Senate rejects expanded gun background checks

[unfunnyryan]

why are you so ignorant?

http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/Obama-guns-executive-orders/2013/01/16/id/471689

 

Which item on that list inhibit your ability to own a firearm?

 

You're half a chromosome away from being a full blown retard.

[paktinat]

http://i.imgur.com/dmVCBZel.jpg

[iwishiwascool]

That's because there is no problem. We do not need to compare the United States to other countries, as this is the greatest country around, period / fact. We are where everyone wants to live. So enjoy your wiki stats. Especially the city ones as we all know how well Chicago is fairing with crime and controls.

 

Gotcha. I didn't factor in blind jingoism into my logical argument. Most of Chicago's guns are not bought in Chicago. One could argue that if the net number of guns were fewer and Guns were harder to come by. Surely the kids in the middle of the Harper Highschool war zone would not resort to crowbars and axe murdering if guns weren't readily available.

 

 

Still waiting to hear what you define as a problem. Again I don't care about life outside the United States. Go live there if life is so good.

 

I'm getting convinced that I was giving you far to much credibility in your debate skillz. How flippant can you be? Is this the argument I should have used during our Obamacare debate? Listen to the Harper High School TAL podcast above and then tell me guns are not an issue. Just because gun violence doesn't impact you directly does not mean a problem does not exist.

 

Govt can't produce data? My violin is playing as I sing BS.

 

You believe and are ok with the fact that the NRA has deliberately and systematically through lobby defunded the CDCs research into gun violence? You are fine with a lobby impacting a position which you blindly agree but would surely decry outrage if it was the other way around.

[87GT]

http://i.imgur.com/dmVCBZel.jpg

 

 

http://i.imgur.com/yevd9ms.jpg

[Drewhop]

Gotcha. I didn't factor in blind jingoism into my logical argument. Most of Chicago's guns are not bought in Chicago. One could argue that if the net number of guns were fewer and Guns were harder to come by. Surely the kids in the middle of the Harper Highschool war zone would not resort to crowbars and axe murdering if guns weren't readily available.

 

 

 

 

I'm getting convinced that I was giving you far to much credibility in your debate skillz. How flippant can you be? Is this the argument I should have used during our Obamacare debate? Listen to the Harper High School TAL podcast above and then tell me guns are not an issue. Just because gun violence doesn't impact you directly does not mean a problem does not exist.

 

 

 

You believe and are ok with the fact that the NRA has deliberately and systematically through lobby defunded the CDCs research into gun violence? You are fine with a lobby impacting a position which you blindly agree but would surely decry outrage if it was the other way around.

 

Did you watch the video Sol posted?

[iwishiwascool]

Interesting watch.

 

 

A few things:

 

The FBI’s Uniform Crime Reports defines a “violent crime” as one of four specific offenses: murder and nonnegligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery, and aggravated assault.

 

The British Home Office, by contrast, has a substantially different definition of violent crime. The British definition includes all “crimes against the person,” including simple assaults, all robberies, and all “sexual offenses,” as opposed to the FBI, which only counts aggravated assaults and “forcible rapes.”

 

Also, his notion that "nobody is paying attention to the 50% drop in crime" is way off too. Even

the movie did an entire segment on this statistic and the reasons behind it. The reasons are surprising.

 

A lot of you are bringing up the causation vs. correlation argument which is valid.

[TTQ B4U]

Gotcha. I didn't factor in blind jingoism into my logical argument. Most of Chicago's guns are not bought in Chicago. One could argue that if the net number of guns were fewer and Guns were harder to come by. Surely the kids in the middle of the Harper Highschool war zone would not resort to crowbars and axe murdering if guns weren't readily available.

 

So you agree that Chicago's laws and tough gun control aren't doing shit to help them. That instead it's basically just impacting the good people of that fair city and still not helping curb crime. Interesting. Water follows the path of least resistance too so it's no surprise that the legal geniuses in Chicago never thought that plan through as their home is still flooding. The criminals are still getting guns and even if all their surrounding states were to join the tough gun law lands, the guns would still flow. They won't all of a sudden stop crime or see a jump in criminals trying to register guns.

 

So do really believe that little FBI Disclaimer at the begining of every movie or the efforts everyone in the music industry puts in place are in any way limiting piracy? I have bridge I'd like to sell you too.

