Moto-Brian

It's worth it for the general publis if you want to see the new bikes before they land in showrooms. Even at the recent IMS shows (They've completed two already) haven't had all th enew bikes yet. As they progress, they get them in. By Cleveland, they should have them all which is cool.

The H2 is going to be a bad choice and more of a Busa type bike. At 525lbs and just a click over 200 hp, it isn't a sportbike like the R1, 1299, BMW, ZX10, etc... And as for the $30k, they have the SP... They aren't going to get anywhere close with the tech found on the RCV. Won't happen.

The thing is, Honda has ALWAYS been in the middle. They never stick their necks out. Over the years, there hasn't been a sportbike that they have set the world on fire with and was the go to choice. Back when they did RCs and the like, they were cool and edgey. Now? Blah. Even the SP fell n it's face when compared to other bikes. Honda needs to drop their design and engineer teams and snag some from the other brands. I think the overall issue is that they are so big, they have lost their way a tad. But, being vanilla and in the middle probably sells to a larger group. We want harder core sportbikes from them, but I think we are also a minority when looking at bikers in general...

They are at 15k and 18k now... Even the 1199 and 899...

Your shit weighs 35lbs?? What are you eating?

This is exactly what my thoughts are. I think it is one of the top choices to look at for sure.

What experience and what years of Ducatis are you referring to? The issue is that the general public think the bikes are high maintenance. They are not. The intervals are on par with any Japanese bike out there these days. Cost of ownership is also lower than before. It's relative. Components may cost more, but they are better built. You don't have DLC coated internal engine parts on the Japanese bikes. The cranks are not as well made, etc. It's relative - not because of the name...

I'd drop the H2 and RSV4. H2 is going to be back marker material this time around. The 1299/Panigale R and the R1/R1 M are the choices. The R1 still has a lot of heft. I wanna see it in person with hopes it is more narrow and compact. But that weight is a killer. I am thinking it is a lot in the wheels and that exhaust. But at 439, it isn't really good. And the M I heard is actually heavier even though it has CF body panels. Not sure how that worked. I think that the R1 will be the bike that gets the best results. The thing that scares me is that Yamaha is well known for handling. So, if it is slightly heavier, but handles like on rails, that can be overlooked... I'd be those two for sure. I am a little biased of course, but both are pretty solid.

Sales say otherwise... As for ability, most can't handle the current gen 600s. Current prices on 600s are near $13k so, I don't think once you add up the components, the prices are outrageous. The new R1 M version is going to pass $22k...

That's the price for all three models...

This. The power to weight is amazing and will make the H2 more Busa like than anything. But again... The H2 is attracting attention to the open class and I think that is a good thing. And it looks pretty cool. But, back to the Panigale. The prices are as follows: 1199 Standard: $19,295 1199S: $24,995 Panigale R: $33,995

Hob, you will have to ride this thing and give us what you think has improved. A LOAD of new updates and additions. The bank angle sensor, wheelie control, etc. It is all going to add up to a pretty damn nice machine. As for the comments on more stuff to go wrong, what needs to be understood is that when you have more power, better handling and everything, you need more computers and better data to make it useable. This thing is very advanced and should prove to be a really great machine. I think the new BMW will have some lookers also. I think that and this MTS are bikes that are going to be more popular as most riders aren't using the Adventure bikes for what they were intended and then add in the weight and they are just porkly.

When you drop the oil from the first 500 mile or 600 mile service, it looks like it has fine particles of metal in it. Even the plug that is magnetic has a bunch of crud on it. That's the tranny meshing and getting broke in of sorts. Think about this - it is new and unused when assembled. It then is meshing together with other gears of the same metal. They will mesh together and when done, will leave traces of metal wear in the oil and what you see when changing for the first time. Now if it looks like gold and is well after the first service, that's probably a rod bearing or similar. Ask me how I know that one. On the Ducati, what we found was that cold start was HARD on the bike. That initial startup when the motor is cold and hasn't been run since the day prior or whenever. We looked at the viscosity we were using and after the motor was opened after the first race season, we determined a different weight was needed. However, you do not typically have the luxury of tearing a motor down and inspecting the rods, journals, etc. So, you need to really look at the viscosity listed in the manual. If racing, understand the advantages or potential disadvantages of oil viscosity. We are pretty lucky with Ducati in that they provide a race set of information and wear item checklist for racing only.

Aprilia has a history of claimed hp that turns out to be well off. My point was they "claim" 201, but we will see. For example, typical to be 20+ hp down from claims. This is computed backwards from the rear wheel, also... Point was that if the Priller has 180 at the ground, I will start shittin gold...

No specs on the R model yet. But the street version is 525lbs!!!!!!!!!!!!! Even at claimed 300 hp, that's a little sketchy. If it is at 300 hp, it will be at the same power to weight as the new Panigale R... Just sayin... It's awesome tech. And even more, it is awesome that so many people are looking at open bikes. But the R1 and Panigale R are the ones to really be looking at. The ZX10 will still be solid as well. BMW is meh and the Aprilia will be 200 hp when I shit gold...

