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Newbie Track Tire Question


Sellius

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I'm thinking about getting into track riding and I need some advice about the bike I'm going to use and its tires.

 

I have a '95 Kaw ZX600-C8 and it has 16" wheels.  To say that my tire choices are limited would be an understatement.

 

Since this summer will be my first season on a track, I don't expect to be setting records.  I'm thinking that it'll take a bit of time for my skill to increase to my bike's capabilities, even with regular road tires on it.

 

My question is, am I right?  Am I wasting my time prepping this bike for the track since it'll be so limited by the the tire options, or should I prep it and run those street tires until I finally find myself limited by those tires?

 

I don't *have* to use this bike but it's the "spare" one I have.  If it makes sense to I could find another machine that's better suited.

 

I just don't have the track experience to form an informed opinion, so I thought I'd ask you guys that do.

 

Thanks.

 

 

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what all are you doing prepping the bike?  I have no knowledge of 16" wheels, but I'd say if your going to be spending money I'd really consider putting it toward something a little more modern.  Know of an 04/05 gsxr for sale pretty damn cheap

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Honestly, just run the bike you have on a new set of decent street tires. Think I ran Roadsmart dual compounds my first time. They did just fine, heated nicely enough, and on a ZX14 at that. Novice typically starts you out at 30/30 tire pressures, so most any respectable street tire will suffice.

You've got some learning to do, and trackdays aren't exactly cheap - so just ride the older bike for now to get some experience before spending on a newer bike. A few trackdays in, and you'll know if you want to pursue it further ( which, you likely will...it's a drug :D )

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I was in a similar position a few years ago, except a bit further along in the process:

 

I had a '97 EX500 (17" wheels, but obviously never designed as a sport bike), and even in 17" wheels, there aren't a ton of good tire options in that narrow of a size.

 

But i digress - Take your bike out and burn through at least 1 set of Sport Demons.  Just be aware, YOU ARE GOING TO GET FRUSTRATED with the fact that you're down on power, and possibly down on grip compared to other people in your group.   Learning to ride well even with those limitations is an awesome skill to have ...if you can swallow your pride long enough to do it.

 

I went through a bike a year ('97 EX500, '93 F2, 03' 600RR) before realizing that I had more room for improvement than the bike.

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i tried to edit, but missed my window...

 

EVERY tire, even a qualifying slick, has a finite amount of grip.  Eventually, you WILL approach and or exceed that limit.  The skill you want to acquire is feeling that limit approaching.  You can do that on street tires, and that is what's important.  Transitioning to better tires on a newer bike will not be nearly as hard as learning to interpret what the bike and tires are telling you.

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IMO...you'll have more confidence, learn faster and more on a newer bike.  When you're questionable equipment isn't sitting in the back of your head you'll be able to concentrate on your riding instead of about what the bike can/can't do. A newer bike will provide you with a lot more room to find your comfort zone and then proceed with extending it.

 

I'd suggest you look for something like Ryan pointed out and pick something up.  Keep in mind that when you buy a track/race bike you should be able to recoup most (if not all) of your money if you decide to sell it later.

Edited by r1crusher
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Don't buy a new(er) bike just to do your 1st track day. Just bring what you've got with newer tires. (Is your suspension had regular maintenance? That is important) You could be king of novice on the bike you've got if you want. Too soon to make a decision on spending the big bucks on a new bike imho.

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Don't buy a new(er) bike just to do your 1st track day. Just bring what you've got with newer tires. (Is your suspension had regular maintenance? That is important) You could be king of novice on the bike you've got if you want. Too soon to make a decision on spending the big bucks on a new bike imho.

 

For a 1st track day...I agree 100%, don't blow you wad doing all kinds of shit just to find out you don't enjoy the track as much as first thought.  On the other hand idk what it is about the OP "getting into track riding" that sounds like it is more than planned 1 day thing???  

 

If you are thinking about more than 1 day, look beyond the first couple days.....are the tire worth the price of admission?  4x the price of those tires....thats what I paid for my first track only bike.....did it have a bunch of trick bits on it? hell no, it was a budget bike already prepped that I didn't have to give a shit about.  That is the same price of the gsxr I was talking about before BTW.  

 

Either way, post up when/where you are getting out to the track, hope to see you there!