 

Listen to the Harper High School TAL podcast above and then tell me guns are not an issue. Just because gun violence doesn't impact you directly does not mean a problem does not exist.

 

Third time asking....how about you just tell us all what you see the problem is?

 

You believe and are ok with the fact that the NRA has deliberately and systematically through lobby defunded the CDCs research into gun violence?

 

How about we stick to the point and show me how any further legislation and bullshit ideas will impact the world we live in for the better. The bill that got shot down wouldn't do shit so why do it. It's Obama grandstanding and stroking off to the tragedy in CT to accomplish his agenda. He's falsely professing that expanded background checks would have saved those kids. He's trying to create fear that an AR firearm is some evil weapon and that you'd be better off removing them from the rightful owners that have them. That my 15 round 9mm magazines are the devil and that I shouldn't be allowed to own them. Bullshit. He needs to actually go FIX something in this country and stop stomping on the rights of others to further his agenda of greed and image improvement. He's a legend in his own mind.

 

You are fine with a lobby impacting a position which you blindly agree but would surely decry outrage if it was the other way around.

 

The only outrage going on is that I'm waiting to hear your personal opinion on what the problem is. I don't want to hear about podcasts you've listened to or review diagrams that have been available on google since the internet was invented.

[TTQ B4U]

I have a spot on page 42 for sale. Taking bids via PM.

[TTQ B4U]

Ken, I'll listen to your podcast while I take my kids to karate. However, just based on what I skimmed of it, I can tell you guns aren't the problem in a shitty school district or neighborhood. AGain, if Obama would put his head focused on the right problems those areas are likely dealing with perhaps he could create a positive impact. Kids don't go around getting shot or firing guns because of guns and their ability to get their hands on them.

 

I have tons of cash to go buy hookers and blow and I think I can find both pretty easily....but I don't. It's time he figure out that guns aren't the problem and that trying to control through further legislation isn't going to fix those kids or the problems that they are facing which are leading to them making bad choices.

[Mr. Jones]

http://i.imgur.com/TdDKvaZ.jpg

[SpaceGhost]

The issue in Chicago is parenting. I have a friend that teaches in south Chicago, man I don't know why she does it, she's a saint.

[TTQ B4U]

The issue in Chicago is parenting. I have a friend that teaches in south Chicago, man I don't know why she does it, she's a saint.

 

that's my point. guns aren't the problem. Until Obama and Biden and all the others out there on their side "get that" then the real problem will continue.

[iwishiwascool]

that's my point. guns aren't the problem. Until Obama and Biden and all the others out there on their side "get that" then the real problem will continue.

 

So, can we at least agree, all pretenses aside, that if there were fewer guns in the world, as in they've never been invented, these kids would more likely resort to jump-kicks and Karate chops than shooting each-other in the street?

 

This is the problem. The pervasiveness of guns attained by legal, law-abiding citizens has trickled down in such a way that has made conflict deadlier. It is far easier to pull a trigger from 100 or even a few feet away than it is to feel the tactile feedback of a knife penetrating your victim.

 

Yes; poverty, poor parenting, perverse culture, et al is at play- These happen to all be things that the right does not want or care to deal with either- But the addition of readily accessible guns added to the above equation creates a unnecessary culture of death and destruction in the parts of town we pretend don't exist.

[Geeesammy]

http://i.imgur.com/eJ1naU7.jpg

[TTQ B4U]

So, can we at least agree, all pretenses aside, that if there were fewer guns in the world, as in they've never been invented, these kids would more likely resort to jump-kicks and Karate chops than shooting each-other in the street?

 

Sure....but why. That's not the case and it's not even a rational thought. I'd much rather say if Obama and his administration would rather focus on less handouts, holding ALL people accountable for their actions, reform schools and help people help become better people we wouldn't have to deal with this either. Half these kids are victims of "the system" and shitty parents. Sorry but the real trouble maker kids just need to go-away, get locked up and the system as we know it scrubbed of the bad ones so we can begin fresh. Sounds harsh but a few babies with the diapers is likely needed to get shit under control. Change or die as the saying goes.....time for change centered around the REAL problem....and that problem isn't the fact that as a responsible gun owner I have an AR in my cabinet or wish to buy one on the private market without big brother having his nose in my business.

 

 

This is the problem. The pervasiveness of guns attained by legal, law-abiding citizens has trickled down in such a way that has made conflict deadlier.

