redkow97 Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 If you're interested in one, i would get it ordered before they confirm that jackoff in Las Vegas was using one to shoot at that concert... I'm sure this will piss some people off, but I think responsible firearms owners and enthusiasts need to be leading the charge to make rapid-fire accessories like this much more difficult to obtain, or outright illegal. I've fired a fully-automatic carbine (at a range, under police supervision), and frankly, while thrilling (for 10 seconds or so), I didn't find it the least bit enjoyable. I'm sure I could learn to hold the rifle down better and stay on target, but I can't think of any scenario (not even the zombie apocalypse) where I wouldn't prefer semi-auto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimTheAzn Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 Pretty sure I just got put on a watch-list while looking up what a trigger crank is... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smccrory Posted October 2, 2017 Report Share Posted October 2, 2017 4 hours ago, redkow97 said: If you're interested in one, i would get it ordered before they confirm that jackoff in Las Vegas was using one to shoot at that concert... I'm sure this will piss some people off, but I think responsible firearms owners and enthusiasts need to be leading the charge to make rapid-fire accessories like this much more difficult to obtain, or outright illegal. I've fired a fully-automatic carbine (at a range, under police supervision), and frankly, while thrilling (for 10 seconds or so), I didn't find it the least bit enjoyable. I'm sure I could learn to hold the rifle down better and stay on target, but I can't think of any scenario (not even the zombie apocalypse) where I wouldn't prefer semi-auto. There is some logic to that, like establishing a pre-burn line against a forest fire. My only worry is the same as what the NRA's typically is - that any appeasement is read as weakness, as chum in the water, and worthy of more regulation while the waters are boiling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidgetTodd Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I happen to own several full autos and I disagree. I enjoy them. With use comes control, your experience with muzzle rise was do to inexperience with full auto. Like everything it takes practice. Registered full auto owners are not the problem so further regulating us achieves nothing. We are responsible and law abiding as you would imagine with all the tape involved for us to get them. Any semi auto gun can be illegally converted to full auto. The legal ones are not the problem. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowdog Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I have to fully agree with Todd on this one, people like us that go through the background checks, long waiting periods etc are not the problem here and guns are not either...Mental health and terrorists are the problem. Until we can figure out how to fix that problem then we will always have issues in this country. The crazy's are not obtaining these firearms and accessories legally. Give me tougher background checks and mental health evaluations before you start telling me that guns are the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Reports are saying bump-stock, and not trigger crank, as I expected. In either case, I have a hard time defending them. People can call me "weak" for saying so, but I don't see any need, or practical legal use for equipment that increases the rate of fire by that degree. It's a slippery slope to be sure. I hate rationalizing restrictions because "it doesn't negatively impact me." People want to limit the number of guns an individual can own to 10 (or whatever)? "No problem. I don't have room in the safe for more than 10." But allowing the erosion of freedom based on it not being YOUR freedom is a dangerous precedent. With that said, I'm growing more sympathetic to the people asking, "how the fuck did this guy have that kind of arsenal???" Shitty days to be a responsible gun owner. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonik Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 1 minute ago, bowdog said: The crazy's are not obtaining these firearms and accessories legally. Give me tougher background checks and mental health evaluations before you start telling me that guns are the problem. This guy got his guns legally. So yes, your second sentence works. But getting a mental health evaluation to get a gun is going to be a very hard system to implement. I agree we need to do something like this but it is going to be tough. All of this is a symptom of a much larger problem. America has lost it's way. No one cares about anyone anymore. You see it on the roads, all the road rage..truckers are insane anymore. 10 years ago they were the White Knights of the highway. Mean people everywhere. See it in politics, you either agree with me 100 percent or I hate you. Poverty in this country is off the charts, and no one cares. 'It's your fault, get a job loser.' People that think @Casper should be killed. It's horrible. No idea what the fix is, but it certainly is broken. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 5 minutes ago, bowdog said: Give me tougher background checks and mental health evaluations before you start telling me that guns are the problem. I think a lot of people would view that attitude as a monumental step in the right direction. I wish the NRA (I'm not a member, if that's relevant) would come out and be the ones to propose such a measure, rather than coming across as so extremely right-wing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 You're also going to have to regulate private party sales MUCH more strictly. I expect this will occur in the same way vehicles are titled, requiring a notarized transaction, with the notary needing proof of a background check, MH eval, etc. before he or she will execute the paperwork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonik Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 12 minutes ago, redkow97 said: You're also going to have to regulate private party sales MUCH more strictly. I expect this will occur in the same way vehicles are titled, requiring a notarized transaction, with the notary needing proof of a background check, MH eval, etc. before he or she will execute the paperwork. That one is easy, use the existing system. So if I sell you a gun we just walk into the local gun shop. The background check system needs to be changed, you get a license every five years or so to buy a gun...just like a CHL. Hell, the CHL can serve both purposes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubba Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 Once again, it sounds as if all the guns were legally obtained thru local gun shop owners. I don't understand, at least in this scenario, how a stricter licensing process that involves mental health evaluation will prevent a "one-and-done" shooting event. It's not the disheveled, drooling