Why does everyone hate Obama, Pelosi, and Reid?

[Scotty2Hotty]

I forgot to add Obama has done great things for the Firearms and Ammunition industry.

[evan9381]

The people around him not holding a gun would get a pay freeze, so he would still be hearing about it. All while Clowngress isn't taking a pay freeze themselves, although its cool to freeze everyone else's pay.

 

It's no different than some company not giving raises to anyone, then giving the CEO a $5 million bonus for the year.

 

so you're saying that someone not holding a gun in iraq/afghanistan wouldnt be considered "military and civilian employees risking their lives on our behalf in Afghanistan, Iraq, and anywhere else they are serving in harm's way"

 

either way, you do realize that this plan to freeze federal workers pay was a republican idea first, correct?

 

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/130925-obama-calls-for-two-year-pay-freeze-for-federal-workers

 

House Republican Whip Eric Cantor (Va.) noted that he had brought a proposal for a federal pay freeze to the House floor in May, only to have that proposal rejected by House Democrats. He said he was “pleased that President Obama appears ready to join our efforts.”

 

 

Cantor and other House Republicans also pointed out that their “Pledge to America” midterm election platform called for a net hiring freeze for non-security-related federal workers, a more extensive cut in spending than a pay freeze.

 

but people bitching about not getting a raise in a time when unemployment is so high can eat a dick. im one of the unemployed currently and if i was still employed, believe i would not be bitching if my boss came up and said "sorry, no raises this year or next"...id be happy i still had a job

[copperhead]

either way, you do realize that this plan to freeze federal workers pay was a republican idea first, correct?

 

This is, indeed, correct.

 

However.

 

They didn't want to touch the military at all. Dem's made that proposal.

 

but people bitching about not getting a raise in a time when unemployment is so high can eat a dick. im one of the unemployed currently and if i was still employed, believe i would not be bitching if my boss came up and said "sorry, no raises this year or next"...id be happy i still had a job

 

Oh, I understand completely. My company hasn't given anyone raises in two years, expecting it again this year. Today is layoff day - two people at my site are getting shitcanned, don't know who yet. If its me, I'm calling up the bank and telling them they can take the house because I can't even come close to affording it on unemployment.

[I Eat Rice]

Oh, I understand completely. My company hasn't given anyone raises in two years, expecting it again this year. Today is layoff day - two people at my site are getting shitcanned, don't know who yet. If its me, I'm calling up the bank and telling them they can take the house because I can't even come close to affording it on unemployment.

It is so sad that our country is in such termoil that stories like yours and evans exist. So many people in this crountry work so hard for the things that they earn in life, its a shame that many of them are loseing these very things because our Government can't unite together and find a solution to the tast at hand.

[Slowbalt]

Been busy recently but I found an interesting article for your perusal. Here is an article somewhat against Obama also explaining why he is not a Socialist and this article pretty much sums up what my point is. To clarify again, I am not in favor of total Socialism and the elimination of Capitalism. I am for a blend of both, much like we have now, but a bit more Socialism than we have now.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/13/AR2009031301899.html

[TTQ B4U]

Been busy recently but I found an interesting article for your perusal. Here is an article somewhat against Obama also explaining why he is not a Socialist and this article pretty much sums up what my point is. To clarify again, I am not in favor of total Socialism and the elimination of Capitalism. I am for a blend of both, much like we have now, but a bit more Socialism than we have now.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/13/AR2009031301899.html

 

You can put lipstick on that pig, and call him a democrat all you want, his policies are geared to take MY wealth and distribute it to the masses that feel they are entitled or "needy" while at the same time NOT raising the bar on their accountability. No thank you. We don't need more social programs and gov't involvement. We need to strive to improve the programs in place so less people on in need of social programs and can actually EARN their own fucking living and make better choices.