Not at all. The problem is the guns it's the people who end up using them incorrectly or illegally.

 

It is far easier to pull a trigger from 100 or even a few feet away than it is to feel the tactile feedback of a knife penetrating your victim.

One could say the same thing for weapons under the military's control. We could wipe out North Korea without a single man on the ground, just a few submarines and nukes and life for them would end. Again, having the weapons in hand isn't the problem. It's the intelligence or lack their of from those holding them

 

 

Yes; poverty, poor parenting, perverse culture, et al is at play- These happen to all be things that the right does not want or care to deal with either-

Obama isn't dealing with it so don't profess he is. He's furthering the above's dependance on the system and not at all helping them better themselves to be man enough to actually make a difference in their own lives let alone the lives around them.

 

 

But the addition of readily accessible guns added to the above equation creates a unnecessary culture of death and destruction in the parts of town we pretend don't exist.

the addition of guns or in some peoples minds the removal of them isn't the cause or answer. don't fuck with my rights and capabilities and ability to manage life and guns in a meaningful respectful way because those you speak of can't do the same. No need to lower the bar. Raise the bar and take those parts of town and fix them. What pisses me off is THAT'S what Obama should be held accountable to do. Not fuck with the rights of the rest of us in spite of a few.

[sol740]

Made conflict deadlier? Violent crime has fallen consistently over the last 25 years. How have gun sales been over the same period?

[iwishiwascool]

Made conflict deadlier? Violent crime has fallen consistently over the last 25 years. How have gun sales been over the same period?

 

How have abortion rates been 18 years prior to the drop:

 

Linkey

 

Again dudes, I am not advocating from a position of increased gun control, I don't care. I would, however, prefer to live in a land where gun ownership is not an imperative to living free. That doesn't sound very free to me.

[TTQ B4U]

I would, however, prefer to live in a land where gun ownership is not an imperative to living free. That doesn't sound very free to me.

 

Having bigger gov't like what is trying to be had by our current administration isn't helping our freedoms. I want a country where the federal gov't is striving to be small not get larger. They can't manage what they currently have let alone more. Obama needs to stay the hell out of healthcare and guns period.

[2highpsi]

I would, however, prefer to live in a land where gun ownership is not an imperative to living free. That doesn't sound very free to me.

 

 

Gun ownership isn't imperative to living free.

 

The ABILITY to own guns is.

 

Freedom: Exemption from external control, interference, regulation, etc. The power to determine action without restraint.

[sol740]

I'm familiar with freakonomics, and even they admit they can't prove cause, but sure, it's interesting. I think the argument many gun-owners make is that without firearms, you cannot defend your freedom. If you prefer to live in a land where gun ownership isn't an imperative, congrats you live here, no one is forcing you to own guns. Nor should anyone force me to not own guns. Everybody just needs to leave everybody elses' wallets, guns, and sex partners alone.

[smokinHawk1647545499]

Which item on that list inhibit your ability to own a firearm?

 

You're half a chromosome away from being a full blown retard.

 

you just don't want to admit you put your foot in your mouth and you were wrong. Admit your defeat.

you dont need to take any chromosomes away, you are all ready there.

 

LOL

 

$5 to everyone that post in this thread if any sort of gun control on the federal level is implemented

 

retards.

[87GT]

Everybody just needs to leave everybody elses' wallets, guns, and sex partners alone.

 

What this guy said.

[wagner]

Maybe should have done this first? :dumb:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-taking-action-gun-background-152057250.html

[RedRocket1647545505]

Maybe should have done this first? :dumb:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-taking-action-gun-background-152057250.html

 

Out of here with your common sense. :masturboy:

[smokin5s]

So, can we at least agree, all pretenses aside, that if there were fewer guns in the world, as in they've never been invented, these kids would more likely resort to jump-kicks and Karate chops than shooting each-other in the street?

 

I will not agree with this... people who want to murder will find ways to do so. If you'd like to discuss a time before guns were invented... do you think there is more or less deadly crimes? If your answer is no, then you aren't thinking about midevil times, or during the height of the Roman Empire... More people were murdered than any time in history... but I guess because it was done with swords, knives, and blunt objects it doesn't count...

 

My point is, PEOPLE WILL FIND A WAY TO KILL EACH OTHER. take away guns, and we will use other means.. whether it be our cars, knives, 4x4's rocks, you get the picture.