Akula Posted September 13, 2004 Report Share Posted September 13, 2004 The guy I race with has been driving for 15 years, 3 years ago we finished in the top 10 for IHRA division 3. 2 Years ago we finished 12 in same. Last year we where invited to run at a race at trails to prove to people they had a good facility. So when I say we have some experience I am not blowing hot air. In the 15 years our driver/owner has been racing, he has never crossed the center line. It happened twice on sunday. In addition to the fact that the Altered kept getting all crazy out on the track, there was a B A D wreck with a dragster that rolled and burst into flames. But apparently none of the officials wanted to believe it was the track. There was a bad oil down in that lane earlier in the day that probably caused the draster crash, but we will never know for sure. After the first time we got twisted up I told the lady at the timing shack, and one of the officials with her that the track prep team sucks. After the second time, when the car was at about the 1/8th and got all crazy I was shocked and amazed to see the safety crew rolling in the next set of cars. Not so much as a check to see if anything was on the track. So I gestured that the track was crap and they should just keep them coming. So the guy running the tree runs over to me and gets in my face and tells me it is the drivers fault the car got crossed up cause he got out of the groove. He tells me a car ran right in front of him at 8.90 and it was fine. He blames it on the driver, I asked why he thought the car ended up out of the groove and he tells me "I don't know" but figures it is the driver. Not needing to start fighting with an official and holding up racing I walked away, plus I needed to tow the car back to the trailer. We showed up to the track at 830, they did ZERO prep work and started calling cars to the lanes. After the oildown they sprayed VHT on the track be never dragged it in. After the crash and fire, they put some kitty litter down and sprayed VHT but never dragged it in. I am not sure they have a clue what it takes to put on a good program there. There, I feel better...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMeanGreen Posted September 13, 2004 Report Share Posted September 13, 2004 Trails sucks. Now you know why I spend the extra hour drive and go to Norwalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akula Posted September 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2004 Matt put it better than I did.... September 13, 2004 National Hot Rod Association 2035 Financial Way Glendora, CA 91741 (626) 914-4761 (6260 963-5360 (fax) To whom it may concern: I would like to convey my experiences at National Trail Raceway on Sunday September 12, 2004. I do so in an effort to express the serious safety concerns that I have about the facility. I volunteer my time to act as a crewmember for a friend who races at this facility, primarily, and at other tracks on occasion. I have been fortunate enough to do this for two years now, and occasionally enter my own vehicle in the Sportsman class as well. I have been a drag racing fan for as long as I can remember, and participate because of my love for the sport and the enjoyment of the experience found at the track and in the racing community. I believe this to be the same for the rest of my teammates. For us, it isn’t so much about winning, but more about just being there. My friend’s open-wheel car competes in the Super Pro and Quick 32 classes, and generally runs in the 7.70’s around 170 mph. He is usually one of the faster cars at the track on any given weekend, and is very consistent as well. Sunday, his ET’s varied by about .03 seconds (on completed passes), and this mirrored the changes in temperature during the day. About mid-day, a competitor ran into problems and dropped oil on the track from around the 1/8th mile mark through the end of the track and partially into the return lane. Track staff spent about 40 minutes cleaning up the oil and continued racing. A few minutes after racing restarted, another competitor rolled his dragster several times after the finish line. As a result of this accident, there was an alcohol fire, and he was eventually transported to the hospital via helicopter. This accident began in the lane with the oil down, near the finish line. It then continued into both lanes nearing the end of the track. One of the drivers from the previous race, also in a dragster, witnessed the incident as he was driving down the return lane. He was able to stop his car, get out and run to the accident before the safety crew could get there. The driver in the return lane was nearly as far away as the safety crew, and it was that driver who extinguished the driver that was on fire. This is the first of my concerns. During the cleanup of this serious accident, I walked the track to see if there were any parts or fluids on the track. The tire marks from the dragster that rolled were pretty clear. The inside rear tire was locked up as he crossed the finish line, leaving a dark skid mark on the track. There was no mark from the outside rear tire. As I walked further down the track, I could then see where the outside rear tire had left a skid mark, curving towards the center of the track. Further down, there was an even darker mark from the inside rear tire again, curving towards the wall. This mark passed through the oil dry from the previous oil down, and was a dark skid mark on one side of the oil dry, then no