chevysoldier

You seem to have this perception that when you open carry you have established some sort of inpenetrible shield around that protects you from all scenarios.

You seem to have this perception that when people open carry, they have this perception that they have established some sort of inpenetrible shield around that protects them from all scenarios.

I don't know what the definition of "common criminal" is, much less what this person is or isn't thinking, or if they are thinking at all.... that's a big reason they are criminals.

You seem to have this perception that when you open carry you have established some sort of inpenetrible shield around that protects you from all scenarios. I think that at the least you have made your self conspicuous, which creates a greater risk. I guarantee that if you and I were walking side by side through Walmart, you openly carrying and me concealed that nobody is going to notice me. And guess what, I've got a gun too and I have just as much capability of protecting myself as you.

The cons to open carry far outweigh the real and practical benefits, especially when considering that you can avoid almost all the cons by carrying concealed.

You base your opinions of this on what experience?

No. I think it is unecessary for a civilian to OC, and I do not crave attention.

So you have to experience whatsoever but you assume things based on what? That you think that's what OC'ers do?

I've open carried a few times. Nothing spectacular happened' date=' except once. An incident at the local Giant Eagle. A ManagerInCharge practically came unpinned on me over my S&W being outside my t-shirt. Started saying I was scaring customers, and whatnot. I don't know if I was, but I don't think anyone really saw the weapon but him. I apologized for the clamor and offered to conceal it for the rest of the shopping. He told me to take it outside and not to come back into his store with a gun ever again. So, I left. I called the corporate office to see if this was their policy, as I'd never seen a sign on any Giant Eagle stores, before. They said it wasn't, and that the employee was completely out of line and they apologized about a thousand times. Eh.. no big deal, I guess. Private property, and whatnot.

Anyway.. when I decided to start carrying openly, I did it mostly as a social experiment. I wanted to see first hand what kind of reactions I'd get, if any at all. I can say that the Giant Eagle incident was the only time I ever had a negative encounter. Most times, nobody even noticed. The few times I OC'd my Colt 1911, I got a few compliments.

Open carry is a mixed bag, I guess. I support it. I appreciate seeing people do it. I wish more folks would do it. I appreciate businesses that support it, but don't boycott any that don't.

I've come to the conclusion that self-defense is more important to me than making a statement. Now, my concealment is tight enough that my own wife has a hard time telling when I'm packing heat. This is especially useful in states like NY, MA, PA, GA, NH and the likes, where I frequently travel to/from/through.

My right to self-defense isn't up for negotiation. However, I have no intentions on advertising my carry status to anyone. They can all just presume I'm carrying 100% of the time. That's just fine by me.

My biggest issue with conceal vs open is the regulation involved. That was actually an issue I had when I decided to take my CHL course. I am still miffed that I had to spend money to exercise my right to self-defense.[/quote']

This I respect. You have first hand knowledge and carry in a way that you like and what works for you. You're not just assuming something....

Totally forgot there are people that refuse to get a CHL so they OC. Not looking for a reaction, just refuse to go through the gov't hoops.

Yes. While I was a Marine, I frequently open carried in the line of duty.

Not the same thing. Have you open carried as a civilian?

Have you ever owned and operated a business with a facility frequented by customers? If no, I'm afraid you are not well informed on the subject.

Have you ever open carried?

Yep, although occasionaly I have a kid on my right side. I usually carry a backup in my left pocket. I usually have a knife or two on me also in case I need to open a box!

My 5 y/o daughter knows to only hold my left hand.

I open carry in a quality retention holster thumbreak or blackhawk.

Blackhawk CQC Level II here, and trained in positive control and retention techniques. I don't carry anything in my right hand either.

Why is he going to try to steal your wife's jewelry when he could steal your gun instead?

You don't think your gun is something a criminal wants? Your making a lot of assumptions when you think that a criminal is going to avoid you just because you've got a gun on your hip. You don't have 360 degrees of vision, something tells me that if a criminal wants your gun he's going to have a go and take it. If you didn't have it open and visible they'd never know you had one. Good luck.

I know from experience, most criminals want an easy score. They don't want to risk their life if they can get what they want from someone they perceive as weaker. Yes, there will be those on drugs or desperate enough or dumb enough that want a carriers gun. And they may try to take it, but most will stay away.

I want as many people as possible to spend as much money as possible at my facility. That is the bottom line for most if not all businesses.

As mentioned above, I would be willing to risk losing your business. Since, .00001% of people ever OC, I would be willing to risk losing all OC as customers. That is barely a rounding error on a cash flow statement.

