Hwilli Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 not at all, but it does tends to appear that he might have been deliberately setting up a lawsuit.Unfortunately it is common practice for police to violate peoples rights. The only way to raise awareness and correct that situation is to hit them in their wallet.Does he deserve $3.6 million dollars, after purposely starting this?See above.Tonik pretty much covered everything concerning the law.Maybe you should become a police officer, and do a better job. You seem to be an expert and all.Police have a tough job, but they chose that job they were not forced into it. I personally believe they should be held to a very high standard in order to keep that job. Sadly this is far from the case.Also those of you who are willing to give up your rights so easily, well... they are yours to give up. Don't ask anyone else to give up theirs though. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner75 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 +rep to this finally someone gets it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 I can say I have never been ask for my ID by an officer with out a good reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 Ok so leave the little country city you live in where the cops know you and try to open carry. I would bet you make it five mins in cleveland in the same situation at 4am with a man with a gun call in a gas station before you are face down with zip ties on you with a cop on your back. Is it right? Hell no! will it happen most likely. Am I going to push the limits and bring my recording device in with me to get it all on tape and sue for lots of money? NO! I have my chl and will just go in concealed and by pass all the drama this guy seems to try to draw to himself. YES his rights may have been violated but he goes out of his way to try to provoke this action which is a dick move. That is the other side of this story. Which you seem to be missing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 (edited) i understand people like to make things easy, but legally the cop has no right to ask for ID if he has done nothing wrong. being a dick or not its still his right to legally refuse to identify himself. if the police violate the constitutional right then they deserved to be sued, then maybe they will understand that its not ok to violate peoples rights.That is flatly 100% wrong.The cops can absolutely stop you and ask for you to provide identification, because there is nothing incriminating about providing identification.If you're carrying a firearm, the police have every right to make sure you're doing so legally. If you're not a felon, and you cooperate, they ought to send you on your way. If they don't, THEN you have a reason to be irritated.that's not to say they won't read you the riot act for being a fucking moron and inviting scrutiny by carrying a gun in a situation where you're damn well aware it's going to cause people to freak out.Case-in-point, I can walk around telling people "the devil is coming," and acting all kinds of crazy. That doesn't mean people won't call the cops out of concern. Or even more parallel, if I was walking around carrying a knife in my hand, or hanging prominently on my belt. You're telling me you wouldn't be concerned if some stranger was visibly armed? Edited May 13, 2013 by redkow97 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 Ok so leave the little country city you live in where the cops know you and try to open carry. I would bet you make it five mins in cleveland in the same situation at 4am with a man with a gun call in a gas station before you are face down with zip ties on you with a cop on your back. Is it right? Hell no! will it happen most likely. Am I going to push the limits and bring my recording device in with me to get it all on tape and sue for lots of money? NO! I have my chl and will just go in concealed and by pass all the drama this guy seems to try to draw to himself. YES his rights may have been violated but he goes out of his way to try to provoke this action which is a dick move. That is the other side of this story. Which you seem to be missing.Cleveland has already had their share of the lawsuits I think they would handle this situation entirely different now than Dayton did maybe after their pockets are a little lighter Dayton will retrain their officers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 ^^^I'm not a lawyer or anything but I think he is LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 When was the last time you were in Cleveland? The cops are just as bad as ever. They Put a 132 rounds in a car for throwing a pop can out the window!! Like stated CHL for a reason much easier then dealing with rogue cops all the time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 (edited) Just because you have a right to do something does not mean you have a right not to be questioned about it.Miranda rights are not in effect until you are 1) in police custody, and 2) being interrogated. Police may investigate a crime without Mirandizing anyone. "excuse me sir, I need you to surrender your weapon while we ask you a few questions" is investigation.You can give the cops the silent treatment from the jump if you want, but they're just going to arrest you for obstruction of justice. Edited May 13, 2013 by redkow97 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapesmuggler27 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 (edited) 2921.29 Failure to disclose personal information.(A) No person who is in a public place shall refuse to disclose the person's name, address, or date of birth, when requested by a law enforcement officer who reasonably suspects either of the following:(1) The person is committing, has committed, or is about to commit a criminal offense.(2) The person witnessed any of the following:(a) An offense of violence that would constitute a felony under the laws of this state;(b) A felony offense that causes or results in, or creates a substantial risk of, serious physical harm to another person or to property;© Any attempt or conspiracy to commit, or complicity in committing, any offense identified in division (A)(2)(a) or (b) of this section;(d) Any conduct reasonably indicating that any offense identified in division (A)(2)(a) or (b) of this section or any attempt, conspiracy, or complicity described in division (A)(2)© of this section has been, is being, or is about to be committed.