuckeyeROC]

Oof... https://gmauthority.com/blog/2021/01/gm-sales-figures-numbers-results-united-states-q4-2020/

[Gergwheel1647545492]

Oof... https://gmauthority.com/blog/2021/01/gm-sales-figures-numbers-results-united-states-q4-2020/

 

Chevrolet Corvette sales increased 157.58 percent to 8,992 units

:megusta:

[BuckeyeROC]

Chevrolet Corvette sales increased 157.58 percent to 8,992 units

:megusta:

 

Yeah, C8 seems legit and starts at a decent price point for what it is.

[TimTaylor751647545500]

I'd like to find a clean SS for a daily down here after my lease is up.

[Geeto67]

I like the Charger/Challenger lineup but their prices are tater and those pigs need a diet.

 

Camaro is WAY overpriced imho but the engine/platform has potential. If GM would actually try instead of riding on the other manufacturers coattails that is.

 

Mustang. Just LOL.

 

I am not sure I follow this logic. The Challenger R/T is the cheapest way to get into a manual, RWD, V8, pony car coupe out there. Sticker price is $35K but as you told me yourself there are tons of incentives to get the costs down and to be honest most base R/Ts seem to be trading hands at around $28K-$32K. Plus dealers seem to actual stock base no frills R/Ts (to help with those $300 a month lease deals) - to me that seems like a bargain.

 

The Mustang GT, on paper, is $37K base price but I don't see many incentives to bring that price down. The Camaro SS base price is $39K and I can't find a single one in a dealers inventory that is under $42K, and few incentives.

 

I agree the challenger is a pig weight wise. It's also the most usable car.

 

I am not sure the camaro is "overpriced" so much as for 2020 it was missing a "base V8". The cheapest SS is still $4K more than the challenger and more than the mustang. I guess that is why for 2021 Chevy rolled out the LT1 which is a $35K v8 stripper model. To me that sounds like the right play - the base SS was competing with the base 392 challengers and not the R/T and they didn't have an R/T priced v8 car.

[gillbot]

I am not sure I follow this logic. The Challenger R/T is the cheapest way to get into a manual, RWD, V8, pony car coupe out there. Sticker price is $35K but as you told me yourself there are tons of incentives to get the costs down and to be honest most base R/Ts seem to be trading hands at around $28K-$32K. Plus dealers seem to actual stock base no frills R/Ts (to help with those $300 a month lease deals) - to me that seems like a bargain.

 

The Mustang GT, on paper, is $37K base price but I don't see many incentives to bring that price down. The Camaro SS base price is $39K and I can't find a single one in a dealers inventory that is under $42K, and few incentives.

 

I agree the challenger is a pig weight wise. It's also the most usable car.

 

I am not sure the camaro is "overpriced" so much as for 2020 it was missing a "base V8". The cheapest SS is still $4K more than the challenger and more than the mustang. I guess that is why for 2021 Chevy rolled out the LT1 which is a $35K v8 stripper model. To me that sounds like the right play - the base SS was competing with the base 392 challengers and not the R/T and they didn't have an R/T priced v8 car.

 

Those were my personal opinions, but I'll expand.

 

The 5.7L Charger/Challenger is a joke and shouldn't even be an option. 392 or GFTO, the 5.7 is useless in that pig of a car. Once you step into the 392, the only real one that's semi-affordable is the Scat Pack but to get it budget you have to strip all the options out. Good luck finding one at dealers for the entry price point, which they tout but it's nearly unattainable. Sure you can order one, but then you typically lose out on the incentives that are in place to get people buying them. Trust me I tried, most incentives are only available if you take delivery from dealer stock and they will likely never order base 392 cars.

 

Camaro is a similar story to the above. They try to sell it as affordable but they option up the trims so heavily that it's hard to get a decent performing V8 without all the excessive sticker bloat. Don't even say V6 because that's a huge LOL.

 

As for the mustang, I'll reiterate. MUSTANG LOL (If you couldn't tell by now, i'm not a mustang fan.)

[Geeto67]

 

The 5.7L Charger/Challenger is a joke and shouldn't even be an option.

 

yeah we are all just discussing our opinions.

 

I don't think it's a joke. It's not a Mustang GT or a camaro SS, but it is a traditional V8, makes V8 sounds, and unlocks the V8 aftermarket.

 

The joke is the Challenger/charger pentastar v6, where they also offer AWD (they did offer R/T AWD in the charger for a while and it was kinda cool - like a large v8, auto, wrx ). You want young people to buy sport coupes and you want them to be able to afford v8 sport coupes - a 392, as cool as a car it is isn't going to put young buyers asses in seats, no matter how badly they want to be there. There is a whole generation of buyers out there that aren't mechanics, don't want to be mechanics, but want v8 muscle car noises, want to see what a drag strip pass is like, don't want the hassle of a used car, and don't want more than one car. They want to pay someone to put an exhaust on it so it sounds like a top fueler, and maybe rims and tires and not eat shit that they wasted their money on a v6 car from the "enthusiast" crowd. The 5.7 hemi challenger is that car for them.

[gillbot]

That's why they play engine sounds through the radio now

 

Why is the challenger/charger v6 a joke but the camaro isn't? The camaro has a 4cyl too! They are all a stone's throw within each other, including the 5.7L v8!

 

SXT is rated at 292HP

GT is rated at 300

R/T is rated at 370HP

 

2.0L Turbo 4-cylinder engine

275 hp @ 5600 rpm

295 lb-ft of torque @ 3000-4500 rpm

Variable Valve Timing and Spark Ignition Direct Injection

 

3.6L V6 engine

335 hp @ 6800 rpm

284 lb-ft of torque @ 5300 rpm

Variable Valve Timing and Direct Injection

[Geeto67]

That's why they play engine sounds through the radio now

 

Why is the challenger/charger v6 a joke but the camaro isn't? The camaro has a 4cyl too! They are all a stone's throw within each other, including the 5.7L v8!

