New Illegal Immigrant Policy

[ChiefScooter]

No one has any comments on this? Arizona sure is mad...

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-jan-brewer-obama-immigration-20120615,0,18431.story

Obama’s executive order stops the deportation of some illegal immigrants younger than 30. Effective immediately, those who can prove they arrived before age 16 and have gone through school or the military will be able to apply for work permits, provided they have no criminal history and do not pose a security threat, the Homeland Security Department announced.

Edit: I don't understand the term "illegal immigrant". Is it illegal, or not? Maybe it should be reworded or something. Unauthorized Foreigner maybe? I dunno...

Edited June 16, 2012 by ChiefScooter
Adding more thoughts

[gen3flygirl]

Fucking bullshit. One more reason to get his ass out of office

[crb]

Yes we can! Forward! Yes we can! Forward! Yes we can! Forward!

[ReconRat]

Not sure, but it used to be that non-citizens could serve in the US military if accepted, and gain citizenship for doing so. I've known a few people to do this. So that part is probably already in existence.

The other part, a bulk carte blanc, probably not a good idea in general. Would you include a criminal? Some one convicted of a crime? Apparently so.

The entire concept of "I'm going to the United States and once I'm there they can't kick me out" is a load of crap. Try that in any other country and see how long you get to stay. They will hunt you down and have no problem doing so.

[cg2112]

Obama should be impeached for this. Seriously.

The fact that he won't deport young adults who were brought here by no choice of their own, are educated, have lived here most of their lives, are functioning, contributing members are our society just makes me sick.

He should be taking these people, most of whom have no ties to any country other than the United States, and drop them in the middle of the desert in Mexico. That seems like a fitting punishment for the crime of sitting in a stroller while one's parents crossed the border.

[ReconRat]

Quick test, if they went to a USA school, they speak and learn English. It's required by federal law. If they speak anything else, they are temporary in one way or another. Young ones this is, grandma and grandpa don't count.

edit: btw, I've seen families partake in a simple crime. And all were prosecuted for that crime. Age doesn't nullify actions, except for the very youngest without the knowledge of the crime. Those are separated for their own protection. That's what we do to ourselves, but not apparently to total strangers that show up with no background or history of having been here before.

Edited July 1, 2012 by ReconRat

[max power]

Fucking bullshit. One more reason to get his ass out of office

This.

[jblosser]

Obama should be impeached for this. Seriously.

The fact that he won't deport young adults who were brought here by no choice of their own, are educated, have lived here most of their lives, are functioning, contributing members are our society just makes me sick.

He should be taking these people, most of whom have no ties to any country other than the United States, and drop them in the middle of the desert in Mexico. That seems like a fitting punishment for the crime of sitting in a stroller while one's parents crossed the border.

Doesn't obviate the fact they're here illegally.

Let them serve in the military or peace corps for four years to offset some of the 18 years (to use your stroller example) of assistance they've received from the United States citizens via our lax enforcement of existing laws.

[cg2112]

Doesn't obviate the fact they're here illegally.

Let them serve in the military or peace corps for four years to offset some of the 18 years (to use your stroller example) of assistance they've received from the United States citizens via our lax enforcement of existing laws.

Our military is voluntary, and should remain that way for all resident.

Additionally, these people already pay taxes. While many (maybe most) do not pay income taxes (though some do), they are paying many local and state taxes, and contributing to the economy.

This initiative doesn't allow Mexicans to just cross the border illegally to be granted automatic citizenship. If anything, it's a way to allow people who are already functioning members of society to stay here and continue to contribute. Deadbeats, violent criminals, the unemployed and uneducated, etc, aren't eligible. This applies only to a particular subject of illegal immigrants who did not choose to enter this country, but who have become productive members of our society in spite of this.

As far as the idea that English must be learned - not only would such a requirement never make it through Congress, I doubt that it would be Constitutional. As far as I know, the federal government does not have the authority to dictate which language residents must speak. A Constitutional amendment must be passed in order to do this, and though such an amendment is proposed by nearly every session of Congress, it has never even come close to passing.

[crb]

Wait congress is restricted by the constitution? Can't we just mandate English under the "general welfare" clause? Or can't we tax people who choose to not learn English?

[ReconRat]

English in schools for education has been a federal law for what, a hundred years? More? I forget the name of the Congressional act passed, but I'll try to look it up later. And yes, it was because schools in migrant neighborhoods were deciding to teach the language of the motherland. And yes, it had to be enforced. Without it, we'd be speaking multiple languages. Errrr, worse than what we have now.

edit: btw, my neighborhood is full of immigrants, legal and not legal. And I'd take some of them over natural citizens any day. You never know.

[cg2112]

English in schools for education has been a federal law for what, a hundred years? More? I forget the name of the Congressional act passed, but I'll try to look it up later. And yes, it was because schools in migrant neighborhoods were deciding to teach the language of the motherland. And yes, it had to be enforced. Without it, we'd be speaking multiple languages. Errrr, worse than what we have now.

edit: btw, my neighborhood is full of immigrants, legal and not legal. And I'd take some of them over natural citizens any day. You never know.

I don't know that this is the case. I know of no federal law requiring English in school. The Supreme Court, however, has ruled that a student cannot be denied an education because he or she cannot speak English.

In fact, mandating understanding of English in order to obtain an eduction is a violation of the Civil Rights Act.

Wait congress is restricted by the constitution? Can't we just mandate English under the "general welfare" clause? Or can't we tax people who choose to not learn English?

There is a difference between the actual general welfare of the nation (for instance, maintaining a healthy citizenry) and being annoyed because in the real world you have to encounter people who don't speak the language that you want them to in the way that you want them to.