rubber on top of the oil dry, and then dark again on the other side of the oil dry. The last skid mark was from the outside tire again, and had diagonal stripes along the edge. I am guessing that is when the sidewall rolled under the dragster, and where it began to roll. Can anyone say, without a doubt, that the previous oil down caused or played a part in this accident? My guess is that it at least played a part, but we will won’t anything definite. Should a track official investigate that possibility before sending anyone else down the track? I think so, but cleanup was kept to the area where the dragster burned. This brings me to my second concern, which is track prep. I don’t know if the problem lies in a lack of experience, if the track is short-staffed, or if it is a financial limitation, but track prep at NTR is (and has been) very poor. I have been to National events at NTR, and other tracks, and, in comparison, the way the track surface is managed day-to-day at NTR is unacceptable. On one of our time trials, the right land was so poor that the car lost traction around 60 feet, and it caused the car to cross the center line. After looking at the track, I found a spot 2 feet wide by 4 feet long where there was no rubber on the track at all (just bare concrete). On the other side of the lane, the rubber was rolling up. During eliminations, another competitor dropped fluids on the track. This was at dusk. After cleaning the track with oil dry, the track staff decided to put down VHT for the entire quarter mile (both lanes). Less than a minute after applying traction compound, they had cars running on the track. The track was not dragged at all, just sprayed. From what I have seen and heard, VHT needs to be dragged with rubber before it is truly effective. Also, I believe that it takes several minutes for VHT to dry and react with the rubber on the track. We were the in the first pair of Quick 32, and the second set of cars to go after the application of traction compound. My friend shook the tires during the launch (very unusual), and had to get completely out of the throttle. A few minutes later, we were called up for Super Pro. You could still smell VHT in the burnout box. This launch the car hooked up well, and lost traction about 600 feet out. It veered towards the center line, and then went up on two tires as my friend steered it back into the lane. The track staff watched this happen, and then waved in two more cars. Another team member through up his hands in disgust, and one of the track staff ran over and asked him what his problem was. He went on to say that it had to be the driver’s fault, as it happened after the transition, and because the 8.90 car (using a throttle stop) that went down our lane before us didn’t have any problems. It was dark by this point, and there is no way to know whether that 8.90 car dropped anything on the track or not (at least from staging). Considering the day’s events, I would think that the track’s staff would want to stop and check why the car got that far out of shape. That car has hundreds of passes on it, and had never crossed the center line before. That day, it did it twice (once from each lane). My friend has been racing for 15 years, and has never crossed the center line before. In my mind, the NHRA exists because of safety. It was brought into existence in order to get people off of the streets so that they could race in a safe, controlled environment. While there certainly is money involved in drag racing these days, it still seems that safety is, and should be, the primary function of the NHRA governing body. When you look at the new batch of street racers out there, the NHRA needs to exist today more than ever. I am sure that most people involved in amateur drag racing would agree that safety is more important than the extra few minutes it takes to do the job correct. I would ask that the NHRA address this issue with all its owned and sanctioned tracks. I understand that not every track can afford a street sweeper and the latest cutting edge equipment, but I know that they can afford a torch and a broom. I have to believe that the NHRA can create a “best practices” document that covers the proper use of traction compound (VHT TRACKBITE), powdered resin traction compound (VHT TRACKSPOT), and the cleanup of an oil down. I can’t express how important I believe it is for you to address this problem. Until today, I have never taken time out of my busy day to write a letter over a product or service. This, however, involves the well being of many people. If National Trail Raceway can send 7000 horsepower dragsters down the track reliably on one weekend per year, they should easily be able to send a 1000 horsepower car down the track on the rest. There are plenty of good reasons to address this. As I am sure you know, amateur racing creates and educates pro racing’s future drivers. Amateur racing strengthens and broadens pro racing’s fan base. If the thousands of amateur racing’s drivers, family, and friends feel that it can’t be done without serious risk to life and limb, they will no longer do it. Without the support of the NHRA, racers will stop supporting the NHRA. Will the NHRA wait until someone dies on the track before the problem is addressed? How many people do you suppose were standing around the flatbed truck when the twisted and burned dragster was dragged off of it and placed in the racer’s trailer? There are young children at the track, and some of them are racing. The Coughlin