(B) Whoever violates this section is guilty of failure to disclose one's personal information, a misdemeanor of the fourth degree.© Nothing in this section requires a person to answer any questions beyond that person's name, address, or date of birth. Nothing in this section authorizes a law enforcement officer to arrest a person for not providing any information beyond that person's name, address, or date of birth or for refusing to describe the offense observed.(D) It is not a violation of this section to refuse to answer a question that would reveal a person's age or date of birth if age is an element of the crime that the person is suspected of committing.Effective Date: 04-14-2006Says nothing about having to show ID. This man also is not commiting, commited, or about to commit (grey area) a crime Edited May 13, 2013 by grapesmuggler27 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
granda080 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 Just out of curiosity, does it matter what the attendant that called in said? I get if they said there was someone in the store open carrying that there is nothing illegal. If the attendant said someone with a gun was "acting suspicious" would that garner "a crime about to happen"?Anyone have any interest in answering my question? LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 That is flatly 100% wrong.The cops can absolutely stop you and ask for you to provide identification, because there is nothing incriminating about providing identification.If you're carrying a firearm, the police have every right to make sure you're doing so legally. If you're not a felon, and you cooperate, they ought to send you on your way. If they don't, THEN you have a reason to be irritated.that's not to say they won't read you the riot act for being a fucking moron and inviting scrutiny by carrying a gun in a situation where you're damn well aware it's going to cause people to freak out.Case-in-point, I can walk around telling people "the devil is coming," and acting all kinds of crazy. That doesn't mean people won't call the cops out of concern. Or even more parallel, if I was walking around carrying a knife in my hand, or hanging prominently on my belt. You're telling me you wouldn't be concerned if some stranger was visibly armed?If it's a knife over 3" in most of Ohio than chances are it'd be illegal but open carrying a firearm is not illegal. They have no more right to ask me for identification for carrying a firearm than the do if I was carrying a baseball bat. Would things have been different had he showed them ID possibly but since they feel they did no wrong I doubt it would've been much different. Now unfortunately they will learn an expensive lesson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 Anyone have any interest in answering my question? LOLI have asked similar questions too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 if he's carrying a gun, he may be committing a crime. He could be on probation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner75 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 if he's carrying a gun, he may be committing a crime. He could be on probation.Then if he is suspect of committing a crime as defined by the law then he would be detained and therefore under investigation. However the argument must show that he wasn't stopped simply because he was open carrying a weapon. That has been tried many times and its been ruled many times that simply Open carry of a weapon isnt enough to justify the stop.The biggest point though, if he is carrying a weapon while on probation, then hes breaking the law, and as defined he is a criminal. I seriously doubt that someone on probation would be carrying a weapon openly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 ITT: a lot of people who love feeling free while riding a motorcycle, and yet abhor and fight against the freedoms and rights that are INHERENT as part of being an American citizen.this mans 2nd and 4th amendment rights were violated (assuming he was, in fact, doing nothing illegal)"why didn't he just produce his papers?"what the hell is wrong with us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grapesmuggler27 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 if he's carrying a gun, he may be committing a crime. He could be on probation.If your driving a car you could be drunk. So lets pull over random cars and make sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 if he's carrying a gun, he may be committing a crime. He could be on probation.Really??? Kind of like if he's black he might be getting ready to commit a crime. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 I give up... Let the criminals, non criminals, or otherwise open carry at 4 am in the ghetto. And piss on the cops for being paranoid assholes for asking for an I.D. to make sure he was legal to open carry. Fuck the police and a 5.0 to cause the boys in the hood are always hard... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
granda080 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 If your driving a car you could be drunk. So lets pull over random cars and make sure.DUI checkpoints... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 What's next? Look at that guy on that sportbike I bet he's getting ready to speed we better pull him over now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner75 Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 if he's carrying a gun, he may be committing a crime. He could be on probation.I think if you havent done so by now, you need to get in contact with Buckeye Firearms and ask for them to direct you to some legal counsel who can educate you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 Does it matter someone called the police? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 I believe he is already a lawyer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted May 13, 2013 Report Share Posted May 13, 2013 Good thing you own a cruiser now LOL! Just don't leave a bar at 2am or you will get pulled over for that. And I think redkow can contact himself now that he passed the Bar exam? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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