[Slowbalt]

You can put lipstick on that pig, and call him a democrat all you want, his policies are geared to take MY wealth and distribute it to the masses that feel they are entitled or "needy" while at the same time NOT raising the bar on their accountability. No thank you. We don't need more social programs and gov't involvement. We need to strive to improve the programs in place so less people on in need of social programs and can actually EARN their own fucking living and make better choices.

 

You just keep repeating the same thing over and over again. I got it, you are for the "socialization" of education, taxes, roads, etc but you don't want the poor people to have your hard earned, American made dollars. You have repeatedly chanted about how Obama is a Socialist and I was just providing some direct, real world info straight from a Socialist. This article also critiques Obama about some of his policies that I also agree with. You keep repeating how Socialism or at least some socialization lowers the bar and causes people to be lazy and this may be true if you were to let unregulated Socialism go compared to unregulated Capitalism. Capitalism would produce more Capital as thats the purpose of it, however Socialism would maintain an adequat lifestyle for all. I do not need millions of dollars to be happy. Between the two I would most certainly rather live in a Socialist country but this is purely hypothetical anyway since it is hard to find unregulated anything.

[wagner]

You just keep repeating the same thing over and over again. I got it, you are for the "socialization" of education, taxes, roads, etc but you don't want the poor people to have your hard earned, American made dollars. You have repeatedly chanted about how Obama is a Socialist and I was just providing some direct, real world info straight from a Socialist. This article also critiques Obama about some of his policies that I also agree with. You keep repeating how Socialism or at least some socialization lowers the bar and causes people to be lazy and this may be true if you were to let unregulated Socialism go compared to unregulated Capitalism. Capitalism would produce more Capital as thats the purpose of it, however Socialism would maintain an adequat lifestyle for all. I do not need millions of dollars to be happy. Between the two I would most certainly rather live in a Socialist country but this is purely hypothetical anyway since it is hard to find unregulated anything.

 

FUCKIN A WALL OF TEST ATTACK!

[wagner]

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/29/thread_backfire.gif

[wagner]

Tripple because this thread is more retarded than most of the people in DC.

 

Let me give you a brief summary of american politics.

 

THEY ALL FUCKING SUCK AND WILL KNIFE THE PUBLIC TO RUN THEIR AGENDA.

 

Your welcome

[CRed05]

I love how so many republicans go, "oh we need less hand outs and smaller government" but as soon as they get laid off or get in a position where they think they might get laid off its "oh the government isnt doing enough" and "oh I'm not getting enough unemployment" Fucking hypocrites.

 

For the record, I'm not devoted to any party, I like and dislike some of the ideas of both, and that's what I hate the most, it's that people get devoted to a party and will agree with everything they say and do just because it's "their party".

 

I don't even want to post in this thread...

[wagner]

I love how so many republicans go, "oh we need less hand outs and smaller government" but as soon as they get laid off or get in a position where they think they might get laid off its "oh the government isnt doing enough" and "oh I'm not getting enough unemployment" Fucking hypocrites.

 

For the record, I'm not devoted to any party, I like and dislike some of the ideas of both, and that's what I hate the most, it's that people get devoted to a party and will agree with everything they say and do just because it's "their party".

 

I don't even want to post in this thread...

 

Epic post my friend. Politics is for hypocrites who play both sides like little kids play both mom and dad. It is almost as bad as organized religion can be.

[copperhead]

I love how so many republicans go, "oh we need less hand outs and smaller government" but as soon as they get laid off or get in a position where they think they might get laid off its "oh the government isnt doing enough" and "oh I'm not getting enough unemployment" Fucking hypocrites.

 

Hmm, I thought employers all pay into an unemployment pool rather than using normal taxes to pay for it. That's why it's so easy for them to get you denied.

[CRed05]

Hmm, I thought employers all pay into an unemployment pool rather than using normal taxes to pay for it. That's why it's so easy for them to get you denied.

 

I just looked it up and you are correct.

 

Benefits are paid by the state from a special fund. The fund gets its money from employers, who pay a tax specifically for this program. The funding mechanism is very different from a system such as workers' compensation, in which an employee receives payments directly from an employer through the employer's insurance company. It is also different from benefit programs that use state general fund money. The fund that pays unemployment insurance benefits is not available for other purposes.