homeless guy that pulls this shit off--it's the "regular Joe" down the street, the quiet guy who keeps his yard nice and shares a beer with the neighbors who brings a whole new level of crazy to our society. No one--including a specialist in mental health--could have predicted this. By all accounts, he was law-abiding multi-millionaire who was fully involved in the fabric of his community: homeowner, investor, entrepreneur, pilot, retiree. It'll be interesting altho perhaps not completely definitive what the GF will reveal she knew about the last few months of this guy's life. Sounds like she must have at least been aware of his burgeoning arsenal, but that fact may not have been much of a tip-off to what transpired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidgetTodd Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 His arsenal has zero to do with it. I promise you my "arsenal" and my quantity of ammo on hand makes his look like a kids nerf gun game yet I have zero intention of illegal activities or of killing anyone other than someone who wishes to do me harm first. Second. The more that comes out about this guy the more I start to think it was a set up. The guy is not the type and had no reason or motive and had a great and wealthy life. I'm not convinced there's not a lot more to this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 7 minutes ago, Bubba said: No one--including a specialist in mental health--could have predicted this. I think you're overstating your position here. I understand that there were no reported "red flags" by any friends or family members, and the clarity of hindsight is always going to give people pause as to what they should have noticed, but unless this guy actually went through some kind of mental health evaluation, I don't think it's fair to say what it would or would not have predicted. I don't have a major issue with government supplemented (did I just type that?) MH evaluations for people purchasing firearms. That said, I have grave concerns about that system being ripe for abuse. You're putting someone's constitutional right in the hands of a subjective evaluator. There would have to be an appeals process for people who are rejected, and a vetting process for the MH personnel to confirm they're performing valid evaluations, and not just pushing their own agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 2 minutes ago, MidgetTodd said: His arsenal has zero to do with it. I promise you my "arsenal" and my quantity of ammo on hand makes his look like a kids nerf gun game yet I have zero intention of illegal activities or of killing anyone other than someone who wishes to do me harm first. Second. The more that comes out about this guy the more I start to think it was a set up. The guy is not the type and had no reason or motive and had a great and wealthy life. I'm not convinced there's not a lot more to this How "conspiracy brother" are you getting on this? I would entertain the possibility that he acted under duress, or that someone stole his firearms and kidnapped him before executing him, but shit like government concocted "false flag" events are too far-fetched for my taste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidgetTodd Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 36 minutes ago, redkow97 said: How "conspiracy brother" are you getting on this? I would entertain the possibility that he acted under duress, or that someone stole his firearms and kidnapped him before executing him, but shit like government concocted "false flag" events are too far-fetched for my taste. I'm making no theory or judgement yet other than absolutely nothing in this guys past or current leads to this. Interviews with neighbors, family, friends and business associates all adamantly say no way he did this. The behavor up to the event doesn't fit. His lifestyle doesn't fit. On and on. He had no reason to die and every reason to keep living his life as a millionaire. I'm not buying it is my only theory right now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smccrory Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 https://www.apnews.com/ff26110203da4a28bfd1d99022fb401c/Vegas-gunman-had-device-that-lets-guns-fire-like-automatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 4 hours ago, MidgetTodd said: I'm not convinced there's not a lot more to this I tend to agree with this. I'm not sure what "more" means just yet, but assembling a bunch of guns and ammo near a big concert seems very calculated. It seems like more than he just "snapped." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted October 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I hope they uncover something that explains the motive as well, but I'm not optimistic that will happen. I'd like to hear what the live-in girlfriend has to say. Otherwise, i'm guessing this guy was a loner. "He played $100 a hand video poker." Video poker, because he didn't want to talk to a dealer or other players? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted October 3, 2017 Report Share Posted October 3, 2017 I've read a handful of things about this guy that could explain a motive, but none worth repeating here. Sources that pop up after a tragedy are often unreliable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jschaf Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 (edited) WTF? 59+ people dead, 500 people injured.. We've got to catch this shit before it happens. What would you suggest.??? Edited October 4, 2017 by jschaf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted October 4, 2017 Report Share Posted October 4, 2017 9 minutes ago, jschaf said: WTF? 59+ people dead, 500 people injured.. We've got to catch this shit before it happens. What would you suggest.??? Without knowing the shooter's motive or reasoning, that's a very difficult question to answer. It's like asking how to prepare for a random car crash on a highway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jschaf Posted October 5, 2017 Report Share Posted October 5, 2017 Pretty lame Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smccrory Posted October 5, 2017 Report Share Posted October 5, 2017 Not lame if you want to be attributive with remedies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted October 5, 2017 Report Share Posted October 5, 2017 29 minutes ago, jschaf said: Pretty lame Tony. How's that Jim? Not sure what answer you're looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonik Posted October 5, 2017 Report Share Posted October 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Tpoppa said: Without knowing the shooter's motive or reasoning, that's a very difficult question to answer. It's like asking how to prepare for a random car crash on a highway. You prepare for a random car crash on the highway by having seatbelts, air bags and crash resistant cars. All federally mandated. And you don't run around saying cars dont kill people, people kill people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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