California police break in home and tase

[grapesmuggler27]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VS6PnVMdViQ

And go.....

[conn-e-rot]

Don't tase me bro

[bowdog]

Why not just open the door and show the police that what they were originally called to the home for is un based?

I love the people like this that want to "catch" the police doing something wrong, yet complain when a real problem occurs that they did not respond fast enough.

[grapesmuggler27]

Why not just open the door and show the police that what they were originally called to the home for is un based?

I love the people like this that want to "catch" the police doing something wrong, yet complain when a real problem occurs that they did not respond fast enough.

I will play devils advocate here.

Why should he have to let them in his house? There got a tip of possible domestic violence. A tip does not warrent the police to kick in your door. Just like if someone called and said I'm selling drugs they need evidence and a warrant to come kick my door in.

[BMMW]

Those officers took the chance of getting shot. That's why they had their tazers out. Just in case.

I'm guessing they knew they were intruding.

All in the premise that there was a potentially violent situation that had occurred or could occur.

[grapesmuggler27]

Now I will say we do not know what happened before the camera came on. I'm assuming they didn't hear anything or at that point they had PC to go in and not be standing around

[chevysoldier]

Don't always trust video, you're only getting part of the story.

[Scruit]

Why were they there? On a report of domestic violence?

As far as I'm concerned, a report of someone being the victim of violence inside the house is probable cause to enter the house to ensure that all occupants are safe, account for, and get any medical attention they may need. The risk of them not going inside is the attacker may be hiding the victim, or be coercing the victim into pretending to not be a victim, and hiding behind the the "not a police state" thing.

If they have good documentary evidence of the tip that was called in then I'm ok with this policy.

Our rights are not absolute - not when they collide with other people's rights. If the police honestly believe someone inside the house has been assaulted then they have a duty to locate that victim and ensure they are safe.

[Bitani]

Just seems like a dude that wants to try and hide behind the law like it's a brick wall. (Kind of like all of the people that refuse to show officers their identification when they're open-carrying guns.)

Just because a piece of paper says "Thou shalt not kick my door in without a warrant" doesn't mean that it's not better for you to just open the door to police and show them that nothing's actually happening. When it comes to people's lives, I couldn't give a shit less what laws are in play. Figure out if somebody's dangerous by whatever means (within reason, ofc) before something that might happen.

This is what is wrong with this country. "OH WELL IT SAYS SO IN THIS LAW RIGHT HERE"

Edited May 15, 2013 by Bitani

[Scruit]

I wish people would consider the alternative. What if the police allowed themselves to be turned away and the domestic assault victim is assaulted and/or killed soon after that. Those same people ranting about "not martial law" would be ranting about the police failing to protect the victim.

There's folks out there that simply will never utter a good word about a cop. At which point their opinion becomes throwaway. People should approach each situation with an open mind.

[grapesmuggler27]

Why were they there? On a report of domestic violence?

As far as I'm concerned, a report of someone being the victim of violence inside the house is probable cause to enter the house to ensure that all occupants are safe, account for, and get any medical attention they may need. The risk of them not going inside is the attacker may be hiding the victim, or be coercing the victim into pretending to not be a victim, and hiding behind the the "not a police state" thing.

If they have good documentary evidence of the tip that was called in then I'm ok with this policy.

Our rights are not absolute - not when they collide with other people's rights. If the police honestly believe someone inside the house has been assaulted then they have a duty to locate that victim and ensure they are safe.

I 100% agree. But lets play a quick game (we don't know the whole story here) you and your wife are sitting at home your neighbor is mad at you for whatever reason. He calls the police and says your beating your wife. Cops show up wifes says there's nothing going on and they ask to come in, you tell them no and they kick in your door.

I'm trying to be objective here and see both sides. This one is a touchy one. The problem I have is tazering the wife which you can clearly see in the video has her hands up when they come kicking through the door

[Scruit]

I 100% agree. But lets play a quick game (we don't know the whole story here) you and your wife are sitting at home your neighbor is mad at you for whatever reason. He calls the police and says your beating your wife. Cops show up wifes says there's nothing going on and they ask to come in, you tell them no and they kick in your door.

