Anyone ever think of saying f it?

[Bubba]

I gotta weigh in on this, being an old guy who worked 37+ years at one company that I both loved and hated at various times thoughout my career.  I was forced into retirement in 2006 when the company farmed out my position to a temp agency.  I had planned on working at least an additional 5-6 years, but I took stock of my financial situation, gave up the dream of the yacht on the Riviera, settled for cheap beer on the deck, and have never looked back since.  I enjoy every day as much as possible, even if it's just a walk in the woods with the dog or a short rip into NKY on the scoot.

 

Disclaimer:  Realize that my advice--along with the advice of others on this board--is useless to the OP, as only he can make the changes in his life to find what makes it worth living.

 

A long time ago, I worked for really great boss and we shared many personal stories together.  I was in my 30s at the time, married with kids and mortgage, and couldn't seem to find happiness with my current situation.  He told that there there were some people who 'got' the whole rat race thing that were able to play the game, put up with the BS, even be better at it than most, and find happiness in the daily grind.  And then, there were people like me, who questioned everything, had trouble finding satisfaction in the day-to-day tasks, and that would always be labelled a 'non-conformist' by the folks who run the world.  I can't tell you if the world is that black and white in terms of how people operate, but it stuck with me enough to make me put my head down and plow through the crap of life.  I literally hated the last 5 years of my job, but I could see the end pretty clearly and was willing to make the personal sacrifice of my time to reach that goal.

 

Please understand--this is NOT an endorsement suggesting you stick with a job you hate until you retire.  Doing that will make you a grumpy old man before your time.  What I'm trying to convey is that there is joy to be found in the little things every day--it's just very hard to find that joy when your focus is on the big things.  I liken it to this old story:

 

A philosophy professor stood before his class and had some items in front of him. When the class began, wordlessly he picked up a very large and empty mayonnaise jar and proceeded to fill it with rocks, rocks about 2" in diameter.  He then asked the students if the jar was full? They agreed that it was.  So the professor then picked up a box of pebbles and poured them into the jar. He shook the jar lightly. The pebbles, of course, rolled into the open areas between the rocks.

 

He then asked the students again if the jar was full. They agreed it was.  The professor picked up a box of sand and poured it into the jar. Of course, the sand filled up everything else.

He then asked once more if the jar was full. This time the students were sure and they responded with a unanimous "YES!"

 

The professor then produced two cans of beer from under the table and proceeded to pour their entire contents into the jar -- effectively filling the empty space between the sand. The students laughed.

"Now," said the professor, as the laughter subsided, "I want you to recognize that this jar represents your life. The rocks are the important things - your family, your partner, your health, your children?things that, if everything else was lost and only they remained, your life would still be full. The pebbles are the other things that matter like your job, your house, your car.

The sand is everything else. The small stuff. "If you put the sand into the jar first," he continued "there is no room for the pebbles or the rocks. The same goes for your life. If you spend all your time and energy on the small stuff, you will never have room for the things that are important to you.

 

Pay attention to the things that are critical to your happiness. Play with your children. Take time to get medical checkups. Take your partner out dancing. There will always be time to go to work, clean the house, give a dinner party and fix the disposal.  "Take care of the rocks first -- the things that really matter. Set your priorities. The rest is just sand."  One of the students raised her hand and inquired what the beer represented.

 

The professor smiled. "I'm glad you asked. It just goes to show you that no matter how full your life may seem, there's always room for a couple of beers."

 

Take care of the big things.  Find enjoyment in the little things.  Advice is easily given, but finding the energy and the will to change your perspective is one of the most difficult tasks in life.  And for gawd's sake, talk to your wife and share your pain and discomfort.  She's your partner….and if you picked a good one, she'll she'll help you with making decisions and will gladly share your pain.

 

Good luck.  I'll lift a glass of cold, cheap beer this afternoon on my back deck and toast to your success at finding a solution!!!

[claine650]

I've been thinking I should just start freelance designing and machining aftermarket parts for new cars and motorcycles with my engineering skills. Boom, I'll be an entrepreneur, then hire people to do the dirty work and go ride all day everyday. Forever.

Now, if you have a 2014, let me borrow it

[ReconRat]

Ha! Wait till you're within 6 to 12 months of a successful retiring from the current job, and see how bad you want out.

