greg1647545532 Posted December 31, 2020 Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 I guess moving on like an adult includes making drunken 2am posts about Biden's size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh8sti Posted December 31, 2020 Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 night watch baby duty, no drinking unfortunately! I think its fair game to call out this admin on spin, lies and bullshit. I noticed you did not disagree with my original statement though. Thats telling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted December 31, 2020 Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 At the height of a pandemic that is killing 3000+ Americans a day, Joe Biden, who has consistently shown a willingness to listen to the advice of public health experts, who has consistently chosen not to hold large rallies in compliance with that advice, is actually, according to you, holding a small inauguration event because he's afraid of being outclassed by Trump? I disagree with your original statement. On what planet is "Coronavirus is really bad right now so we're limiting attendance at the inauguration" spin, lies or bullshit? It's 100% the truth, buddy. Hey remember when conservatives said "Democrats will all forget about coronavirus after the election?" Trump said, "Just watch, it will all magically go away." Meanwhile it's been the #1 cause of death in the US for the last, what, month? It did not go away, and Democrats are still the only ones acting like it hasn't gone away. Can you imagine why this libertarian refuses to vote R until the Republicans start living in the same reality that I do? My prediction: You are not going to act like an adult and move on. You are going to spend the next 4 years whining about Biden over things you pretend he's doing badly. Old man bad. Biden derangement syndrome. Echo, echo, echo.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace1647545504 Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 I love the way they report covid is the cause of death...if you're in a car accident, then test positive for covid then die...it's reported as a covid death. The true covid death reports are skewed as hospital receive a better payment if the death is "covid" related. If you test positive for the flu then die of a heart attack they report the death as a heart attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodus Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 I love the way they report covid is the cause of death...if you're in a car accident, then test positive for covid then die...it's reported as a covid death. The true covid death reports are skewed as hospital receive a better payment if the death is "covid" related. If you test positive for the flu then die of a heart attack they report the death as a heart attack.Is that's true, you almost have to inflate the death count to justify all the lock downs, curfews, masks, measures, etc. You have to show the public that the loss of small businesses was worth it because the deaths could have been much more than they already are. Sent from my SM-F916U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gillbot Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 I love the way they report covid is the cause of death...if you're in a car accident, then test positive for covid then die...it's reported as a covid death. The true covid death reports are skewed as hospital receive a better payment if the death is "covid" related. If you test positive for the flu then die of a heart attack they report the death as a heart attack. They typically list both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 Mace, are you interested in learning why you might be misinformed about this topic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 I love the way they report covid is the cause of death...if you're in a car accident, then test positive for covid then die...it's reported as a covid death. The true covid death reports are skewed as hospital receive a better payment if the death is "covid" related. If you test positive for the flu then die of a heart attack they report the death as a heart attack.Not true, and the statistics show that the COVID deaths are likely severely undercounted. Also, I believe hospitals are being paid more for every patient, not just COVID patients, due to all the extra safety protocols/extra PPE they are using on everyone. Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spankis Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 Mace, are you interested in learning why you might be misinformed about this topic? I'm interested in learning why Mace might be misinformed. I continue to encounter other Maces at work who repeat the same lines but can't provide sources much beyond hearsay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace1647545504 Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 I have a friend working in the medical field and he has told me this. He deals in private practices but negotiates sales with hospitals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 I have a friend working in the medical field and he has told me this. He deals in private practices but negotiates sales with hospitals So that's a no, you're not interesting in learning how your friend might have given you some bad information? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace1647545504 Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 greg..sure..sorry I was answering another post Whatca got Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh8sti Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 At the height of a pandemic that is killing 3000+ Americans a day, Joe Biden, who has consistently shown a willingness to listen to the advice of public health experts, who has consistently chosen not to hold large rallies in compliance with that advice, is actually, according to you, holding a small inauguration event because he's afraid of being outclassed by Trump? I disagree with your original statement. On what planet is "Coronavirus is really bad right now so we're limiting attendance at the inauguration" spin, lies or bullshit? It's 100% the truth, buddy. Hey remember when conservatives said "Democrats will all forget about coronavirus after the election?" Trump said, "Just watch, it will all magically go away." Meanwhile it's been the #1 cause of death in the US for the last, what, month? It did not go away, and Democrats are still the only ones acting like it hasn't gone away. Can you imagine why this libertarian refuses to vote R until the Republicans start living in the same reality that I do? My prediction: You are not going to act like an adult and move on. You are going to spend the next 4 years whining about Biden over things you pretend he's doing badly. Old man bad. Biden derangement syndrome. Echo, echo, echo.... thats a long post to say "please dont hold this admin accountable...I promise they are doing everything right, Biden says so." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 thats a long post to say "please dont hold this admin accountable...I promise they are doing everything right, Biden says so." I noticed you didn't disagree with anything I said though. That's telling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 thats a long post to say "please dont hold this admin accountable...I promise they are doing everything right, Biden says so."I think it was a long post to say that this administration is practicing what they preach, instead of releasing a bunch of guidelines for everyone to follow only to violate them for their own personal interests while stoking political division in states that actually followed the guidelines. Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeitgeist57 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-raffensperger-call-georgia-vote/2021/01/03/d45acb92-4dc4-11eb-bda4-615aaefd0555_story.html Trump, this guy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-raffensperger-call-georgia-vote/2021/01/03/d45acb92-4dc4-11eb-bda4-615aaefd0555_story.html Trump, this guy... I read through the transcript this morning... holy shit. My favorite part is where the GA SoS is trying to explain to Trump that "people are saying" isn't actually evidence: RAFFENSPERGER: Mr. President, the problem you have with social media, they — people can say anything. TRUMP: Oh, this isn’t social media. This is Trump media. It’s not social media. It’s really not, it’s not social media. I don’t care about social media. I couldn’t care less. Trump media. Where everything is true. Humor aside, I hope the house impeaches Trump today, I hope he's removed from office prior to the inauguration, and I hope he serves prison time over this. Every American should be fed up over this coup attempt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallard Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 Humor aside, I hope the house impeaches Trump today, I hope he's removed from office prior to the inauguration, and I hope he serves prison time over this. No. Removing him from office gives Pence the opportunity to pardon him, even though I like standing on principles. Every American should be fed up over this coup attempt. Agree 100%. This is a mob boss shakedown, not democracy in action, but judging by peoples reaction to Republican senators planning to object to the electoral college results there are very few true patriots on that side of the aisle. Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh8sti Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 Context is always important....That’s probably why you don’t see anyone on the right giving a shit about it after listening to the full recording. Good luck with the impeachment though, go nuts, really. https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=IES1_1609774899 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 Context is always important....That’s probably why you don’t see anyone on the right giving a shit about it after listening to the full recording. Good luck with the impeachment though, go nuts, really. https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=IES1_1609774899 Panduh, the recording was released by the GA Secretary of State's office in response to Trump lying about the contents of the phone call in a Sunday morning tweet. In other words, Republican elected officials released this in order to hold Trump accountable for lying. Do you think it's "fair game to call out this admin on spin, lies and bullshit." Or do you "not give a shit." Your words say that one of your principles is calling out people for lying, but your actions say otherwise. You should be applauding Raffensperger for release this recording to expose Trump's lies, and excoriating Trump for not only lying, but for making this disgusting phone call in the first place. Where are your principles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 greg..sure..sorry I was answering another post Whatca got OK, if you want to cut to the chase you can start with this article, which is sourced (via direct conversations with county officials and medical experts) and therefore more thorough than I can be with only Google at my fingertips. 1. If you want take a step back though, consider the Sagan standard that "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." There have been 360,000 deaths attributed to COVID thus far, or approximately 300,000 more than in a very bad influenza year. The claim that COVID numbers are "inflated" by accident victims (or other reasons) to any significant degree is truly an extraordinary claim. We're talking about a significant portion of the 300,000 "additional" COVID deaths to be recorded on fraudulent death certificates, by 10s of thousands of doctors willing to risk their careers to pad the numbers. In addition, there are thousands or 10s of thousands of county, local, and state officials, plus hospital staff, who have access to those death records and would therefore be in a position to blow the whole scam wide open, simply by presenting evidence. Some states have public death records, so the whole thing could be exposed by simple public records requests. In states that don't, the families of accident victims fraudulently recorded as COVID deaths could release the death certificates themselves. Certainly a large number of the thousands upon thousands of people mentioned above are COVID deniers or staunch conservatives who would even have a vested interest in producing such evidence. It is simply beyond reason that a conspiracy of this size could go on without producing an extraordinary amount of evidence. And yet, every time we hear this claim, it's presented without such evidence, and that can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. 2. So what about the cases we do know about? My Google-fu found a handful, to varying degrees of believability/concern. While "a handful" is not the "extraordinary evidence" required, in the interest of completeness, let's look at them. One case, popularized by FL governor Ron DeSantis and probably the source of the urban legend, is of a motorcycle fatality which was listed as a COVID death. This was corrected once it was pointed out. Followup examinations by local news organizations found a few others, but all were caught and corrected. Part of the problem is that dead people who test positive for the coronavirus are reported, by necessity, as having the coronavirus, even though they may not have died from it. It's important for case numbers and tracking to know that a gunshot victim had the virus, and so that gets marked on a spreadsheet and set up with the official numbers, even if it doesn't get listed on the official death certificate. That appears to be the case for some of these -- the death certificate didn't say COVID for an accident victim, but they tested positive for coronavirus, and there was simply an error when sending up the data. Errors on a small scale like this happen, and are not in and of themselves reason to question the scope of the government's reporting. The other problem is that people may enter the hospital for one thing and die of another thing, as was the case with a PA man who died of COVID after being hospitalized for a motorcycle accident. As an