Ohio company raising money for gun for Zimmerman

[Rustlestiltskin]

These are not facts. These are conclusions you have fabricated to confirm your narrative.

 

Zimmerman did NOT escalate anything by getting out of his vehicle to better assist the police in finding this suspicious person.

 

Escalation happens when the level of the playing field is elevated. That only happened when Martin made contact with Zimmerman.

 

Truthbomb ACTIVATED

[Geeesammy]

Truthbomb ACTIVATED

 

Now we are headed down the fuse to an undoubted ban and or thread lock.

[TTQ B4U]

Did you guys hear that OJ was acquitted of murder? How the fuck did that guy get away with that???

 

black people. :gabe:

 

 

Are you saying disobeying the 911 operator was a good thing to do?

 

He didn't disobey the dispatcher. He was simply told "we don't need you to do that" That's not an order or command.

 

Now we are headed down the fuse to an undoubted ban and or thread lock.

 

IB4CLOSE :dumb:

[Otis Nice]

To all talking about CCW holders retreating:

 

He didn't John Wayne it and come out guns blazin'. From my understanding he was doing a job (neighborhood watch) and questioning Trayvon. He didn't pull the pistol until after Trayvon was in full mount, had already struck him several times, and bashed his head against the concrete all while threatening his life.

 

Just what I've read though. I wasn't there obviously so...

[87GT]

 

 

 

 

He didn't disobey the dispatcher. He was simply told "we don't need you to do that" That's not an order or command.

 

 

 

Something is wrong with your though process if that response means anything other than "don't do that".

[Spidey2721]

wasnt he already out of the vehicle before they told him " you dont need to do that"?

 

i do agree if it was me i wouldn't have gotten out either.

[Sledhead36]

The court decided this, and we must believe they looked at all the evidence....case settled. Not guilty.

[Otis Nice]

The court decided this, and we must believe they looked at all the evidence....case settled. Not guilty.

 

/thread

[Buck531]

Zimmerman just wanted to taste the rainbow from Trayvons skittles.

 

Why so quick to judge?

[oh8sti]

Are you saying disobeying the 911 operator was a good thing to do? Last thing I remember from my CCW class is you swallow your pride and run away with your tail between your legs. You don't search out trouble you stay away from it as much as humanly possible.

 

Considering he was already out of his car, simply observing the direction the suspect went, then yes it was a good idea.

 

With all that in context lets realize one more thing. A suggestion from a 911 operator is not a command or an order. They suggested to him that he not follow the suspect. So, like a normal person would, he simply stopped trying to see where he went. This can all be verified by the unedited 911 calls.

[Spidey2721]

the unedited 911 calls.

 

being the key.

[verse]

Are you saying disobeying the 911 operator was a good thing to do? Last thing I remember from my CCW class is you swallow your pride and run away with your tail between your legs. You don't search out trouble you stay away from it as much as humanly possible.

 

That's in Ohio, not the law in Florida. You should know this. Apples to oranges.

 

If I were in the same shoes, I would have done the exact same thing.

[LJ]

From my understanding he was doing a job (neighborhood watch) and questioning Trayvon.

 

Pursuing someone and questioning them in NOT the job of neighborhood watch.

[LJ]

That's in Ohio, not the law in Florida. You should know this. Apples to oranges.

 

If I were in the same shoes, I would have done the exact same thing.

 

It's not law. It's called self preservation. Look what it got Zimmerman. Hundreds of thousands of dollars in legal fees, hate from many, etc. The outcome of going to check out Martin ended with 1 person dead and another with a ruined life.

[JuicedH22]

Are you saying disobeying the 911 operator was a good thing to do? Last thing I remember from my CCW class is you swallow your pride and run away with your tail between your legs. You don't search out trouble you stay away from it as much as humanly possible.

 

he didnt disobey jackass... know the facts before spreading BS....

[JuicedH22]

also, it is not a fact that GZ was pursuing TM to question him... he was following him, to see where he went/he was going to inform the police... hence the 911 call to get them on the way...

 

also a fact that GZ didnt even know the race of TM at first, and never mentioned it until ASKED by the 911 operator. Then there's the whole fact portion of him saying 'punks' that the media tried to spin off as 'coons'.... (prosecution even admitted this). just throwing that out there.

[Otis Nice]

I'm with Sledhead on this.

 

Also, it was grossly misrepresented from the media and .gov from the get go. More propaganda to divide people. Look what it's doing here.

[87GT]

You all must of missed George's account of events. He noticed Trayvon, called the non-emergency hotline to report this, then Trayvon approached George while he was still in his car. George rolled up his window to avoid confrontation. Trayvon ran away. After this he got out of his car to see where Trayvon went. The non-emergency hotline asked if he was following Trayvon and he said yes. They replied you don't need to do that. George said okay and walked back to his car. Then Trayvon confronted him again out of nowhere. Read the statement the police released if you don't believe this to be true. It was also on his defense lawyers website. IMO he fucked up when he left his car. He reported the shady individual and it should've ended at that but he decided to investigate more. I would not of got out of my car because I was negatively confronted by a stranger, I am not a LEO, and I was carrying a firearm.

