National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2011

[jporter12]

Don't remember seeing this posted before. I get the Congress Megavote email every week, and this was on the upcoming section:

http://www.congress.org/congressorg/issues/bills/?billtype=H.R.822&congress=112

Original Sponsor:

Cliff Stearns (R-FL 6th)

Cosponsor Total: 246

(last sponsor added 10/13/2011)

212 Republicans

34 Democrats

About This Legislation:

2/18/2011--Introduced.

National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2011 - Amends the federal criminal code to authorize a person who is carrying a government-issued photographic identification document and a valid permit to carry a concealed firearm in one state, and who is not prohibited from possessing, transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm under federal law, to carry a concealed handgun (other than a machinegun or destructive device) in another state in accordance with the restrictions of that state.

[imprez55]

By the wording "in another state in accordance with the restrictions of that state.", couldn't Wisconsin and Illinois say that their restriction is that you cannot carry so it still wouldn't apply? With the same logic, "may issue" states like CA and NY could do the same and prevent it? If so, I don't see this as being too drastic of a change from the status quo. It seems like the states that wouldn't weasel their way out of this, already have reciprocity with the other states.

[jporter12]

By the wording "in another state in accordance with the restrictions of that state.", couldn't Wisconsin and Illinois say that their restriction is that you cannot carry so it still wouldn't apply? With the same logic, "may issue" states like CA and NY could do the same and prevent it? If so, I don't see this as being too drastic of a change from the status quo. It seems like the states that wouldn't weasel their way out of this, already have reciprocity with the other states.

Yes, if a state doesn't allow carry, you'd still have to not carry. I think it's to make reciprocity a bit more universal, rather than having to get several states' permits to be covered in most, then to have to know which one works in what state...

[jporter12]

Here's a link to the full text:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr822rh/pdf/BILLS-112hr822rh.pdf

[Pokey]

Wisconsin passed their CHL, only stupid ass commie Illinois is left.

[jporter12]

So, this is going for vote in the House today.

Here's an interesting take on it:

http://www.nationalgunrights.org/h-r-822-a-trojan-horse/

[jagr]

This is from an NRA Email.

National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act to be voted on in the U.S. House of Representatives this week!

On Tuesday, November 15, the U.S. House of Representatives will vote on H.R. 822, the "National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act." Please contact Representative Tiberi and urge him to vote for this pro-gun legislation. This important bill would allow any law-abiding concealed carry permit holder to legally carry a concealed firearm while visiting any state that does not prohibit concealed carry.

Please contact Rep. Tiberi as soon as possible and urge*him to vote for H.R. 822, the "National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act".

Phone:

Washington,** DC (202) 225-5355

Columbus** (614) 523-2555

Email: http://www.capwiz.com/nra/issues/alert/?alertid=55111516

*

The Facts About H.R. 822, the "National Right to Carry Reciprocity Act"

Unfortunately, but predictably, H.R. 822 continues to be attacked by anti-gun organizations and the media. Regrettably, even some so-called "pro-gun" organizations have joined with the anti-gun Brady Campaign and Michael Bloomberg's Mayors Against Illegal Guns to try to defeat this pro-gun bill.

This critically important legislation, introduced earlier this year by Congressmen Cliff Stearns (R-Fla.) and Heath Shuler (D-N.C.) and cosponsored by more than 240 of their colleagues, would enable millions of permit holders to exercise their right to self-defense while traveling outside their home states.

There is currently only one remaining state (Illinois) that has no legal way for individuals to carry concealed firearms for self-defense. Forty states have permit systems that make it possible for any law-abiding person to obtain a permit, while most of the others have discretionary permit systems. (Vermont has never required a permit.)

H.R. 822 would mark a major step forward for gun owners' rights by significantly expanding where permits are recognized. Dozens of states have passed Right-to-Carry laws over the past 25 years, because the right to self-defense does not end when one leaves home. However, interstate recognition of permits is not uniform and creates great confusion and potential problems for travelers. While many states have broad reciprocity, others have very restrictive reciprocity laws, and a few deny recognition completely.

H.R. 822 would solve this problem by requiring that lawfully issued carry permits be recognized in all states with some form of a permit system, while protecting the ability of the various states to determine the areas where carrying is prohibited within their boundaries.