 

No minimum existence for me. Although good to prepare for just in case, the actual goal is to retire with around full pay (plus investments) and actually have a life. And people still work after retirement. I can't see not working at something.

 

Like my doc said, "don't you know the 60s are the new 40s"

 

Truthfully, these are all huge steps to take in one's life. More power to anyone who does.

[Bubba]

You only live once and I'm going to enjoy myself, but I'll do it wisely. 

 

No one's dying thoughts have ever been that they should have spent more time at work.  

 

 

^^^This^^^

Unless you like eating insects and living in a cave, there isn't much joy in a life without pleasure.  Big difference between 'simple' and 'subsistence'...

 

 

 

I HATE HATE HATE financial pressure, and live a lifestyle that avoids it as best as possible.  The best suggestions I can make are:

1.  Living within your means is far more useful than making more money.  I know people that make well into 6 figures and live paycheck to paycheck.   I also know people that make under 40k and paid their house off years early.

2.  Never buy anything on credit, except a house and possibly a car.  I haven't had a credit card in 6 or 7 years, it was cancelled by the bank becuase it wasn't used for 5 years before that.  

3.  Have 12 months worth of bills in an account and consider it to be "untouchable."  It's easier to do this when you can reduce your monthly overhead. 

 

I agree with #1 implicitly.  I know people who spend hundreds to thousands of dollars a month on useless shit.  I'm from a different generation, so maybe I have different values, but at 64 years of age, I've never had cable TV (I watch very little crap TV and what I do watch is free with rabbit ears) and my only acknowledgement to modern communication is my $99/year cell bill (TracFone, baby--GF insists I carry it for when I 'die' on the MC!?!)  Bought my first 3 houses as little fixer-uppers and sold 'em to upgrade.  Never bought a new car until 3 years post-retirement.

 

#2 is good advice for folks who don't have fairly strong financial resolve.  If you have the discipline, you can use a credit card to your advantage and not have it cost you a penny.

 

#3 is a tough nut to crack.  I'm not sure I ever had that kind of money in an untouchable account until I was old and the kids were gone and out of college.  Can be done by strict budgeting and keeping a close eye on your expenses.

 

 

 

Edited October 3, 2014 by Bubba

[Tpoppa]

If I could pick one symbol to unite people that make poor financial decisions, it would be this:

 

You'll find them in line and they really need their daily $6 coffee at just a 98% markup.  

 

Sorta kidding, but not really.  

 

This might be a close 2nd

Edited October 3, 2014 by Tpoppa

[TimTheAzn]

If I could pick one symbol to unite people that make poor financial decisions, it would be this:

You'll find them in line and they really need their daily $6 coffee at just a 98% markup.

Sorta kidding, but not really.

This might be a close 2nd

Good thing I'm not in that group.

Sent from my iPhone.

[Tpoppa]

^^

well played

[redkow97]

poor financial decisions?  I think you mean this:

 

 

 

 

 

And yeah, I used the brands that poor people are more likely to buy, but the reality is that smokes and booze are always an unnecessary expense.  Our country has a FUCKED UP perception of wealth in that we see people as "financially stable" who are really completely broke, but financing a ton of nice shit.

Edited October 3, 2014 by redkow97

[Tpoppa]

Monster Energy makes my hands and face shake.

[brings all the boys to the yard]

[2talltim]

i think these are the #1 worst financial decisions and we all get sucked into them, kinda sad my monthly phone bill is equal to my truck payment. Iv tried to talk myself into giving mine up many times and i just cant do it.

 

 

 

[2talltim]

I paid zero dollars for my phone and sold my last one for twice what I paid for it.

Speaking more of the monthly expense, i don't think ive ever paid more than $50 for a phone myself. Five phones on my line my bill is around $240 a month and that's after my work discount.

[Tpoppa]

There is a middle-ground.

Watch the documentary "Tiny: an exercise in living small." I'm not suggesting that you move into a 100 square foot box, but take stock of all the things in your house you don't use, and could live without.

That documentary has stopped me from looking at larger houses.

 

 

I watched that as well and am really intrigued by the idea of selling my current 1600 square-foot home for a 500-1000 one with a spacious heated garage for my toys and man-cave.  Like you, I'm not ever going bigger than this house - just too much space that I wouldn't use, and my daughter will be going to college in a year anyway.