[crb]

There is a difference between the actual general welfare of the nation (for instance, maintaining a healthy citizenry) and being annoyed because in the real world you have to encounter people who don't speak the language that you want them to in the way that you want them to.

[crb]

There is a difference between the actual general welfare of the nation (for instance, maintaining a healthy citizenry) and being annoyed because in the real world you have to encounter people who don't speak the language that you want them to in the way that you want them to.

So the "general welfare" clause only means what YOU say it means?

Okay how about this:

Path to U.S. Citizenship

This page describes the most common path to U.S. citizenship, which allows a green card holder (permanent resident) of at least 5 years to apply for naturalization. Other paths include:

Green card holders married to U.S. citizens

Green card holders in the military and their family

Citizenship through parents

Eligibility Requirements

If you are a green card holder of at least 5 years, you must meet the following requirements in order to apply for naturalization:

Be 18 or older

Be a green card holder for at least 5 years immediately preceding the date of filing the Form N-400, Application for Naturalization

Have lived within the state, or USCIS district with jurisdiction over the applicant’s place of residence, for at least 3 months prior to the date of filing the application

Have continuous residence in the United States as a green card holder for at least 5 years immediately preceding the date of the filing the application

Be physically present in the United States for at least 30 months out of the 5 years immediately preceding the date of filing the application

Reside continuously within the United States from the date of application for naturalization up to the time of naturalization

Be able to read, write, and speak English and have knowledge and an understanding of U.S. history and government (civics).

Be a person of good moral character, attached to the principles of the Constitution of the United States, and well disposed to the good order and happiness of the United States during all relevant periods under the law

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=86bd6811264a3210VgnVCM100000b92ca60aRCRD&vgnextchannel=86bd6811264a3210VgnVCM100000b92ca60aRCRD

[magley64]

Obama should be impeached for this. Seriously.

The fact that he won't deport young adults who were brought here by no choice of their own, are educated, have lived here most of their lives, are functioning, contributing members are our society just makes me sick.

He should be taking these people, most of whom have no ties to any country other than the United States, and drop them in the middle of the desert in Mexico. That seems like a fitting punishment for the crime of sitting in a stroller while one's parents crossed the border.

REP! but I don't think you go far enough, they have broken our laws, and they don't deserve the same rights as american citizens, they should be shot in the head, and dumped on the mexican border (if they appear to have come from mexico) if they havee come from china, we should load their dead carcases into an icbm and fire them at the great wall....

that'll teach em

[crb]

REP! but I don't think you go far enough, they have broken our laws, and they don't deserve the same rights as american citizens, they should be shot in the head, and dumped on the mexican border (if they appear to have come from mexico) if they havee come from china, we should load their dead carcases into an icbm and fire them at the great wall....

that'll teach em

Trollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllinnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggg!

[cg2112]

So the "general welfare" clause only means what YOU say it means?

What I think it means?

No, not at all.

Common sense, though, tells me that making sure some rednecks aren't irritated because the guy selling them rolling papers doesn't speak English is not providing for the general welfare of the United States.

[crb]

What I think it means?

No, not at all.

Common sense, though, tells me that making sure some rednecks aren't irritated because the guy selling them rolling papers doesn't speak English is not providing for the general welfare of the United States.

Sure glad the "general welfare" clause isn't explained in the Constitution!

[ReconRat]

I don't know that this is the case. I know of no federal law requiring English in school. The Supreme Court, however, has ruled that a student cannot be denied an education because he or she cannot speak English.

In fact, mandating understanding of English in order to obtain an eduction is a violation of the Civil Rights Act...

I think you are correct. Mostly it's the more recent Bilingual Education Act of 1968 that leads the way. But it still requires English language.

I also noticed that the history being taught now, on some subjects, isn't the history that was taught last century. Yes, history is revisionist. It changes all the time. I cannot yet find that law regarding english required to be taught, and I think it's because it was a New York City law, where the problem was intense. I notice several states have enacted English only laws, only to be overturned.

Edited July 2, 2012 by ReconRat

[max power]

REP! but I don't think you go far enough, they have broken our laws, and they don't deserve the same rights as american citizens, they should be shot in the head, and dumped on the mexican border (if they appear to have come from mexico) if they havee come from china, we should load their dead carcases into an icbm and fire them at the great wall....

that'll teach em

America! FUCK YEAH!

[ReconRat]

Ok, here's the deal. Best of both worlds. Keep the best of the illegal entries into the US. We need them and want them. Send the rest back for cause. Mostly never should have come in or been here in the first place.

At the same time, eliminate some of the unproductive US citizens that were already here. Get rid of the worst. We don't need them or want them. Send them away to wherever, just not here.

This is what we're asking for, right? A productive society?

Everybody's happy that way, except for activists and chronic malcontents. (And some of those that were tossed out.) Oh, and lawyers, but they're not necessarily unhappy, they are just busy arguing the case.

And the chronic malcontents? How about they just go too. Away and gone.

Citizenship isn't necessarily free, for anyone. It takes a serious screw-up for a citizen to get deported currently. Maybe we should make it a little easier for everyone to depart.

Just some worthless thoughts on my part... It would make a good novel. I should start writing more.

[Disclaimer]

This is how you get tough on illegals... shoot them from a helicopter.

http://jalopnik.com/5955885/texas-state-trooper-kills-two-trying-to-disable-truck-by-shooting-at-it-from-a-helicopter

[Rod38um]

Fucking bullshit. One more reason to get his ass out of office

Best Post of the thread!

[cg2112]

Best Post of the thread!

Agreed.

If you don't want to deport people who were brought here through no will of their own, have been in the United States their whole lives, who have been educated here, work here, pay taxes here, and have virtually no ties to any other country, and have no other country to call home, then you have no business being the President.