TTQ B4U Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 Welcome to Columbus Bench Racing, where winter has no snow and the mathematicians rule. FWIW, I think the car has some style and would be fun to drive. There will always be someone faster, so who gives a shit. When 90'% of them here are 10 year old F-Bodies and Fox Body Mustangs that are a dime a dozen, I'll rock something like the new BRZ any day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm having a hard time understanding the resentment to this car coming out. "Oh it's underpowered, booo hooo, it should have 500hp and destroy cars that cost twice as much." When almost all new "sports cars" that are coming out are tipping past 4000lbs on the scale. Some of the lightest are still past 3200lbs.... and here comes a light, nimble, RWD car that gets shunned because it won't be a capable drag racing car. This is the direction sports cars need to take. They need to rediscover their roots and what even makes them a sports car. I almost cried reading this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordell Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm having a hard time understanding the resentment to this car coming out. "Oh it's underpowered, booo hooo, it should have 500hp and destroy cars that cost twice as much." When almost all new "sports cars" that are coming out are tipping past 4000lbs on the scale. Some of the lightest are still past 3200lbs.... and here comes a light, nimble, RWD car that gets shunned because it won't be a capable drag racing car. This is the direction sports cars need to take. They need to rediscover their roots and what even makes them a sports car. I will agree with this, but you have to remember that a muscle car and a sports car are two different things. What I think is funny is how the muscle car guys hate on it, and the sports car guys love it. I'd like to think that I have a good appreciation for both. I find the BRZ and FR-S truely interesting, but I want to see them out for a few years before I really pass any judgement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farkas Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm having a hard time understanding the resentment to this car coming out. "Oh it's underpowered, booo hooo, it should have 500hp and destroy cars that cost twice as much." When almost all new "sports cars" that are coming out are tipping past 4000lbs on the scale. Some of the lightest are still past 3200lbs.... and here comes a light, nimble, RWD car that gets shunned because it won't be a capable drag racing car. This is the direction sports cars need to take. They need to rediscover their roots and what even makes them a sports car. A new sports car with everything you would ever want within a reasonable price range. I find the BRZ and FR-S truely interesting, but I want to see them out for a few years before I really pass any judgement. I'll let you take mine for a spin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 A new sports car with everything you would ever want within a reasonable price range. I'll let you take mine for a spin This is were personal opinion & taste come into play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordell Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 A new sports car with everything you would ever want within a reasonable price range. I'll let you take mine for a spin I guess if you're getting one, I'll have to take you up on that offer in the first few days before the thing drags the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farkas Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 This is were personal opinion & taste come into play. Sports car... not sporty 4-door that weighs a ton, leather heated seats, has zero driver feed-back, and every electric option available lol. You're right though, opinion and taste. I would be fine if the FR-S didn't come with a cup holder lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 Sports car... not sporty 4-door that weighs a ton, leather heated seats, has zero driver feed-back, and every electric option available lol. You're right though, opinion and taste. I would be fine if the FR-S didn't come with a cup holder lol. I'm scaling those down. See you at auto-x with my new 2 Door, driver feedback orientated car. :dumb: I have trouble calling a car that would get outrun by a modern minivan or CRV a sports car. :lolguy: PS: I'd still put $$ on S4 vs BRZ in Auto-X :fuckyeah: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armin922 Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 nice care but needs more hp IMO. We'll see, subaru may come out with more power after the first year of production Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copperhead Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm going to get flamed for this but in a couple years i can see myself debating hard between a BRZ/FRS and an awd Dart for a daily driver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco-REX Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm scaling those down. See you at auto-x with my new 2 Door, driver feedback orientated car. :dumb: I have trouble calling a car that would get outrun by a modern minivan or CRV a sports car. :lolguy: PS: I'd still put $$ on S4 vs BRZ in Auto-X :fuckyeah: 2012 CRV is over 8 seconds to 60, so are most all mini vans. The BRZ does 0-60 around 6 seconds. Not seeing where the argument is. A car doesn't need OMGWTFBBQ hp if it isn't lugging two fucking tons around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 2012 CRV is over 8 seconds to 60, so are most all mini vans. The BRZ does 0-60 around 6 seconds. Not seeing where the argument is. A car doesn't need OMGWTFBBQ hp if it isn't lugging two fucking tons around. But a Rav 4 with a V6 will kick it's ass in the 1320'. Even worse, the grandpa in a Camery V6 or me in the Fusion Sport will too. I still like the styling though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco-REX Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 It'll beat a Miata too. *shrug* If I wanted to go fast in a straight line, I'd buy an F-body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gergwheel1647545492 Posted February 29, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 A car doesn't need OMGWTFBBQ hp if it isn't lugging two fucking tons around. This is about the power level i think i'm at with my pilot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordell Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 It'll beat a Miata too. *shrug* If I wanted to go fast in a straight line, I'd buy an F-body. boy this sounds so familiar, I've heard this somewhere before :lolguy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaSSon Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm going to get flamed for this but in a couple years i can see myself debating hard between a BRZ/FRS and an awd Dart for a daily driver 2008 135. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AudiOn19s Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 You know the manufacturer did something good when there's THIS much passion surrounding the car. Good or bad doesn't matter, everyone has strong feelings about it which means they all took notice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco-REX Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 boy this sounds so familiar, I've heard this somewhere before :lolguy: I'm sure that argument is all over CR. There are two main camps to performance driving enthusiasts; I call them Neck-Snappers and Side-Loaders. Neck-Snappers get more enjoyment out of being forced back into their seat upholstery and traveling over the ground like a bullet. Corners, for them, are interruptions between stints of using their right foot to turn gasoline into ground-tearing torque. Side-Loaders prefer to have their eyeballs fall out their ears and find the longest distance between two points. To them, straightaways are for relaxing, taking a break and pondering the mysteries of life before diving into the next corner and trying to push the track's asphalt into a wider arc. Both are valid, and it's certainly possible to find both power and handling in a single car. But the differences show when it comes down to which aspect to compromise on. Do you sacrifice power for handling? Or do you put more of your budget into the engine? The BRZ is a compromise. No one who's looking forward to it will say otherwise. But it's a compromise deeply in favor of handling over power. There are certainly other cars out there in the same price bracket that have more power, but they won't handle like the BRZ. It won't appeal to everyone, and I'm perfectly ok with that. Does that mean I wouldn't want more power? Of course not. But I don't think it *needs* it either. In a few years I might eyeball the higher powered versions that are sure to come out and see what's available. I think supercharging is a better choice for the BRZ/FR-S platform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyM3rC Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I have trouble calling a car that would get outrun by a modern minivan or CRV a sports car. :lolguy: Yeah having a sporty car that has to go WOT and shift at 4000rpm just to keep up with the tahoes and odysseys stoplight-to-stoplight makes for a totally sucky experience. They may be "handling cars" or "economical" or whatever, but 99% of buyers don't want to get smoked trying to merge by a pedestrian land-yacht. I'd expect 170rwhp would be enough to keep up just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordell Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm sure that argument is all over CR. There are two main camps to performance driving enthusiasts; I call them Neck-Snappers and Side-Loaders. Neck-Snappers get more enjoyment out of being forced back into their seat upholstery and traveling over the ground like a bullet. Corners, for them, are interruptions between stints of using their right foot to turn gasoline into ground-tearing torque. Side-Loaders prefer to have their eyeballs fall out their ears and find the longest distance between two points. To them, straightaways are for relaxing, taking a break and pondering the mysteries of life before diving into the next corner and trying to push the track's asphalt into a wider arc. Both are valid, and it's certainly possible to find both power and handling in a single car. But the differences show when it comes down to which aspect to compromise on. Do you sacrifice power for handling? Or do you put more of your budget into the engine? The BRZ is a compromise. No one who's looking forward to it will say otherwise. But it's a compromise deeply in favor of handling over power. There are certainly other cars out there in the same price bracket that have more power, but they won't handle like the BRZ. It won't appeal to everyone, and I'm perfectly ok with that. Does that mean I wouldn't want more power? Of course not. But I don't think it *needs* it either. In a few years I might eyeball the higher powered versions that are sure to come out and see what's available. I think supercharging is a better choice for the BRZ/FR-S platform. I have to totally agree, I really enjoy both and feel that it really takes two cars to acheive those sensations. My Camaro is great at neck snapping, but if it handled well the hit you in the ass feel wouldn't be as dramatic. Same thing with my Miata, if it was fast then the handlingwouldn't stand out as much. Someday I'll have a car to do both, but I really like switching between the two. Its so much fun getting back into the other car because its such a different feel. I wish more people would learn to appreciate the differences, but of course a year ago I wouldn't have seen the appeal in the BRZ either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm really impressed by the weight figures for this car. I hope they stay true through to the production car. What kind of tires will you be able to put under it? That thing would be a track terror if you could get at least 255s under each corner and have it down to 2500-ish lbs without giving up streetability. FWIW, when the e36 M3 came out it was 240hp and around 3000lbs and widely regarded as THE sportscar of its time. My friend has a track ready e36 M3 that weighs about 2700lbs with a stock motor and I can say that it's an absolute rip to drive. When it comes to my M3, I'd probably give up the 40hp for the 400lbs difference if I had the option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco-REX Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 I'm really impressed by the weight figures for this car. I hope they stay true through to the production car. What kind of tires will you be able to put under it? That thing would be a track terror if you could get at least 255s under each corner and have it down to 2500-ish lbs without giving up streetability. FWIW, when the e36 M3 came out it was 240hp and around 3000lbs and widely regarded as THE sportscar of its time. My friend has a track ready e36 M3 that weighs about 2700lbs with a stock motor and I can say that it's an absolute rip to drive. When it comes to my M3, I'd probably give up the 40hp for the 400lbs difference if I had the option. 2770 seems to be pretty solid. Of course, until someone drives one onto a set of scales, we can't be 100% sure. But Vorshlag is taking a very close look at the FR-S/BRZ. They think 245s are doable with 255s likely needing some light fender work. And as I mentioned above, they think a 100lb weight savings should be pretty easy with a well made exhaust and light battery. So I think a 2300lb track weight might be possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 255s would be ambitious. I'd expect 225s would become standard, with some brave souls maybe trying something as large as 245. But that's based on nothing but the pictures I've seen. In any case, 225s would be plenty for most people while still staying within a reasonable budget. I've been making do with 150hp in 2280lbs and it's plenty fast. In fact, I dare say that my car is more fun with 125whp than when it had 230whp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farkas Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 Its so much fun getting back into the other car because its such a different feel. I wish more people would learn to appreciate the differences, but of course a year ago I wouldn't have seen the appeal in the BRZ either. Scott?!? lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littleguy Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 The only thing I really don't like about the FR-S is the way the back end of the car looks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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