 

 

Ditto here as well.  I probably have 300 square feed of unused or rarely-used space.

 

Think about it - if one is fortunate, take the equity of their house and buy a smaller place outright and already you've shed $700-1500 in payments.  That's $7.2-18k/yr less you have to earn, which is less pressure to push, shove and struggle in the job market.  It's not retirement, but it'll get one to retirement a lot faster.

 

Without watching that video, what is the draw to staying small?  If you buy smart, bigger doesn't have to be more expensive.

 

I upgraded from an 1100 sq/ft house to one that was about 2.5 time bigger and much newer.   My total expenses are up about $100/month and that includes utilities.  I'll gladly pay $100/month just to be in a better school system.

 

Red, a great way to save $$ is to stop paying taxes in stupid Cuyahoga County

 

Also, wouldn't staying small limit the equity in your home for when you retire?

Edited October 3, 2014 by Tpoppa

[2talltim]

Well, that's your fault for having too many children and then being conned into the idea that you need to keep track of them.

Shock collars would be cheaper wouldn't they?...Hummmm Edited October 3, 2014 by 2talltim

[Bubba]

No minimum existence for me. Although good to prepare for just in case, the actual goal is to retire with around full pay (plus investments) and actually have a life. And people still work after retirement. I can't see not working at something.

 

Not sure if this was a response to my post, but I really didn't mean to imply I'm living the life of a lonely pauper sipping crap beer by myself on the back deck.  Far from it!!!  Deck is a screen porch that overlooks my 9 acres of hardwood forest with some of the purtiest 12pt bucks you've ever laid eyes on (you can find pics on some of my old posts here).  I've got a 3-bay garage and workshop full of paid-off toys including 3 bikes and a convertible Vette, a late-model Ford PU in the driveway, and nice middle-class annual income in qualified dividends from stock investments over the last 3 decades--no guaranteed pension here.  Unless the the SHTF and zombies invade Hamilton Cty, I don't foresee needing to file for SS until I'm 70.  What I was getting at was that, when it came time make the choice to pull the plug on the job or fight to stay, I looked at what I had, evaluated what could be gained financially by working another 5 years vs retiring, and decided that enough was enough.

 

What's sad is that I can honestly say that while I made some very good choices down through the years, I'm not entirely convinced that much of it wasn't pure blind luck.  The opportunities to be both lucky AND good with respect to investments going forward from here are significantly reduced when compared to the era of the 60s through the 90s, and I'm not sure that my kids will have a 'better life' than I do when it comes time for their golden years.  Sad, but likely.  I'm gonna try my damnedest to leave a useful pot of cash for them when I die.

 

As for working after retiring, I agree wholeheartedly.  Rather than telling people I'm retired, I usually refer to myself as under-employed.  And I still plan on getting that golden years job just for fun….as soon as I figger out what I want to be when I grow up.

 

Gotta remember, though--if I'm working at a great fun job, one of you millenials has to be flipping' burgers at Mickie-D's….  

Edited October 3, 2014 by Bubba

[JackFlash]

That time you are missing out on with your kids, you will never get back.

If you can work a 40 hour week and have two days off, invest a lot of it

in your kids.  Family time is good, but one-on-one time with each kid alone

and only you, creates a bond between you and that child.  They need that.

They can have a relationship by being part of the family unit, but they also

need that "alone" time with each individual parent.  You should do that with

each child, individually, as well as in groups. 

 

Doing an activity together goes a long way.  So what if the birdhouse that

you try to build doesn't come out perfect?  A little fishing on a weekend

evening is a good thing.  The following weekend, another child can have

some personal "Dad" time.  Spread it around. Make a schedule so no child

feels cheated out of their personal time with you.

 

.

[DAC]

I have my kids do my yard work for me while I sit on my ass, drinking beer and yelling my critique.  Quality time in my book.

[Bubba]

I tried that.  They got married and moved out of town….

[ReconRat]

Not sure if this was a response to my post...

Nope. I'd be happy doing what you did as well. I've even considered the SHTF and could live in the woods. But my target is to work up to something better when I retire. So far it's working.

[ReconRat]

I work 32-38 hours per week and think that's already too much.

I went through a decade where I worked 60-80 hours a week sometimes. Mostly it's possible in a 6 month stretch. Does seem to pay off.