[evan9381]

Hmm, I thought employers all pay into an unemployment pool rather than using normal taxes to pay for it. That's why it's so easy for them to get you denied.

 

they do, but i wouldnt say its "easy" for them to get you denied...when they fired me, they claimed it was for "poor performance", but in reality, about 5 months before that happened, they cut about 45% of the accounts i had, yet expected the same results...i fully expected them to try to deny my claim, but surprisingly, they didnt. they probably could have claimed it was for "just cause"...theres been a couple people from there that got canned and told me work tried to deny them, but they eventually got their unemployment

 

as to I Eat Rice - dont be too sad...lol...i like to think of myself as not one of the stupid people who live paycheck to paycheck and i was able to set aside a chunk of change that i could live off for ~6+ months if needed... unemployment insurance is just a supplement, and hopefully here soon i'll be back to work

[TTQ B4U]

You just keep repeating the same thing over and over again. I got it, you are for the "socialization" of education, taxes, roads, etc but you don't want the poor people to have your hard earned, American made dollars.

 

Good. I made myself clear as you're right, especially about MY hard earned dollars.

 

You keep repeating how Socialism or at least some socialization lowers the bar and causes people to be lazy and this may be true if you were to let unregulated Socialism go compared to unregulated Capitalism. Capitalism would produce more Capital as thats the purpose of it, however Socialism would maintain an adequat lifestyle for all.

 

I still stand by most of our even current non-"socialis"t but still social programs, do little to encourage anything but lackadaisical attitudes. I also have little interest in paying more of mmy money into a system to create anything that pulls money away from those with it just to provide an adequate system for all. I'm sorry, but I'm not working my ass off to pull together an adequate life for everyone else. We pay enough taxes to fund the programs we have now. As it is, I cough up 35+% of my money every month for others to mis-manage. BULLSHIT that I'm interest in giving more. What our current programs need is some personal accountability and responsibility and measures for both against those utilizing those programs.

 

If you or anyone else feels differently, then come argue with me from a position of strength and accomplishment by putting my very desired accountability and responsibility in place using our existing systems, measure the progress against some solid thought out goals. Do that FIRST to SHOW ME not just bullshit TELL ME that a more socialistic system works. PROVE IT, in a way that is measurable and then use your political dollars and lobbying power ONCE YOU'VE PROVED SUCCESS. Sell that success vs pie in the sky hype that you believe socialism is better.

 

Make it work here in the US with what we have and you'll have my attention and that of many others. Otherwise, you have very little of my trust and respect and belief that what you're selling isn't just more bullshit water of a different flavor. "Success has ears" as they say. I'm listening? Are you talking? Now go tell Obama and his people that I say fuck his let's spend trillions to "find out" if his "hurry up and pass me now" health care bill will work. He has very low buy in. Again, a great orator but a lousy manager. As a manager myself, I need trust, respect and buy-in from my people. As a manager your people should want to work hard for you. I don't see that he's achieved that with his people...aka the US.

 

I do not need millions of dollars to be happy. Between the two I would most certainly rather live in a Socialist country but this is purely hypothetical anyway since it is hard to find unregulated anything.

 

You're welcome to move, so why are you still here? IMO, you're better off making a decent living of your own and staying in the US. Anything is possible here.

[Drewhop]

Slowbalt can ead.

 

/thread.

[Slowbalt]

If you or anyone else feels differently, then come argue with me from a position of strength and accomplishment by putting my very desired accountability and responsibility in place using our existing systems, measure the progress against some solid thought out goals.

 

There is still accountablility and responsibility in a Socialist system so I really don't understand where you are getting this. My goal is healthcare for everyone......bam!....I win. We don't and can't have that without "Socializing" our system.