No, I don't post no OC, and here is why:

1) I wouldn't want to risk pissing off CCW advocates, since there are a lot of them. Even though most CCW won't ever OC, they would probably only see a gun in a red circle on the sign and not read the rest.

2) I wouldn't want to risk pissing off gun owners, since many people own guns.

3) I wouldn't want my entire customer base to see a sign and wonder if there were problems with people displaying guns at my facility.

As a reference, Fin Feather and Fur (Cleveland) has a sign stating that all guns must be checked at the door, the only exception is CCW. Meaning that even in a big gun shop full of gun loving customers, they don't want OC.

IIRC correctly the signs usually state something to the effect of "this does not apply to concealed carry permit owners and those carrying legally."

YES.

You found one incident. There are exceptions to every rule. Most criminals don't want resistance. They pick easy targets.

Open carry deters armed robbery in Kennesaw

Vances, Buckeye, Cabelas, OVTC all the same as well. Conceal or don't carry.

If I owned a business it would be the same too, Conceal or don't carry.

Wrong. I've OC'd in Buckeye and Vances. No issues. I've OC'ed in Gander, although they were misinformed on the laws and have had no issues after that.

Shinkos, and have some money left over for the hookers & blow.

I put a Shinko rear on my bike. about 500 miles on it now. I wear my tire to cords too. Lol

Seriously? Did you even read the bolded part? Are you an expert in the field of aerospace like you are in IT?

He was correct, if it happened in Australia if course.

Did everyone not say MSF was necessary? apparently it is, but fuck gun safety

I do have my MSF scheduled, because I actually care about my safety and the safety of those around me...

Idiots will be idiots, but knowledge is power

Necessary is not the same as required . I think helmets are necessary, I do not think they should be required.

Well go to CIF and get your extra eyes. Geeez.

Yea, a crappy situation. I try to never allow unknowns to get within a 10ft bubble before facing and addressing them.

Yes, the criminal would choose me over you when you are Open Carrying and I am concealed. That also means they won't always draw initially as well and just bank on intimidation.

But this could go on and on with hypothetical. Both methods have their ups and downs and each will choose what works best for them. (But my way is still better. )

Lol CIF, I'll get right on that.

And yes we could go back and forth but you opinion is wrong. With all due respect.

All good points. However if the criminal draws before you notice and react, your SA is lacking. Course this is coming from someone that views the world as a battlefield.

I'm well aware of my surroundings. No I can't see everything all the time but I try.

If he draws before I can react and draw my next choice is to attempt to disarm him. But if a criminal was going to choose between me and you, do you think he'd try to out gun me or hold you at gun point because you present no visual threat?

All are valid points for benefits of open carry.

At the same time, a criminal immediately knows you are armed, and they need to disarm or kill you first. You just make yourself a target. And the masses are stupid and easily scared.

By concealing didn't you just make yourself an easy target? If he draws on you and says give me your wife's jewelry, think you can draw and fire before he fires? Most criminals want an easy score, resistance scares them away. Granted there are those that just want to kill everyone.

I will admit both have pros and cons but I truly think what most perceive as cons with OC. Really aren't. Most that are against OC have never had any first hand experience with it.

I'm not saying OC is for everyone or that you have to. To each their own.

Yes, people can have a CCW (gun) without having a CHL (permit)

. I'll give you this... I forgot saying that to the ass that got smart,

Oh, that being said, there is a time and place for me to conceal.

What is so different from the two, besides the obvious? I'm just curious. I've never considered it because it's not usually seen too much in Akron.

I find it more comfortable, easier to draw, I believe it does work as a deterrent rather than making me a first target. Most criminals want an easy job, first sign of resistance will make them reconsider. And it helps people get over the stigma that guns are bad. Criminals hide their guns, he's not going to walk with it in plain view.

What point, carrying?

Openly.

I personally like the benefits of open carrying.

From what I heard is they showed up yesterday. I made a statement prior to the party, if I was actually gonna call I would have had them show up at the party. These forums are public you know. So lesson learned for EVERYONE! Next time I try to point something out that is illegal I will send a pm so nobody else can see. However, I will not take the blame for someone breaking the law and getting popped for it. I bet nothing even happened since they didn't catch him selling food. Prolly just told him what the laws are and left.

His thread about the HD was posted May 5th. And yes, these forums are public so when you say something and then say you didn't say it, it rubs people the wrong way.

My only point was you said you never said youd call. But you did. And then you said they didn't show up but he said they did. You can understand why id be confused.

And now by the OP, a couple more people have been educated on the law.

Have you read this?

lol

I was gonna drop it but yes. Hence why I wad confused when stated in this thread she never said shed call but in the AMA thread she did.

But did one show up at their party? NO. I was making a point.

Don't get defensive.