Opponents of the legislation claim that it tramples on "states rights." States, however, don't have rights, they have powers. And while many anti-gun lawmakers who've long pushed national gun bans, national bans on private gun sales, national waiting periods and other federal restrictions have suddenly become born-again advocates of "states' rights" in opposing this bill, several provisions in the U.S. Constitution give Congress the authority to enact interstate carry. Congress also has the power to protect the rights of citizens, nationwide, under the 14th Amendment (please see related article from last week's Grassroots Alert).

Next, despite what a few so-called "pro-gun" activists have argued, this bill would not create a federal licensing or registration system, nor would it establish a minimum federal standard for carry permits. Rather, it would require the states to recognize each others' carry permits, just as they recognize driver's licenses and carry permits held by armored car guards. Unfortunately, these self-proclaimed "gun rights" supporters, who have no active lobbying presence in any legislature, have an agenda that has very little to do with promoting the interests of gun owners. Here are the FACTS about a few of their claims:

Myth: H.R. 822 would involve the federal bureaucracy in setting standards for carry permits, resulting in "need" requirements, higher fees, waiting periods, national gun owner registration, or worse.

FACT: H.R. 822 doesn't require-or even authorize-any such action by any federal agency. In fact, since it would amend the Gun Control Act, it would fall under a limitation within that law that authorizes "only such rules and regulations as are necessary to carry out" the GCA's provisions. No federal rules or regulations would be needed to implement H.R. 822, which simply overrides certain state laws.

Myth: H.R. 822 would destroy permitless carry systems such as those in Arizona, Alaska, Vermont and Wyoming.

FACT: H.R. 822 would have absolutely no effect on how the permitless carry states' laws work within those states. For residents of Arizona, Alaska and Wyoming, where permits are not required but remain available under state law, H.R. 822 would make those permits valid in all states that issue permits to their own residents. Residents of Vermont, where no permits are issued or required, could obtain nonresident permits from other states to enjoy the benefits of H.R. 822.

Myth: If H.R. 822 moved through the legislative process, it would be subject to anti-gun amendments.

TRUTH: By this logic, neither NRA, nor any other pro-gun group, should ever promote any pro-gun reform legislation. But inaction isn't an option for those of us who want to make positive changes for gun owners. Instead, we know that by careful vote counting and strategic use of legislative procedure, anti-gun amendments can be avoided or defeated.

H.R. 822 is a good bill for gun owners. Don't listen to false or misleading accusations; instead, read the bill and our fact sheet explaining its provisions. Then, please contact your member of Congress and urge him or her to support the earliest possible consideration of H.R. 822 this year.

Please contact Representative Tiberi at (202) 225-5355 or by email by clicking here and urge him to stand up for gun owners' rights by voting for this important legislation

[Gixxus Christ!]

Wrote my congressman about this, we will see how the vote pans out.

[bowdog]

I am still confused on some of these laws... I am originally from NY and will be traveling back for Thanksgiving, you do not need a permit in NY to conceal carry however there is a 2 week waiting period when purchasing a hand gun. Someone help me out, the way i understand is even though i am originally from there but now live in Ohio with valid ID I am not aloud to travel with my Ohio CCW to NY and carry while driving to my destination? Is that correct?

[bowdog]

are you referring to a 'safe passage' law' date=' because you need a permit to conceal a gun in new york. Unless I am just completely retarded today..[/quote']

I am not sure? I moved from there to here for college in 2001 so laws may have changed? I am just curious if i am aloud to have my pistol with me while traveling from Ohio to NY for the holidays and back?

[bowdog]

thanks that is a good find. Says NY and Penn. do not honor Ohio's CCW permit so by "law" i cannot protect myself while traveling. I think this goes back to one of those sigs i have seen that says i would rather be judged by 12 then carried by 6?!?!?!

[alab32]

I am not sure? I moved from there to here for college in 2001 so laws may have changed? I am just curious if i am aloud to have my pistol with me while traveling from Ohio to NY for the holidays and back?

As far as I know, I am from NY as well, you have always needed a concealed carry permit to carry concealed in NY. It is VERY difficult to get the CCW in NY as wel;. The process involves convincing a judge that you have a legitimate fear for your life on a daily basis and then have said judge sign your paperwork. Very tough...