 

 

Do that FIRST to SHOW ME not just bullshit TELL ME that a more socialistic system works. PROVE IT, in a way that is measurable and then use your political dollars and lobbying power ONCE YOU'VE PROVED SUCCESS. Sell that success vs pie in the sky hype that you believe socialism is better.

 

This is exactly what Marx says actually. Socialism is but one step after Capitalism but before Communism. You keep implying that I think Socialism is better than Capitalism but I have not said this. It depends on what you mean by "better" but I have stated many times a blend of both ideologies is best (as far as we know until a better system comes out).

 

 

Make it work here in the US with what we have and you'll have my attention and that of many others. Otherwise, you have very little of my trust and respect and belief that what you're selling isn't just more bullshit water of a different flavor. "Success has ears" as they say. I'm listening? Are you talking? Now go tell Obama and his people that I say fuck his let's spend trillions to "find out" if his "hurry up and pass me now" health care bill will work. He has very low buy in. Again, a great orator but a lousy manager. As a manager myself, I need trust, respect and buy-in from my people. As a manager your people should want to work hard for you. I don't see that he's achieved that with his people...aka the US.

 

I don't know how I am somehow supposed to make the US more Socialist to "prove" this to you so.........

 

On a side note I find it interesting how everyone seems to think they know more than the President and that they know whats best for the world. The President is privy to all kinds of information we are not. That being said I would not say that I agree with everything he says/ does but it would be foolish of me to say that I know how to handle the economy better than he.

 

You're welcome to move, so why are you still here? IMO, you're better off making a decent living of your own and staying in the US. Anything is possible here.

 

You seem to not understand my statement so I will try to make it a bit more clear. IF I were to decide between a PURELY Capitalist country or a PURELY Socialist country (none of these exist) I would THEN choose a Socialist country. I say this because unregulated Capitalism leads to monopolies and ownership of everything by businesses trying to make a buck instead of being concerned for the welfare of the people. Socialism would not lead to the biggest earnings but an adequat and sustainable living for everyone. You seem to get so bent out of shape about how Socialism is evil. Let me define Socialism because there is a very real misunderstanding of the term as it is a "bad word" as of recently.

 

Socialism is an economic and political theory advocating public or common ownership and cooperative management of the means of production and allocation of resources

 

Thats it, very simple. We ought to have more ownership, not less.

[I Eat Rice]

as to I Eat Rice - dont be too sad...lol...i like to think of myself as not one of the stupid people who live paycheck to paycheck and i was able to set aside a chunk of change that i could live off for ~6+ months if needed... unemployment insurance is just a supplement, and hopefully here soon i'll be back to work

I can dig it man wish you the best of luck. At least you were one of the smart people that didn't live outside of your means and was able to save some bread back in case of a time of need.

 

 

You're welcome to move, so why are you still here? IMO, you're better off making a decent living of your own and staying in the US. Anything is possible here.

I hardy believe anything is possible in the United States anymore. Maybe for some ie the privledged, but we are hardly a land of opportunity.

[kirks5oh]

My goal is healthcare for everyone......bam!....I win. We don't and can't have that without "Socializing" our system.

.

 

you're basically a clueless fucking idiot. all the freeloading non-workers out there with nothing better to do but constantly go to the doctor's office with every minor complaint will clog up the system for hardworking people who are not constantly looking for obama's handout. i've seen this in my private practice, as i work for a hospital that offers care to patients without insurance. what that will lead to is an extremely long wait to get into a physician's office. so everyone gets healthcare---hooray!! you just might have to wait a couple years, and jump through ridiculous hoops if you need a surgery done.

 

not to mention, any doctor with a brain will likely move to a cash-only practice that does not accept the government plan. so enjoy getting cared for by the 'b' team.

 

feel free to exit the health care discussion. asshole.

[Slowbalt]

you're basically a clueless fucking idiot. all the freeloading non-workers out there with nothing better to do but constantly go to the doctor's office with every minor complaint will clog up the system for hardworking people who are not constantly looking for obama's handout. i've seen this in my private practice, as i work for a hospital that offers care to patients without insurance. what that will lead to is an extremely long wait to get into a physician's office. so everyone gets healthcare---hooray!! you just might have to wait a couple years, and jump through ridiculous hoops if you need a surgery done.