[2talltim]

I went through a decade where I worked 60-80 hours a week sometimes. Mostly it's possible in a 6 month stretch. Does seem to pay off.

That's the decade I'm currently living in

[Josh1234]

This is one of the reasons why I don't want kids.  I'm too selfish. Both with my time and my money.

 

I know I'll get a lecture on how great they are, and how I've never known the meaning of life, etc etc, (PLEASE spare me those lectures, I've heard them before!).  But the fact remains I like my time for me & MY hobbies, and naturally there's a financial downside to having kids also.  Ultimately, if the wife wants one, we'll have one, but thankfully, I think she's willing to wait a few more years before making the call

 

As for my spot in life right now, things have gotten a lot better for me in the past year.  I went from a "Field technician" job with irregular working hours and lots of free time but crappy pay to working in an office, but the culture here is great.  unlimited vacation, very casual dress code (shorts & flip flops are fine), free lunch every friday, free sodas, free snack closet.  It's also a lot more money than I was making.  The wife also got a VERY healthy raise this year, but she works too hard.

 

I'm all about doing a good job at work and enjoying what I have, but I read some of those posts on MrMoneyMustache.com and I'm not down with that.  I make my money so that I can spend it and enjoy it.  Sure, I could've retired at 30 like he did, but he had to sell his motorcycle, can't eat out, and can't have nice things that aren't "needs."  I'd rather work and buy toys / be comfortable.

 

As for saying F it, I think society WILL collapse during out lifetimes, but that's another thread... the Prepper thread.  I'm saving that for winter when we need entertainment

[Bad324]

This is one of the reasons why I don't want kids. I'm too selfish. Both with my time and my money.

I know I'll get a lecture on how great they are, and how I've never known the meaning of life, etc etc, (PLEASE spare me those lectures, I've heard them before!). But the fact remains I like my time for me & MY hobbies, and naturally there's a financial downside to having kids also. Ultimately, if the wife wants one, we'll have one, but thankfully, I think she's willing to wait a few more years before making the call

Ditto. Nieces and nephews and my friends kids totally are enough for me for at least a few years

[C-bus]

This is one of the reasons why I don't want kids. I'm too selfish. Both with my time and my money.

I know I'll get a lecture on how great they are, and how I've never known the meaning of life, etc etc, (PLEASE spare me those lectures, I've heard them before!). But the fact remains I like my time for me & MY hobbies, and naturally there's a financial downside to having kids also. Ultimately, if the wife wants one, we'll have one, but thankfully, I think she's willing to wait a few more years before making the call

As for my spot in life right now, things have gotten a lot better for me in the past year. I went from a "Field technician" job with irregular working hours and lots of free time but crappy pay to working in an office, but the culture here is great. unlimited vacation, very casual dress code (shorts & flip flops are fine), free lunch every friday, free sodas, free snack closet. It's also a lot more money than I was making. The wife also got a VERY healthy raise this year, but she works too hard.

I'm all about doing a good job at work and enjoying what I have, but I read some of those posts on MrMoneyMustache.com and I'm not down with that. I make my money so that I can spend it and enjoy it. Sure, I could've retired at 30 like he did, but he had to sell his motorcycle, can't eat out, and can't have nice things that aren't "needs." I'd rather work and buy toys / be comfortable.

As for saying F it, I think society WILL collapse during out lifetimes, but that's another thread... the Prepper thread. I'm saving that for winter when we need entertainment

A good time to realize this is before the pregnancy. I've get plenty of friends who are in their 40s and have chosen not to have kids. All are gay except the one that does more drugs than a healthy sperm can handle, but that's beside the point.

[ScubaCinci]

Nope. If you want to play hard, you have to work hard. I generally "only" work 40 hour weeks though and find that the quality of life diminishes quickly after that. in my younger days, I worked 70 hours a week working 2 jobs for about 2 years and I missed out on a lot of fun but I'm generally in a better place now for it mainly because I worked so much I didn't have time to spend it

[Tigerpaw]

3 years before I am eligible for a pension.  It would cover most expenses if we lived in a tiny house with no bills, in a cheap part of the country.  It is very appealing.

 

Unfortunately, my wife does not want to live the "simple life"

 

Ultimately I will try to stay in the military as long as possible, to build up the pension.