Anyways, what it sounds like this law will do is allow you to carry your weapon into NY because they do have a CCW system in place even though they, right now, dont have a reciprocity agreement in effect. So as long as a state has some sort of CCW permit process, unlike Illinois, you will be able to carry your weapon in that state as long as you have a CCW from SOMEWHERE. It sounds like this bill would get rid of the reciprocity maps. As long as you have a CCW you can carry in any state that has a CCW process.

[jporter12]

This is from an NRA Email.

Thanks for posting that, it clears up some the garble that people are reading into this bill, such as the link that I posted. I always like to hear both sides, and in this case get to read the actual bill.

[conn-e-rot]

thanks that is a good find. Says NY and Penn. do not honor Ohio's CCW permit so by "law" i cannot protect myself while traveling. I think this goes back to one of those sigs i have seen that says i would rather be judged by 12 then carried by 6?!?!?!

You can carry it in your vehicle concealed or open traveling through Pennsylvania but you can not exit the vehicle with it concealed without a Pennsylvania permit they do allow open carry but if your in Philly you have to have a permit to open carry. Also Pennsylvania does not require notification so if you should get pulled over do not tell the cop you have a gun like you would in Ohio he may tend to freak out. Before you enter NY it needs to be unloaded and gun locked in separate case from ammo the ammo needs to also be locked up.

Edited November 16, 2011 by conn-e-rot

[kawi kid]

So did it pass?

[kawi kid]

want a good laugh got to the new your times and read some of their articles regarding this bill.

[redkow97]

I'm not sure like a bill that says "state X must honor state Y's laws."

It takes away some of the ability to "vote with your feet." i.e., say you're totally anti concealed-carry. Right now you can move to a state where it's not legal. This removes that protection for those people.

And even as a concealed carry supporter, I am familiar with the Ohio requirements to obtain a permit. I am not at all familiar with the Kentucky requirements. Pretend for a moment that Ohio makes it incredibly hard to get a permit, and Kentucky is basically giving them away. Now I'm subjected to dealing with people with KY carry permits that are a joke?

I don't like that some other state is deciding what regulations Ohio must honor. I'm sure other states don't like being told that they have to honor Ohio permits either...

[jporter12]

It looks like they're watering it down:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d112:h.r.822:

[jporter12]

Oh yeah, and one of the amendments talks about a "database" of registered permit holders.

[alab32]

I'm not sure like a bill that says "state X must honor state Y's laws."

It takes away some of the ability to "vote with your feet." i.e., say you're totally anti concealed-carry. Right now you can move to a state where it's not legal. This removes that protection for those people.

And even as a concealed carry supporter, I am familiar with the Ohio requirements to obtain a permit. I am not at all familiar with the Kentucky requirements. Pretend for a moment that Ohio makes it incredibly hard to get a permit, and Kentucky is basically giving them away. Now I'm subjected to dealing with people with KY carry permits that are a joke?

I don't like that some other state is deciding what regulations Ohio must honor. I'm sure other states don't like being told that they have to honor Ohio permits either...

There is only one state right now where those people who are against concealed carry can go and that is Il. That being said, if this law passed the way it was written then it wouldn't matter because you wouldnt be able to bring it to Il anyways, because you cant get a CCW there at all.

Regarding folks that are "anti"... I'll point to the Second Amendment.

Regarding your example of Kentucky's hypothetical lack of education concerning CCW... We have reciprocity with Alaska' date=' and they don't require a permit to carry concealed.[/quote']

YES!!! The 2nd Amendment is there for a reason!

[CBBaron]

Regarding your example of Kentucky's hypothetical lack of education concerning CCW... We have reciprocity with Alaska' date=' and they don't require a permit to carry concealed.[/quote']

We have reciprocity with Alaska for Alaskan permit holders. To get a permit in Alaska requires training similar to that in Ohio. So the argument is not valid.

However Alaska does not require its residents to get a permit in order to carry.

Craig

[kawi kid]

It passed lady night. And from what i read the watered down amendments didn't pass with it.

[BadTrainDriver]

It passed lady night. And from what i read the watered down amendments didn't pass with it.

God damn auto correct!!

[TheBrown57]

So just to make sure it passing allows CCW permit holders to travel from state to state, except Il, and not have to be specifically trained by said state?

I just want to make sure I understood everything

[conn-e-rot]

It has only passed in the House still has to go through Senate and Obama