 

I dunno, you said it. Personally I don't think many enthusiasts buy v6 pony cars. some do, but not many. If I had to buy a 6 cyl car I'm buying a performance 6 cyl car from a foreign mfg. People who buy american performance/pony cars want V8s. In the old days going from a 6 to an 8 involved moving the engine mounts up and hooking up 6 wires, now it's more complicated, and while engine swaps still happen, they are getting fewer so the 6 is mostly for people who like cars but aren't car people.

 

American Hot rodding isn't built on the back of Hemi Darts, or Superbirds, or Hellcat challengers. It's built on the back of the cheapest performance car (preferably v8) that regular people can afford. New 5.7 R/Ts become used ones, and then superchargers and tunes get sold in the aftermarket because there is a demand. the top tier cars are aspirational, the working man's new hot rod is a base model R/T 5.7 or now an LT1 that he/she does things when they can.

 

Honestly, I would have been happy if chevy put a 5.7 or 6.0L in their budget car LT1 but they kept it a 6.2. Makes it harder to insure, but it's still a cheap v8 new car, and it's an LS which has a huge aftermarket.

[gillbot]

I don't disagree. They typically sell the 4 & 6 versions of these cars because people want a "pony" car but can't afford the V8 part. I think they should concentrate the effort on making the 4/6 versions more affordable to move volume. Then make it less of a step for those 4/6 drivers to later upgrade into a decent v8 car instead of optioning them all to the teeth making them unaffordable.

[BuckeyeROC]

I don't disagree. They typically sell the 4 & 6 versions of these cars because people want a "pony" car but can't afford the V8 part. I think they should concentrate the effort on making the 4/6 versions more affordable to move volume. Then make it less of a step for those 4/6 drivers to later upgrade into a decent v8 car instead of optioning them all to the teeth making them unaffordable.

 

GM isn't as interested in moving volume/market share as much as they are in pure profit right now. I wish it were different, I personally think new cars are way too expensive, but that's what they are focused on right now.

 

I'm sure all these new electric vehicles will be affordable, too. /s

[gillbot]

GM isn't as interested in moving volume/market share as much as they are in pure profit right now. I wish it were different, I personally think new cars are way too expensive, but that's what they are focused on right now.

 

I'm sure all these new electric vehicles will be affordable, too. /s

 

My wife and I were discussing this yesterday. We'd have an electric car already if it weren't for them being tater priced. On top of that, much of the tax credits are disappearing or getting harder to get. Then add that to the fact that our local area adds an extra tax onto your registration because you don't buy gas. No wonder people won't buy in to the electric car hype.

 

To me it's total BS. They jack up the price of certain things until the average person can't afford it, then when they don't take off they mandate them.

 

Huge profits are the normal concentrating point for most companies any more. They don't care about value or longevity, it's just squeezing every penny out of each person they can. It's no surprise to me that older used cars are skyrocketing in price and have huge demand.

[Geeto67]

I don't disagree. They typically sell the 4 & 6 versions of these cars because people want a "pony" car but can't afford the V8 part. I think they should concentrate the effort on making the 4/6 versions more affordable to move volume. Then make it less of a step for those 4/6 drivers to later upgrade into a decent v8 car instead of optioning them all to the teeth making them unaffordable.

 

How cheap do you want the v6 and 4cyl cars to be? some of them are more than $10K cheaper than their base v8. The step that's too large is into a base v8. It's awesome that the base v8 camaro is 455hp, but it's maybe too much and had to insure. Maybe a baby v8 camaro that is 385hp (with a bottom end built to take an aftermarket turbo). I don't really care that the S550 v6 mustang makes more hp than any v8 Sn197 mustang GT, I'm not buying one.

 

My wife and I were discussing this yesterday. We'd have an electric car already if it weren't for them being tater priced. On top of that, much of the tax credits are disappearing or getting harder to get. Then add that to the fact that our local area adds an extra tax onto your registration because you don't buy gas. No wonder people won't buy in to the electric car hype.

 

To me it's total BS. They jack up the price of certain things until the average person can't afford it, then when they don't take off they mandate them.

 

Huge profits are the normal concentrating point for most companies any more. They don't care about value or longevity, it's just squeezing every penny out of each person they can. It's no surprise to me that older used cars are skyrocketing in price and have huge demand.

 

There are non-tater priced electric cars, you just don't want them. The Nissan Leaf, Mini Cooper SE, Hyndaui Ionic, and Chevy Bolt are all low $30K, and with the incentives (before they disappeared) were mid $20K. They all had lease deals that were close to $200 a month too (and really you want to lease an ev, because the tech is moving fast). Everybody wants a Tesla P100D with Ludicrous speed that can wax a lambo until they find out it costs almost as much as a lambo and then cry "why isn't my super EV cheap".

 

EV's are where gas cars were in 1920. You can have a $495 Model T that does 35mph, or you can have a V16 Cadillac that will do 100mph but costs $4950. There isn't a lot of in-between and the tech is still developing. Eventually there needs to be the EV equivalent of a 1932 ford - a car that is affordable, approachable, and meets the enthusiast need. EVs also need the Vic Edlebrocks, Ed Iskenderans, and Wally Parks of EVs to rise up and promote the performance side of turning plain EV's into hot rods like those guys did for model T's and traditional hot rodding.

 

The company that figures out the tune to make a bolt or a leaf turn 12's is going to be the next Holley or Edlebrock of the EV aftermarket. It just hasn't happened yet. guys Like Rich Rebuilds, Jonathan Ward (Icon), and EV west are certainly showing us that like the model T, the EV is ripe for hot rodding.