 

not to mention, any doctor with a brain will likely move to a cash-only practice that does not accept the government plan. so enjoy getting cared for by the 'b' team.

 

feel free to exit the health care discussion. asshole.

 

So because you assume I disagree with you, I must be an asshole and a fucking idiot? You guys are funny. Everyone keeps quoting what they assume to be the negative consequences of universal healthcare without even trying to grasp all of the good. I would much rather have a dr operating on me that enjoys their job and likes to help people than a dr who is trying to pad his wallet. We really need to get over this whole "waiting years" to see a dr and how the government tells you who you can see as this is simply false fearmongering. I have a rather small copay and I very rarely (once every 3-4 years) visit the dr. Not because I am afraid of paying 15 bucks but because I don't need to. We can think up disaster scenarios all day long but that doesn't help us solve any problems. Feel free to exit the healthcare profession.

[V8 Beast]

So because you assume I disagree with you, I must be an asshole and a fucking idiot? You guys are funny. Everyone keeps quoting what they assume to be the negative consequences of universal healthcare without even trying to grasp all of the good. I would much rather have a dr operating on me that enjoys their job and likes to help people than a dr who is trying to pad his wallet. We really need to get over this whole "waiting years" to see a dr and how the government tells you who you can see as this is simply false fearmongering. I have a rather small copay and I very rarely (once every 3-4 years) visit the dr. Not because I am afraid of paying 15 bucks but because I don't need to. We can think up disaster scenarios all day long but that doesn't help us solve any problems. Feel free to exit the healthcare profession.

 

He's calling you an idiot because you have tunnel vision. The cost to see a doctor definitely stops people from freely going when ever they think they have an issue. Not everyone has a $15 copay, a lot of people have to pay 100% due to having no insurance at all. Think about the number of people in the US that currently do not have insurance and may be dealing with an issue. What kind of flood of people would you expect to see if they were all told on January 1st they all had full coverage?

[Slowbalt]

While I obviously do not speak for everybody, I was citing my usage of the dr and my reasons. It would not matter to me the cost, if I had to see a dr, I would need to pay the required amount. It could be free or 100 pr visit, I only go to the dr when I need to. I'm sure there would be an increase in dr visits due to the people who do not have the cash to pay now finally having better options. The status quo is unsustainable and getting more expensive every day. My employer may even drop my healthcare.

 

http://www.latimes.com/health/la-fi-cal-insurance-20101203,0,7997564.story

 

With the increase in traffic we could incentivize people to work hard, be accountable for their carrer, and have the opportunity for success and become dr's. The government subsidizes the agriculture industry/and they can subsidize needed educational fields.

 

I haven't heard your plan yet, toughguy.

[V8 Beast]

While I obviously do not speak for everybody, I was citing my usage of the dr and my reasons. It would not matter to me the cost, if I had to see a dr, I would need to pay the required amount. It could be free or 100 pr visit, I only go to the dr when I need to. I'm sure there would be an increase in dr visits due to the people who do not have the cash to pay now finally having better options. The status quo is unsustainable and getting more expensive every day. My employer may even drop my healthcare.

 

http://www.latimes.com/health/la-fi-cal-insurance-20101203,0,7997564.story

 

With the increase in traffic we could incentivize people to work hard, be accountable for their carrer, and have the opportunity for success and become dr's. The government subsidizes the agriculture industry/and they can subsidize needed educational fields.

 

I haven't heard your plan yet, toughguy.

 

 

If I had a plan it would be simple.. get a job and take care of yourself. If you dont have a job or your job has a horrible plan use your resources to find other options. This bottlefed mentality is not helping anyone. If you give people hand-outs instead of making them work they have no incentive to continue or start working. I want to provide for my family so I work and pay for insurance. With this plan I would work and help pay for everyone. Who are the unemployed paying for? Doesnt seem fair to have to bust my ass so a career loser can get his herpes treated for free...

