magley64 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Does that make you an atheist zealot?More of a secular humanist libertarian zealot, if you want to put a title on me...I think people should be free to do what they want as long as they don't infringe on the rights of others. This includes freedom from religious oppression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Seems magley could be considered an anti-Christian zealot not moderate. None of your comments are in any way temperate mild or modest towards Christianity.Rod beat me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exarch Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Its not so much that someone elses sin matters to me. I mean, my wish is that they recognize it and repent so they can be saved but its the same wish for a thief, etc. etc.The act of homosexual sex in itself is just a sin. For a Christian to accept or endorse gay marriage is like accepting stealing as an honest living or contract killing as an honest living. Its the same as us telling God that he must accept this because people do it. To steal something can be forgiven. To say that I am going to steal everyday and that my church, my religion and my God better be ok with it is quite a different thing. So while I'm not going into someones bedroom and telling them what they can or can can not do. I am not going to vote to legalize something that thumbs its nose at my religion and my God.There are also legal issues. If it legalized then could my pastor be sued for discrimination because he wont marry them? That would be forcing the government into dictating religion.If it becomes legal then there should be no obligation for a church to do something they do not believe in, but a church is not the only place to get married. Although religion preaches tolerance, yet churches are some of the most hateful and intolerant places that exist.At my grandman-in-laws church considers drinking a sin and they are not aloud to go any place that has alcohol... Yet they all go to Walmart and krogers... They sell alcohol there do they not? Yet I get badmouthed every time I drink around them.In this case I might as well be a homo, they are very intolerant people and always bad mouth everybody. Shit like that makes me glad I'm an atheist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Funny, this isn't about me, it's about civil rights...Marriage used to be a property exchange, dowry and new wife became property...Now marriage is a union between 2 consenting adults to work together in their life...Why deny 2 individuals the right to be recognized by their state as a single entity simply because of their genitals?As a Christian, Websters and I define marriage as: "The social institution under which a man and woman establish their decision to live as husband and wife by legal commitments, religious ceremonies, etc."And I will not vote to support it. Ever. You can go sin all you want to........ I'll pray for you but I will not vote to legalize your sin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 (edited) Seems magley could be considered an anti-Christian zealot not moderate. None of your comments are in any way temperate mild or modest towards Christianity.Rod beat me.I'd fight tooth and nail for your right to practice whatever religion you want...I'm not anti-christian any more than I am anti-gun. I'm against those with guns infringing on others right to life, and those with religions infringing on others right to liberty. Edited May 10, 2012 by magley64 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 And I will not vote to support it. Ever. You can go sin all you want to........ I'll pray for you but I will not vote to legalize your sin.The sinful part is already legal, the part that is illegal is just being recognized as a single entity.Nowhere in the bible does it say a man shall not marry a man, and a woman shall not marry a woman... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 If it becomes legal then there should be no obligation for a church to do something they do not believe in, but a church is not the only place to get married. Although religion preaches tolerance, yet churches are some of the most hateful and intolerant places that exist.At my grandman-in-laws church considers drinking a sin and they are not aloud to go any place that has alcohol... Yet they all go to Walmart and krogers... They sell alcohol there do they not? Yet I get badmouthed every time I drink around them.In this case I might as well be a homo, they are very intolerant people and always bad mouth everybody. Shit like that makes me glad I'm an atheist.I understand many Christians are against the use of alcohol or at least its abuse. I personally have never met a Christian that believed drinking alcohol was a sin. That is not to say that some folks dont get caught up in the word of man confusing it sometimes with the word of God. Its also not uncommon for non christians to confuse the labeling of ones actions as sin, for christian arrogance or when a christian commits a sin as hypocrisy. That is simply a lack of understanding of the christian faith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I believe it states that man shall not lay with another man or beast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 The sinful part is already legal, the part that is illegal is just being recognized as a single entity.Nowhere in the bible does it say a man shall not marry a man, and a woman shall not marry a woman...Nowhere in the law does it say that its illegal to shoot someone and then dump the body into a wood chipper but its implied that since it causes death that those are illegal actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Mags don't worry exarch has your back buddy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I'd fight tooth and nail for your right to practice whatever religion you want...I'm not anti-christian any more than I am anti-gun. I'm against those with guns infringing on others right to life, and those with religions infringing on others right to liberty.Given our conversation, thats kind of a stretch for me to believe.How do you feel about affirmative action?How do you feel about hate crime laws? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I believe it states that man shall not lay with another man or beast.In the exact same section of the old testament that says eating pig is a sin...A part that apparently is no longer valid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exarch Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 As a Christian, Websters and I define marriage as: "The social institution under which a man and woman establish their decision to live as husband and wife by legal commitments, religious ceremonies, etc."And I will not vote to support it. Ever. You can go sin all you want to........ I'll pray for you but I will not vote to legalize your sin.What does this have to do with his question? Your confusing church and state... Why does everyone have to be a Christian? Your intolerance of others just shows me how ignorant you really are. You can have your believes, but to force them upon others is unacceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Given our conversation, thats kind of a stretch for me to believe.How do you feel about affirmative action?How do you feel about hate crime laws?Not sure how it applies, but okayAffirmative action is an over reach, race needs to be neutral, not rewarded or punished.When investigating a crime, motive needs to be determined, but the crime itself should carry the sentence, not the motive.. premeditated murder of someone your own race is the same as premeditated murder of someone of a different race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 In the exact same section of the old testament that says eating pig is a sin...A part that apparently is no longer valid.I know rod tried to explain this already but the sin is still a sin. When Jesus died he paid for all sins so we wouldn't have too. Basically Jesus suffered all the consequences we would have to endure for those particular sins. Its confusing especially for a nonbeliever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 What does this have to do with his question? Your confusing church and state... Why does everyone have to be a Christian? Your intolerance of others just shows me how ignorant you really are. You can have your believes, but to force them upon others is unacceptable.Who said everyone had to be Christian? And how is he forcing anything on you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exarch Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I understand many Christians are against the use of alcohol or at least its abuse. I personally have never met a Christian that believed drinking alcohol was a sin. That is not to say that some folks dont get caught up in the word of man confusing it sometimes with the word of God. Its also not uncommon for non christians to confuse the labeling of ones actions as sin, for christian arrogance or when a christian commits a sin as hypocrisy. That is simply a lack of understanding of the christian faith.I think they are pentecostal? Not 100% sure on that though.I understand the Christian faith and I am atheist, yet some Christians don't get it I was baptized and I went to church for 16 years(not by choice, except for the youth group) I was a methodist(not by choice) but I started off as a baptist(not by choice) and I have been to about 10 other variants of chuch and all of them preach differently.I just don't understand though why people have to be intolerant of others, it just seems unhuman to me. I don't judge others(because I choose not to) so why should others judge me? If I wanted to be a homo that's my choice and my choice alone. If I want to drink that's my choice and my choice alone.Now breaking the law is one thing, but as far as doing something 100% legal who are we to.judge? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbot Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 it's so unfair that dudes doing dudes never have to worry about trying to gently drop the phrase "just the tip? please?" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exarch Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Who said everyone had to be Christian? And how is he forcing anything on you?By voting against gay marriage that is like forcing your beliefs on someone else in MY OPINION... It is just best to vote for it or not vote at all on that particular issue, I don't see how hard it is to skip one topic on a ballad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 By voting against gay marriage that is like forcing your beliefs on someone else in MY OPINION... It is just best to vote for it or not vote at all on that particular issue, I don't see how hard it is to skip one topic on a ballad.So in your theory anyone who voted for Obama in the last election imposed all their beliefs on me and I should be super pissed? Make sure you post up in November who you are voting for so I'm sure I don't force any beliefs on to you by voting for opposite guy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I just don't understand though why people have to be intolerant of others, it just seems unhuman to me.I dont agree with intolerance either. I dont think any true Christians does. But, as I said earlier, this is where non-christians get confused. They see that if someone labels something a sin, that they are intolerant and that is simply very far from the truth.Just because I choose to vote against legalizing a sin does not make me intolerant. Only those who choose to distort my motives can so easily call my actions intolerant.Voting to keep DDT illegal does not make me intolerant of farmers.Voting pro-life does not make me intolerant of women.Voting pro-business does not make me intolerant of the poor.Voting pro=marriage does not make me intolerant of homosexuals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted May 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I know rod tried to explain this already but the sin is still a sin. When Jesus died he paid for all sins so we wouldn't have too. Basically Jesus suffered all the consequences we would have to endure for those particular sins. Its confusing especially for a nonbeliever.If that is the case, eating pork is still a sin.... how hard is that to grasp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Not sure how it applies, but okayAffirmative action is an over reach, race needs to be neutral, not rewarded or punished.When investigating a crime, motive needs to be determined, but the crime itself should carry the sentence, not the motive.. premeditated murder of someone your own race is the same as premeditated murder of someone of a different race.Good to hear that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod38um Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 If that is the case, eating pork is still a sin.... how hard is that to grasp?As I said, its covered under Adultery (10 commandments) Its defined as any type of sexual activity between people that is not sanctified by marriage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawi kid Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 If that is the case, eating pork is still a sin.... how hard is that to grasp?Not hard to grasp at all. I don't think anybody argued the fact that the old testament stated that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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