anecdote, my wife's aunt was diagnosed with cancer 7 or 8 years ago, and had a really tough fight (she's now in remission). However, at one point during one of her hospitalizations, she got a staph infection, MRSA, which is something that happens in hospital environments. The MRSA led to sepsis, which led to a double foot amputation. She's alive, as I said, but she could have died. Which leads us to... 3. Causes of death aren't always clear. In my wife's aunt's case, had she died, would the cause of death been organ failure? Caused by sepsis? Caused by the staph infection? Exacerbated by a weakened immune system from chemotherapy treatments? Or the cancer that exposed her to all of that shit in the first place? It's likely that all of those would have been listed on the form in the cause of death section. So what would you make of the 50 year old man who catches COVID in the hospital after a motorcycle accident? Hospitals are all swimming in coronavirus, and if you get hurt and get COVID there and die, is that really any different than getting hurt and having your wound get infected by staph bacteria in the hospital? 4. It's true that hospitals get paid more if a patient has COVID. This is because patients with COVID cost more to treat, so congress authorized funding to provide hospitals with much needed cash to help fight the pandemic. That just makes good sense. Now, an economics 101 understanding of the world does indeed lead one to the possibility that paying hospitals extra for COVID patients may incentivize them to "come up with" more COVID patients. However, there have been 21 million COVID cases so far in the US, and roughly 10% of those require hospitalization. That's over 2 million hospitalizations for COVID. If any significant fraction of those were fraudulently reported, say, the same 83% we used in point 1 above, that's 1.75 million fraudulent claims that doctors and hospitals have submitted. That many fraudulent claims would produce a mountain of evidence, and as yet there is no evidence that doctors and hospitals are risking their careers to do this. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and that which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. 5. I hope at this point I've shown why we have every reason to be skeptical of general claims that COVID is being overreported, and specific claims that accident victims are being logged as COVID deaths to any meaningful degree. But consider now that there are people with a vested interest in misleading the public with these claims. People who, like Exodus insinuated, want to convince the public that the lockdowns and extraordinary measures that our governments have taken to curb the spread of the virus weren't really necessary. By all means, be skeptical of the data and evidence the government is putting out in regards to the severity of COVID. But you should be even more skeptical of anyone suggesting that the government is putting out false numbers without presenting the extraordinary amount of evidence required to counter the government's ample evidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh8sti Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 Panduh, the recording was released by the GA Secretary of State's office in response to Trump lying about the contents of the phone call in a Sunday morning tweet. In other words, Republican elected officials released this in order to hold Trump accountable for lying. Do you think it's "fair game to call out this admin on spin, lies and bullshit." Or do you "not give a shit." Your words say that one of your principles is calling out people for lying, but your actions say otherwise. You should be applauding Raffensperger for release this recording to expose Trump's lies, and excoriating Trump for not only lying, but for making this disgusting phone call in the first place. Where are your principles? I dont have an issue with him releasing it - Release away! Im not concerned with the call because the context of the call itself is being misrepresented by CNN, WAPO etc to get clicks and drum up something to scream about. Trump has been and always will be a terrible speaker, publicly and privately. He thinks hes being smart, but he almost always sounds like an idiot when trying to split hairs on subjects he doesnt know much about. The spin was put on the original story, so trump spins the spin and around and around we go. Thats Politics in the US. Happened with hunters shit, happened with Swalwells shit, happens with trumps seemingly never ending waterfall of shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 I dont have an issue with him releasing it - Release away! Im not concerned with the call because the context of the call itself is being misrepresented by CNN, WAPO etc to get clicks and drum up something to scream about. Trump has been and always will be a terrible speaker, publicly and privately. He thinks hes being smart, but he almost always sounds like an idiot when trying to split hairs on subjects he doesnt know much about. The spin was put on the original story, so trump spins the spin and around and around we go. Thats Politics in the US. Happened with hunters shit, happened with Swalwells shit, happens with trumps seemingly never ending waterfall of shit. Just stop. The Georgia secretary of state said, on Twitter, "Respectfully, President Trump: What you're saying is not true. The truth will come out." He then released the recording. There. Is. No. Spin. The Republican GA Sec of State just called out Trump for lying, and then released incontrovertible proof that he was, indeed, lying. There is no CNN or WaPo involved. "The media" doesn't play into this story at all. We have all of the direct communications between these two people, released directly by the two people themselves. He was caught lying, and you don't care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oh8sti Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 by all means, do your thing, impeach away, yell about the constitution, justify your feelings anyway you want. Im saying that I dont buy the narrative of this story by WAPO and failing another impeachment only makes the purpose of impeachment mean that much less each time a president of any party says or does something people dont like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg1647545532 Posted January 4, 2021 Report Share Posted January 4, 2021 by all means, do your thing, impeach away, yell about the constitution, justify your feelings anyway you want. Im saying that I dont buy the narrative of this story by WAPO and failing another impeachment only makes the purpose of impeachment mean that much less each time a president of any party says or does something people dont like. Do you buy the "narrative" of Republican elected offical Brad Raffensperger, who is actually the one (not CNN or WAPO) who accused Trump of lying? You keep pretending there is a "media" narrative here. There is not. There are two men and one truth. One Republican just called another one a liar. Which Republican is telling the truth? Raffensperger, or Trump? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.