chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 I think this is bull. There are brave men and women who have received decorations for heroic acts and yet these scum bags can tell everyone the have done something they haven't. To me you are lying about a federal order, which is wrong. Although it doesn't surprise me that this was in Cali. PASADENA, Calif. -- A three-year-old federal law that makes it a crime to falsely claim to have received a medal from the U.S. military is unconstitutional, an appeals court panel in California ruled Tuesday.A panel of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals sided with him in a 2-1 decision Tuesday, agreeing that the law was a violation of his free-speech rights. The majority said there's no evidence that such lies harm anybody, and there's no compelling reason for the government to ban such lies.The dissenting justice insisted that the majority refused to follow clear Supreme Court precedent that false statements of fact are not entitled to First Amendment protection.http://www.military.com/news/article/court-rules-stolen-valor-act--unconstitutional.html?ESRC=army-a.nl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Another:http://www.military.com/news/article/judge-rules-stolen-valor-act-illegal--.htmlDENVER -- A law that makes it illegal to lie about being a war hero is unconstitutional because it violates free speech, a federal judge ruled Friday as he dismissed a case against a Colorado man who claimed he received two military medals.Rick Glen Strandlof claimed he was an ex-Marine who was wounded in Iraq and received the Purple Heart and Silver Star, but the military had no record he ever served. He was charged with violating the Stolen Valor Act, which makes it a crime punishable by up to a year in jail to falsely claim to have won a military medal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Skyler Smith Can Now Legally Pretend to Be a War Herohttp://www.truecrimereport.com/2010/08/skyler_smith_can_now_legally_p.phpI tend to surf truecrimereport.com pretty often too. The commentary and stories are entertaining -- in a "Humans are depraved" sorta way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Wow, what a dirt bag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 To me, this is really no different than a civilian impersonating and government official. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagr Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 The dissenting justice insisted that the majority refused to follow clear Supreme Court precedent that false statements of fact are not entitled to First Amendment protection.So perjury would be legal as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 So perjury would be legal as well?Guess so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheech Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 So perjury would be legal as well?Perjury assumes you are under oath. Lying to some guy on the street about your chest full of MoH's isn't perjury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Although it doesn't surprise me that this was in Cali.i know cali is the land of fruits and nuts... but thats just where the court happens to be located. the 9th covers cali, washington, oregon, montana, idaho, nevada, hawaii and arizona. if you have beef in any of those states that makes it to the circuit court, you have to go to san francisco, because thats where they built the courthouse.just like ohio is in the sixth circuit, along with kentucky, michigan and tennessee. if you have a case in tennessee that makes it to the circuit, you go to cincinnati.this specific case actually originated in colorado.also, all three of the judges were appointed by george w. bush.the ninth circuit has the most overturns by the supreme court, however they also do hear the most cases of any circuit court and have the most decisions move on to the supreme court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 John, you shut your facthole!Liberals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Indeed, if the Act is constitutionalunder the analysis proffered by Judge Bybee, then therewould be no constitutional bar to criminalizing lying aboutone’s height, weight, age, or financial status on Match.com orFacebook, or falsely representing to one’s mother that onedoes not smoke, drink alcoholic beverages, is a virgin, or hasnot exceeded the speed limit while driving on the freeway.The sad fact is, most people lie about some aspects of theirlives from time to time. Perhaps, in context, many of theselies are within the government’s legitimate reach. But thegovernment cannot decide that some lies may not be toldwithout a reviewing court’s undertaking a thoughtful analysisof the constitutional concerns raised by such governmentinterference with speech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 i know cali is the land of fruits and nuts... but thats just where the court happens to be located. the 9th covers cali, washington, oregon, montana, idaho, nevada, hawaii and arizona. if you have beef in any of those states that makes it to the circuit court, you have to go to san francisco, because thats where they built the courthouse.just like ohio is in the sixth circuit, along with kentucky, michigan and tennessee. if you have a case in tennessee that makes it to the circuit, you go to cincinnati.this specific case actually originated in colorado.also, all three of the judges were appointed by george w. bush.the ninth circuit has the most overturns by the supreme court, however they also do hear the most cases of any circuit court and have the most decisions move on to the supreme court.Okay, please show me where this case originated in Colorado, and that Bush appointed 3 of these judges. And was the one who voted to uphold the law appointed by Bush? If the 9th covers cali, washington, oregon, montana, idaho, nevada, hawaii and arizona, and this originated in Colorado, why did it go to the 9th? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Indeed, if the Act is constitutionalunder the analysis proffered by Judge Bybee, then therewould be no constitutional bar to criminalizing lying aboutone’s height, weight, age, or financial status on Match.com orFacebook, or falsely representing to one’s mother that onedoes not smoke, drink alcoholic beverages, is a virgin, or hasnot exceeded the speed limit while driving on the freeway.The sad fact is, most people lie about some aspects of theirlives from time to time. Perhaps, in context, many of theselies are within the government’s legitimate reach. But thegovernment cannot decide that some lies may not be toldwithout a reviewing court’s undertaking a thoughtful analysisof the constitutional concerns raised by such governmentinterference with speech.But lying on eharmony isn't lying about government orders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 amoral does not equal illegal.at the civil level, there has to be a victim for there to be a crime.at the criminal level, society as a whole must be the victim. I think there's an argument for that claim, but I could just as easily play devil's advocate on the other side of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 But lying on eharmony isn't lying about government orders.but why should lying about government orders be criminal? How does it hurt society as a whole?we do NOT want to revert to a society where the court punishes every act that's "unwholesome" or amoral. We tried that. It resulted in people wearing a red "A" on their clothing when they cheated on their spouse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Okay, please show me where this case originated in Colorado, and that Bush appointed 3 of these judges. And was the one who voted to uphold the law appointed by Bush? If the 9th covers cali, washington, oregon, montana, idaho, nevada, hawaii and arizona, and this originated in Colorado, why did it go to the 9th?That 9th circuit has made a bunch of interesting rulings lately...The Government's New Right to Track Your Every Move With GPShttp://news.yahoo.com/s/time/08599201315000I spy with my little eye... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheech Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 but why should lying about government orders be criminal? How does it hurt society as a whole?we do NOT want to revert to a society where the court punishes every act that's "unwholesome" or amoral. We tried that. It resulted in people wearing a red "A" on their clothing when they cheated on their spouse.Indeed. Tiger Woods has 4 racks of A's, 4 with clusters, 3 with bronze stars and 5 with silver stars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Lying affects the country when the President does it, and we get into a decade long war over WMDs and fighting terror in the wrong country. then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 Lying affects the country when the President does it, and we get into a decade long war over WMDs and fighting terror in the wrong country. then Clinton lied under oath about getting a BJ. Oh but that didn't hurt anybody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InyaAzz Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 He did NOT have sexual relations with that woman!!!!!That's because she wasn't really a woman...so technically, he was telling the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disclaimer Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 (edited) Clinton lied under oath about getting a BJ. Oh but that didn't hurt anybody. I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not.If you are, then you'll have to explain how getting a BJ really hurt anything? Or, how it's the same or similar as sending our troops into battle to lay their lives on the line over a lie?@Inya -- I know right? You'd think a Prez could get much better trim than that heifer. Edited August 26, 2010 by JRMMiii Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 I guess i'm still waiting for an answer as to WHY lying about military honors should be a crime, or under what circumstances?you don't have to convince me that it's a douchey thing to do; just why it should be criminal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vw151 Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 (edited) I guess i'm still waiting for an answer as to WHY lying about military honors should be a crime, or under what circumstances?you don't have to convince me that it's a douchey thing to do; just why it should be criminal.+1how far up your ass would you like the government to be looking? Should you lie about this stuff? NoShould you go to jail for lying about it? NoShould the police and government be bothered with checking up on every Tom Dick and Harry that says they were a war vet? NoIt's a waste of time, a waste of resources and it isn't hurting anyone. If it's a job reference, the potential employer should check into it. If it's a potential relationship then the other person should be determining this stuff. The police don't have the time to check on every single person that cries wolf in the country when they are busy dealing with a lot more important stuff. Edited August 26, 2010 by vw151 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kahooli Posted August 26, 2010 Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 I guess what? I'm GOD! .... detain me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevysoldier Posted August 26, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2010 I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not.If you are, then you'll have to explain how getting a BJ really hurt anything? Or, how it's the same or similar as sending our troops into battle to lay their lives on the line over a lie?@Inya -- I know right? You'd think a Prez could get much better trim than that heifer.He was under oath. He lied. I guess i'm still waiting for an answer as to WHY lying about military honors should be a crime, or under what circumstances?you don't have to convince me that it's a douchey thing to do; just why it should be criminal.Sure, I can lie about having an award and not gain anything from it, monetary wise. But misleading the public or your fellow troopers is wrong. The military fighting man is a position that should not be tarnished by fuck sticks that think it is okay to say they got a purple heart when the didn't. It detracts from the real meaning of the awards and hinders the military. If enough people see soldiers in this kind of light, the support for them will suffer. How many people on here complain about bikers doing stupid shit and a lot of the public hates all bikers based on those select few. The military is quite different from the general public. There is a certain set of rules and honor that goes with it. Loyalty, duty, respect, selfless service, honor, integrity, personal courage. Those are the army's core values. My main point about lying is the fact that you are lying about orders, government paperwork. It's no different than impersonating a government official. There are orders making them a government official. If there really was nothing to gain from this, why do it in the first place? If they want to fake their honors, let them be tried by military tribunal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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