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Here's my opinion for what it's worth.  This whole "You should get a newer bike" sounds silly.  I've seen plenty of guys on VINTAGE bikes and bikes that are older and more antiquated than the average do JUST FINE.  Don't go blowing your money on a new bike until you get to a point where you feel that you think it is time FOR YOU.  It's like when you get on the internet and post a pic and ask all the arm chair jockies about your riding style.  Makes me giggle like a school girl.

 

Get some solid street rubber like mentioned earlier and make sure the suspension is maybe fresh with clean oil, oil level and all the needed items like a proper tightened chain (Number one issue at the track), all mechanicals in working and safe order and hit the track!

 

16" tires are hard.  But I've seen guys with tire sizes that are hard to find and they do well enough.  Plus, starting out and on that machine, you aren't going to be burning tires up like Rossi during Q1.  Get it ready to go, come join the fun and stop by and say hello and ask all the questions you want.  That's what all of us are here for.  And some of us won't pressure you into silly things and help you succeed with what you have.

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Yes, those are exactly my tire sizes!

 

I'll look into those.

 

Thanks so much for the feedback.  I really appreciate it!

You're in Troy, I live in Piqua. If you'd like some help prepping the bike, hit me up man. I have a NoMar tire changer and balancer, we can get her ready for Spring

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Here's my opinion for what it's worth.  This whole "You should get a newer bike" sounds silly.  I've seen plenty of guys on VINTAGE bikes and bikes that are older and more antiquated than the average do JUST FINE.  Don't go blowing your money on a new bike until you get to a point where you feel that you think it is time FOR YOU.  It's like when you get on the internet and post a pic and ask all the arm chair jockies about your riding style.  Makes me giggle like a school girl.

 

Get some solid street rubber like mentioned earlier and make sure the suspension is maybe fresh with clean oil, oil level and all the needed items like a proper tightened chain (Number one issue at the track), all mechanicals in working and safe order and hit the track!

 

16" tires are hard.  But I've seen guys with tire sizes that are hard to find and they do well enough.  Plus, starting out and on that machine, you aren't going to be burning tires up like Rossi during Q1.  Get it ready to go, come join the fun and stop by and say hello and ask all the questions you want.  That's what all of us are here for.  And some of us won't pressure you into silly things and help you succeed with what you have.

 

hope preaching "you need this" isn't the way I came off, you can do your first trackdays/learn the ropes on anything.  Slower bikes actually provide motivation & vindication when you can push past the more modern/higher displacement bikes.  The feeling is absolutely sweet BTW.  At the same time, the bike has it's limits that cannot be surpassed, someone on a more modern bike with the same skillset will murder you on track, and it will begin to frustrate you....there is no denying it.  As I said before......

 

 

Either way, post up when/where you are getting out to the track, hope to see you there!

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I know I said it before, but I *really* appreciate all of your feedback.  

 

While I would never have bought this bike for the track, this is the one I happen to have to use for this.  It's actually my first bike.  It's in excellent condition but I think it's the slowest Ninja 600 ever made.  I even have it over-geared since I used to run it on the highway so much before I got the Concours.  I plan to drop back to the stock sprocket when I replace the chain.

 

You guys have (mostly) confirmed what I actually was thinking, which is that it would take me some time before my ability runs into the limits of the machine.  I'm not concerned about that as I can move up to another bike when I hit that point.  What I don't know yet is what this learning curve is like.  I have plenty of street miles behind me but I'm not going to kid myself that any of that translates to the track other than knowing the brake from the clutch.  So you guys have answered that very well for me.

 

This is all good news for me anyway as I'll need to spend $ on track gear (suit/gloves/boots) and maybe build a trailer over the winter.

 

Ryan, yes, you are correct that this'll be more than a 1 day thing.  For the last 15 yrs I was in a club that ran vintage sprint cars (pre 1950) on dirt.  That club was dissolved at the end of this season as the membership has all aged out.  So I was looking for something new to get into and this seems pretty cool especially since there's so much knowledge and skill to develop.

 

Hellmutt, I may take you up on your offer, esp on the balancing.  

 

I look forward to meeting you guys.  This seems like a good group.

 

Thanks again!

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That era bike is also legal for V7 racing with WERA.

While their bikes are going to be completely tricked out in some cases, you should be able to get cheap parts and free setup advice from them. There is a guy named lance who has won a bunch of vintage races on his Kawasaki. He seems like a good guy. PM me if you want help finding him on the WERA board.

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