 

Most people that have insurance only go when they need to go. The number of people alone that would have that option would make it hell for doctors. Most people only go when they are sick. If there is no charge there is nothing stopping someone from doing it for shits and giggles. Not to mention the people that would treat it like free customer service and keep going back to different doctors until they got the answer they wanted. Or they would get people like you that are too lazy to search for info and would stop by a doctor for something they didnt need to

[kirks5oh]

While I obviously do not speak for everybody, I was citing my usage of the dr and my reasons. It would not matter to me the cost, if I had to see a dr, I would need to pay the required amount. It could be free or 100 pr visit, I only go to the dr when I need to. I'm sure there would be an increase in dr visits due to the people who do not have the cash to pay now finally having better options. The status quo is unsustainable and getting more expensive every day. My employer may even drop my healthcare.

 

http://www.latimes.com/health/la-fi-cal-insurance-20101203,0,7997564.story

 

With the increase in traffic we could incentivize people to work hard, be accountable for their carrer, and have the opportunity for success and become dr's. The government subsidizes the agriculture industry/and they can subsidize needed educational fields.

 

I haven't heard your plan yet, toughguy.

 

again, you're throwing out stupid ideas when you have absolutely no clue about health care in the united states, patterns of utilization, etc. you assume that there will only be a slight increase in health care visits but you really have no idea how people utilize medicine in the US. you assume that all these uninsured patients will only see a doctor every 3-4 years like you??? no, these are the people who (as sad as it is to say this) don't take care of themselves, eat too much, drink too much, don't have proper hygiene, do insanely dumb things to injure themselves (shooting, DUI's, etc), and basically would be 'killed off' aka darwinism, if it wasn't for the fact that emergency rooms cannot turn patients away----you need a reality check. i suggest you walk your fairy ass into the emergency department at mt. carmel west, or grant hospital in the middle of a weekday and see for yourself. these people would see their new, obama-supplied family doctor at least once a week, asking for pain medication.

 

you can't even begin to talk about health care reform in the US without first tackling tort reform. rising malpractice insurance, and frivolous lawsuits have literally shut down practices all across the US because people cannot afford to practice medicine. the new health care bill says nothing about that. in fact, everything in medicine these days is aimed at raising patient expectations to unrealistic levels---medicare refusing to reimburse hospitals for readmissions after patients have an "accepted" complication from a procedure. you can't even begin to imagine how many tests are ordered in medicine that are simply ordered to 'cover your ass' and protect against lawsuits.

 

 

i don't have a plan to tackle health care reform, but i can recognize the current plan is shit. i just know that when the shit hits the fan, and people are fed up with gov't insurance telling them they cannot have their knee replacement until they wear a brace for a year, do 6 months physical therapy, and lose 50lbs----i will be more than willing to put my expertise to work for them in my privately run, cash-only clinic.

 

people go into medicine because it IS gratifying to help people, mainly when they are grateful for your help. it is not gratifying to baby sit people with bullshit-fake problems who are only looking for a way to sue you. that is why the average career for an ER physician is not nearly as long as it is for other fields of medicine. it is also a career where traditionally, you can make a very good living---that is expected, and deserved for the stress that comes with knowing peoples' lives are constantly in your hands, taking call every 4th night for 30 years being called to the hospital at 3am for an emergency, and spending 10 years after college learning how to treat every disease known to man. you cannot incentivize people to go into the field by telling them you will forgive $100k of their student loans. you CAN incentivize them by assuring them you will not cut $50k of their salary every year over a 30 year career. or that all malpractice suits must be tried in front of a commitee of neutral health care experts to determine if they're even valid lawsuits, while limiting the maximum payoff from these lawsuits. or assuring them you will let them practice medicine their way---not allowing insurance companies to reimburse them as they see fit for certain things, but not others.