family (ever heard of Jeg’s?) and friends were at their home track that day. Children and adults alike were affected by the sight of the broken and melted car and medical helicopter. Without the grass roots support of amateur racing, there will be no money or future in drag racing. I believe this could have all been avoided by taking a few minutes between rounds to sweep, spray, and drag the lanes, and taking a little more care in the cleanup of an oil down. I would like to thank you for taking the time to read this long and technical letter. I would also like to hear your plans for addressing the issue. I am not looking to see an individual get into trouble. I am not looking for restitution, free money, or patronization. I would encourage you to think this one through. If it is a staffing issue, I am sure that racers could assist, or wait the extra time. We are talking about people who run towards a fire to help out a competitor. I would like to see a plan to make this track safe to drive on. I can assure you that how you respond will play a part in my future plans and dealings with the NHRA. Sincerely, Matthew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iwishiwascool Posted September 14, 2004 Report Share Posted September 14, 2004 Im convinced Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy Posted September 14, 2004 Report Share Posted September 14, 2004 that is a very good letter. i agree... trails does suck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bracketracer13 Posted September 14, 2004 Report Share Posted September 14, 2004 To hell with trails.... graemlins/nonono.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avenger1647545502 Posted September 26, 2004 Report Share Posted September 26, 2004 I gave up on Trails when I saw a bone-stock 92 AWD Talon spin all four off the line. And all the rice kids have gotten annoying, you can't get anywhere near the staging line fence parking anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
90gt Posted September 26, 2004 Report Share Posted September 26, 2004 I've never had a problem there, go race at marion then whine about trails isn't that bad. I've gone 1.60's in a stock everything suspesion mustang. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy Posted September 26, 2004 Report Share Posted September 26, 2004 trails is not as bad as people make it out to be.. no there not #1 but I would be pretty appreciative of that track now ater being to marion... i think gravel roads hook better and are more safe than that place. "A track is better than no track too"- just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGRE Posted September 26, 2004 Report Share Posted September 26, 2004 IMO trails is the 2nd best hooking track in the area within an hour of columbus. Only second to the 1/8 mi. at Pacemakers. I agree Trails could be better, but it is still superior to killkare or MCIR. there is practially NO saftey concerns ar Marion, i've seen an 11.teens nova that was so rusted that there were no quarterpanels left, make a pass with his windo down, no helmet, no roll bar. nothing. Or you can ask kenny smile.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy Posted September 27, 2004 Report Share Posted September 27, 2004 yeah one guy blew oil smoke down the whole tack the other night.. they didnt check, then one kid had a broken window cracked to all hell ...they didnt care...i was like wow... this is ultra specail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziggy1647545504 Posted September 27, 2004 Report Share Posted September 27, 2004 Has the letter garnered any response yet? It has been two weeks after all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akula Posted September 28, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2004 Nope, not a word. They either don't care, or they are working on keeping the pros from striking the next national event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest riggs867 Posted October 1, 2004 Report Share Posted October 1, 2004 I still haven't heard a word from them. Also, we are talking about a 1000 HP plus car that weighs 1800 pounds breaking the tires loose out past 660 feet (~150 mph). This car has a huge wing generating downforce too. We are talking big drag slicks running 6 psi air pressure. This isn't a street car hopped up to race, this is a hand built race car. The car is consistent to the hundredth of a second while running 7.70 ETs. It just doesn't do things like this, and the track staff should know this considering we were there for every race, and running second in the Super Quick points at the time. National Trail Raceway is owned by the NHRA, and has 8000 HP cars that run it. One would expect a track at this level to at least understand how to use traction compound. Any person with common sense would want to look at the track after seeing the runs we made. I talked to one of them after they air lifted the guy out of there to the hospital, and this 20-something kid was emphatic that it wasn't the track, and had to be something else. That sort of pride and refusal to at least consider the possibility that the track might have a problem will get you in trouble every time. I think the next thing to do is send the letter to all the big magazines and websites. Maybe that will get a response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMeanGreen Posted October 2, 2004 Report Share Posted October 2, 2004 CR has the backing of a lot of members. I'm sure we could generate some publicity on the issue smile.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