Break-in is more important to mesh the transmission rather than the rings. As Tpoppa stated, it is less important these days...

Belly pans are not needed for any track day org... Just race orgs...

I believe that they are the prototypes being used around the country and were used for display at the IMS show during that time. The Cycle World dyno run for sound (They were not allowed to post or record hp numbers) was also at the same time and was declared a prototype as well. I suspect that they will get Jay low VIN units though. It's great publicity for them. And our sport...

210 HP for the street and a "claimed" 300 for the track version. But, no stats on the weight of the race that I've found, but the street version is FIVE HUNDRED AND TWENTY FIVE POUNDS!!!! Now, if the track version is at the same weight (Shouldn't be due to CF tidbits, etc.), it has the same power to weight as the Panigale R will have. But the street version is the same concept as a Busa or ZX14 type deal. More hp and slightly less weight... It is very bad in terms of that... Not sportbike type numbers. Great concept and if cash were liquid, I would own one. But it is a straight line type bike while the track version is more performance, it still isn't something that is going to be razor sharp like other bikes available. All I know is this is the year for open bikes and that's really cool in my book! Aprilia, Kaw, Yamaha, Ducati, BMW... All coming in with changes and big numbers. Good stuff!!!

They won't make a sub $30k that will remotely have pneumatic valves. The frame won't be the same, forks, etc., etc.... Why tease the public with a model that is essentially never going to materialize? The only reason they did it was because they've wanting to attract SOME attention. Instead, they go and slap on Repsol graphics on the CBR1000. I personally think they will update or increase performance on the SP. It makes more sense. The tech in the RCV is to do something like Ducati did and that's really it. It won't ever hit sub $30k... Now, looking at the SP, that is where the dollar figure will land and what you will see in terms of specs. This is an attempt to still pull attention and revive the idea that Honda is going to make a GP bike for the street that has been "in the wings" for years. And to top it off, they aren't going to be able to produce a minimum 1000 units for the cost of that tech shown. Won't happen.

Not gonna make showrooms. Cool concept and at over $100k, it is probably worth it. But what they need to be doing to keep up with the Joneses isn't happening...

As for marketing, it does help to be showcasing the newest Ducati we have. But, I would be satisfied with the same 1199 had the bike been just BNGs. I wouldn't be able to pull this off had I not got what I asked for my racebike. I probably sold it lower than I could have got, but at the end of the day it was a solid deal and was a lot easier to sell at this stage than to have waited until everyone got details on this thing. Make no mistake that I still feel that getting my asking price would have happened even after the release of info, but she was two years old going on three. It's harder and harder to maintain any margins on a racebike the older she gets. I got a ton of use out of her and the balance of what I owed and what I made makes this bike actually cheaper. So it is a move forward at a lower expense point. There's a lot of cool tech in this thing and I believe that every dealer will have at least one for the floor. So, come out and check her out when she lands in April.

The way racing works is that tenths of a second are a success. I was getting better/faster on the 1199. Will there be a difference? 205 hp at the crank is 10 more than the previous R model. That bike was about 5 more than the Standard/S. When built, the 1199 I had was about 4 down on the same build R model. So, similar... The Panigale R in this case should maintain that 14-15hp edge. In racing, getting 10-15 HP is a BIIIIIG dealio. The weight is less, but we shave a ton of stuff anyways. Will it be faster? Who knows. I may not be capable of going faster and maybe even go slower at the start with a bit of a learning curve. If I try and justify the expense, I wouldn't race. But to justify it against the old model? Hell yes. That gain and the fact that it will have a lot of the things I did to the bike I had, it will be a starting point that is better than what I even ended with, I say it is totally justified. This is going to literally be a racebike with signals. Honest...

It's racing. Racing is a business and there are team orders in certain instances. Sykes should have been closer instead of his teammate having to slow so much. Baz is going somewhere else anyways so, it was a moot point. But the bottom line is that you are a team. Winning championship means more money. Means more exposure and more everything. If a rider is not in the fight for the championship and ahead of his teamate where the points can be a difference, he will get asked to fall back, block, etc. It's a team sport in that regard...

The bike will have access to Traction Control, Wheelie Control via the handlebar like the SL currently has. The bike also features qucik shift up AND down for race use. Also has a bank angle or lean angle sensor for ABS. Meaning, it will now be a lot more sensitive to the angle of the bike and brake pressure. Think of it this way - for WSBK, we need this to be on the bike prior to race trim. It cannot be added per rules. So, Honda has their SP, Yamaha their "M" version and we have the R. BMW will have another HP4 (BMW couldn't squeeze an additional HP to get to 200hp). Not sure what Kaw or Suzuki will do if anything...