I'm trying to be objective here and see both sides. This one is a touchy one. The problem I have is tazering the wife which you can clearly see in the video has her hands up when they come kicking through the door

In my case I wouldn't deny the police entry - at the very least I'd have my wife come to the door and speak with them. I wouldn't make it into a confrontation. People say "if you don't exercise your rights then you lose them." Well, that's not an absolute - I would not open-carry into a kid's birthday party. I choose to not exercise my statutory and 2nd amendment rights at that moment because the totality of the circumstances favor not carrying. Similarly, I would invite the cops in to talk with my wife and I because common sense tells me that the whole event will be over in about 2 minutes and they'll be gone, whereas they won't go away if I refuse them. That does not mean that I must always allow them in. I can verbally refuse but if they force entry then I'm going to comply, and sour of the RS/PC later. Any evidence they gather is invalid if the entry was illegal.

Every civil rights attorney will tell you that if you are being arrested/searched and you don't think you should be, don't resist. The courts are there to redress any grievances.

WRT The wife's hands up... They were being told to get on the ground - not to put their hands up. She didn't get on the ground, so they put her on the ground. If it turns out that they were acting in bad faith them they will be punished later. Refusing to comply with the officers while they are securing the scene is a mistake, they will establish control, then sort it out later. The alternative is a prolonged mexican standoff, which is unreasonable.

If it turns out the information they acted on was not sufficient probable cause to enter the house then that will be resolved in the coming weeks/months.

Edited May 15, 2013 by Scruit

[grapesmuggler27]

In my case I wouldn't deny the police entry - at the very least I'd have my wife come to the door and speak with them. I wouldn't make it into a confrontation. People say "if you don't exercise your rights then you lose them." Well, that's not an absolute - I would not open-carry into a kid's birthday party. I choose to not exercise my statutory and 2nd amendment rights at that moment because the totality of the circumstances favor not carrying. Similarly, I would invite the cops in to talk with my wife and I because common sense tells me that the whole event will be over in about 2 minutes and they'll be gone, whereas they won't go away if I refuse them. That does not mean that I must always allow them in. I can verbally refuse but if they force entry then I'm going to comply, and sour of the RS/PC later. Any evidence they gather is invalid if the entry was illegal.

Every civil rights attorney will tell you that if you are being arrested/searched and you don't think you should be, don't resist. The courts are there to redress any grievances.

WRT The wife's hands up... They were being told to get on the ground - not to put their hands up. She didn't get on the ground, so they put her on the ground. If it turns out that they were acting in bad faith them they will be punished later. Refusing to comply with the officers while they are securing the scene is a mistake, they will establish control, then sort it out later. The alternative is a prolonged mexican standoff, which is unreasonable.

If it turns out the information they acted on was not sufficient probable cause to enter the house then that will be resolved in the coming weeks/months.

Btw I agree 100%

[bowdog]

i wish people would consider the alternative. What if the police allowed themselves to be turned away and the domestic assault victim is assaulted and/or killed soon after that. Those same people ranting about "not martial law" would be ranting about the police failing to protect the victim.

There's folks out there that simply will never utter a good word about a cop. At which point their opinion becomes throwaway. People should approach each situation with an open mind.

yes!

[madcat6183]

Id say more times than not the police are just doing what they feel is right in the heat of the moment. Who knows, maybe if the police had done something like this in CLE, then there wouldn't have been 3 girls locked up for a combined 30 years, raped, beaten, starved, etc.

I know we all like to talk about our "rights" but at what point do we actually think about people just trying to do what is right.

[BDBGoalie]

Why were they there? On a report of domestic violence?

As far as I'm concerned, a report of someone being the victim of violence inside the house is probable cause to enter the house to ensure that all occupants are safe, account for, and get any medical attention they may need. The risk of them not going inside is the attacker may be hiding the victim, or be coercing the victim into pretending to not be a victim, and hiding behind the the "not a police state" thing.

If they have good documentary evidence of the tip that was called in then I'm ok with this policy.

Our rights are not absolute - not when they collide with other people's rights. If the police honestly believe someone inside the house has been assaulted then they have a duty to locate that victim and ensure they are safe.

+1

If they are called to the house on a claim of domestic violence they need to do whatever is necessary to protect those being abused, or at least clear the situation. Even more so if the homeowner is acting suspiciously.

[owndjoo]

all depends on who makes the call and the scene upon arrival. cops show up and nothing looks suspicious and there is no sign of a situation then there is no longer PC. Officers double check that they have the right address and knock on the door. if they are refused entry then that's that, unless there is a sign of a crime being or about to be committed. Domestic violence is one of the toughest situations for law enforcement. A lot of time is put forth in the training for these situations. The biggest issue is that emotions can get in the way of judgement. I've been through a good deal of this training and scenarios being played out. If the person is denying your entry, that is not grounds for PC. Just as if denying search of your vehicle is not itself PC for a search. Obviously we do not know all of this situation and what actions may have led up to this.