excell Posted October 3, 2004 Report Share Posted October 3, 2004 Just go to Norwalk. Better track, people who give a shit, and there is an awesome Mexican place in town. smile.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akula Posted October 7, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2004 I just heard that for no apparent reason, the rest of the season at NTR will be 1/8th mile. Guess another car rolled out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziggy1647545504 Posted October 7, 2004 Report Share Posted October 7, 2004 I'm just wondering, (keeping in mind that I've never actually been down the track at NTR) How many people will have to get hurt for the problem to be rectified? I don't currently have anything to bother racing with, but even if I did, I don't think I'd want to risk it until there has been some sort of resolution to this. And no, I don't consider shutting down the last half of the track a resolution. Am I wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akula Posted October 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2004 You and I agree on this point. Remember two years ago two rookies got stuck in the left lane in PS and rolled. Then Jegy put himself in the left lane and got all out of shape deploying the chutes at 900 feet. Well, I think this track is plagued with problems for one reason. Maintenance. The crew out there has no idea how to prep or maintain the track. The reason it hooks at national events is because NHRA's crew works the track, not the local guys. When they did the "repair" work last winter, they just covered over the crappy track with a skim coat. They need to rip the track out, fix the water problems with a new roadbed rather than just pointing and wondering. Then put down a concrete 1/8th at the minimum and all new shut down. Moving the starting line back 30 feet or so wouldn't hurt either as the shutdown is way too short for national events. If they did that and trained their staff the track would rule. Now hire Bill Bader as a consultant to get the facility up to speed (bleechers, concessions, etc... It would be a wonderful place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziggy1647545504 Posted October 8, 2004 Report Share Posted October 8, 2004 Originally posted by AkulaThey need to rip the track out, fix the water problems with a new roadbed rather than just pointing and wondering. Then put down a concrete 1/8th at the minimum and all new shut down. Will this ever happen? I mean realistically? From what I've heard, it seems that even if the NHRA did pull their sanction, ownership may not do anything anyway... They would still get to keep their events like Super Chevy and the Mopar Nats, wouldn't they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akula Posted October 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2004 NHRA Pro racing enjoys some of the highest attendence of any race at Columbus. If they put some money into the track it could be quite lucrative. Unfortunately, getting a track bulldozed and replaced is quite pricey. I predict it will turn into MCIR. That is unless someone with an interest in racing, and a pile of money, offers to buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest riggs867 Posted October 8, 2004 Report Share Posted October 8, 2004 Originally posted by CR Caddy: They need to rip the track out, fix the water problems with a new roadbed rather than just pointing and wondering. Then put down a concrete 1/8th at the minimum and all new shut down. Will this ever happen? I mean realistically? From what I've heard, it seems that even if the NHRA did pull their sanction, ownership may not do anything anyway... They would still get to keep their events like Super Chevy and the Mopar Nats, wouldn't they? Just an FYI, NHRA is the owner. They probably aren't going to pull their sanction from a track that they own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziggy1647545504 Posted October 8, 2004 Report Share Posted October 8, 2004 Originally posted by MotoMatt: Just an FYI, NHRA is the owner. They probably aren't going to pull their sanction from a track that they own.I was not aware of that. Thank you. That being the case, doesn't it seem like they would take more interest in these allegations of poor track prep, inexperienced staffing, etc...? Also, once the word gets out that NTR isn't safe for high horsepower, low ET cars, will they not lose participation in some of their larger events? I'd really hate to see NTR go the way of MCIR, but if something isn't done, it looks like that may be inevitable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akula Posted October 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Mike Spitzer (Spitzer chassis) got a team together to buy Trails from NHRA but it didn't work out. If it had, everyone would be saying Norwalk sucks compared to Trails. By the way, went to Norwalk this weekend and it was excellent as usual. They didn't spend all day on the track, but they didn't keep and eye on it and spray and drag when needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
excell Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Originally posted by Akula: Now hire Bill Bader as a consultant to get the facility up to speed (bleechers, concessions, etc... It would be a wonderful place. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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