 

But he was acquitted of all charges and he is not guilty. He is still guilty of making a bad decision because he didn't leave well enough alone.

 

If you want to carry a firearm thats fine stay away from dangerous situations. If you want to investigate and follow people who give you bad feeling do it without carrying a firearm. Self preservation is more important.

[87GT]

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2012/images/06/21/written_statement_0226.pdf

 

There is the police statement. Top of page 2 is where Trayvon was "circling his vehicle". If you feel you shouldn't remove yourself at this point in his shoes you have a problem with risk assessment.

[Green Bastard]

The only facts I know for sure to be true in this case:

1. Only two guys actually know exactly what happened that night.

2. One of those two guys is dead.

[Putty]

I still want to know why anyone carrying a gun would be yelling for help.......when your help, that you clearly aren't afraid to use, is on your waistband.

 

That said....I wish this shit just passes and this whole black/white thing finds an end somewhere, one day.

[Green Bastard]

I still want to know why anyone carrying a gun would be yelling for help.......when your help, that you clearly aren't afraid to use, is on your waistband.

 

That said....I wish this shit just passes and this whole black/white thing finds an end somewhere, one day.

 

Amen.

[Otis Nice]

I still want to know why anyone carrying a gun would be yelling for help.......when your help, that you clearly aren't afraid to use, is on your waistband.

 

Isn't this what the people who don't necessarily agree with CCW here on CR say to do? Call for help, try to get out, etc.

 

I'm not talking about whether or not he should have even been in that situation. Once he is though, doesn't calling for help show he was trying to keep from shooting?

 

That said....I wish this shit just passes and this whole black/white thing finds an end somewhere, one day.

 

Well said.

[Putty]

Isn't this what the people who don't necessarily agree with CCW here on CR say to do? Call for help, try to get out, etc.

.

 

 

I guess if you take that perspective. Just seems odd to me is all.

[greg1647545532]

It's been a while since I've put my 2 cents into this and I know nobody cares about another assholes opinion, but this is the internet so I'm going for it.

 

George Zimmerman overreacted in two major ways that night. Listening to his 911 call, you can get a pretty clear picture of his perception of the threat -- some guy, messed up or on drugs or something, walking all suspiciously, reaching for his waistband (gun? weapon?), there's been a bunch of burglaries in the area, and the assholes always get away. His picture of events is that there was a guy, very likely a criminal, very likely on drugs, very possibly armed. Reality was that there was a kid, possibly high on weed, walking home from the store to the place he was staying. If you can't admit this is an overreaction, quit reading because we have nothing to talk about.

 

Overreaction 2 is evident when he describes his beating to the cops. It felt like his head was going to explode, he thought he was going to pass out, Martin was reaching for his gun and said "you're gonna die tonight motherfucker." It all sounds very dire, but the reality is that he was screaming like a pansy for like 90 seconds and Martin did some pretty minor damage in that time. At no point was he in danger of being suffocated (because it takes minutes to suffocate someone, and there was constant screaming), and while I certainly wouldn't want the head gashes he had, everyone who commented on them in the trial dismissed them as inconsequential injuries. Bottom line, he was getting a pretty pathetic beating, and yet somehow was still unable to scramble away. If you don't agree that he overreacted to his beating, move along, because we have nothing to talk about.

 

Now, before anyone hits reply, I understand that we have a legal system that intentionally picks these sorts of situations apart to see if a crime was committed. Zimmerman had every right to assume the worst about Martin and call the cops. He had every right to get out of his car and follow him. Even if Zimmerman started the fight, which there's not much evidence for, in Florida that doesn't preclude claiming self-defense. Also in Florida, per some case law I saw cited on another forum, the injuries he received are sufficient for a claim of self-defense. In other words, he had every legal right to overreact. If you dissect the night in question like that, there's no legal case, and it's pretty clear that the prosecution was politically motivated.

 

We should all humbly respect our legal system as the best of a bunch of imperfect systems. However, while we should all be glad that the system works as well as it does, I don't think we should be rejoicing that justice was somehow served.

 

By that I mean that Zimmerman overreacted, and when people overreact when they're armed, people can die. That's a bad thing, and if you don't agree with that then I'm surprised you made it this far because we have nothing to talk about. There's no crime that we can charge people like this with, people who happen to overreact while armed with a gun, nor do I think there should be such a law. This is just one of those situations where society can't get justice, because getting justice means breaking the system that we've put so much faith in.

 

But I do think that we can use this as a learning opportunity. I hope that the takeaway from this case isn't that we can make mistakes and shoot our way out of a bad situation, even though legally that's entirely true. Rather, the takeaway should be ways to avoid making those mistakes in the first place. That should be the focus. Certainly raising money to donate a gun to this guy shouldn't be.