And we see how this administration appreciates the troops

[RVTPilot]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/military/2010-12-06-1Amilitarypay06_ST_N.htm

Cosidering the commentary that has come from 1600 Pensylvania Ave. regarding our fighting men and women, I am surprised by this. I spent the lion's share of my time in the Corps under Clinton's adminsitration, and twice he tried to pass crap like this. Congress wouldn't let him, but the fact he did was beyond insulting. And that was after the first Gulf War was long over.

[Disclaimer]

Bigger than the raise I've been getting. But I'm just a civilian.

If only those GOP guys would let those tax cuts expire for the top 2% of America, we could probably afford to pay those servicemen and women a decent raise.

[RVTPilot]

And how many times has engineering garbage trucks put your life in danger for the freedom of your other garbage truck engineers or the littany of folks who's lives are better due to your truck engineering?

Having worked for both publicly and privately held companies since my time in the Corps was done, that is less than half of the lowest raise I have ever been given, and I have always received one regardless of employer. I'm not saying that to imply anything about my work ethic, more to the practices of a variety of employers I have been in service to.

[RFM]

Sweet! Debt as 250% of GDP.

[Disclaimer]

And how many times has engineering garbage trucks put your life in danger for the freedom of your other garbage truck engineers or the littany of folks who's lives are better due to your truck engineering?

It's not the garbage trucks now so much as the MRAPs

But, in defense of garbage trucks, imagine an America without them... They're kinda important too.

Bottom line is that this goes back to those 'tough decisions' the Deficit Hawks want to make... The only way to get the deficit down AND allow the richest 2% of Americans to keep their tax cut is to make the other 98% of us pay for it by sacrificing. Its the American Way.

Edited December 6, 2010 by JRMMiii

[RVTPilot]

It's not the garbage trucks now so much as the MRAPs

But, in defense of garbage trucks, imagine an America without them... They're kinda important too.

Bottom line is that this goes back to those 'tough decisions' the Deficit Hawks want to make... The only way to get the deficit down AND allow the richest 2% of Americans to keep their tax cut is to make the other 98% of us pay for it by sacrificing. Its the American Way.

I shudder imagining a world without garbage trucks. That would suck very much badly.

Thought I wil admit not having done a TON of research on the impliations of there being or not being a tax cut for the top 2% of wage earners in the country, it does sound as if its something that could be better allocated than padding the pockets of those that are already sufficiently cushioned by dead presidents.

All that said, a 1.4% raise is a slap in the face.

[jporter12]

First off, let me say that for what they do, most of the troops are underpaid.

I don't have time right now to read the article, so if what I say, or ask has been addressed in it, sorry.

Now, I pose this question: With two wars, or conflicts going on right now, what are the numbers like of people actually in the military? Are they higher than normal? I could AMLOST see this as valid reasoning.

Ok, I just did a quick read of the article, and if an additional .5% increase is only going to be $350 Million, that's a mere drop in the bucket, let themn have it.

[jporter12]

Bottom line is that this goes back to those 'tough decisions' the Deficit Hawks want to make... The only way to get the deficit down AND allow the richest 2% of Americans to keep their tax cut is to make the other 98% of us pay for it by sacrificing. Its the American Way.

The bold is the problem. Far too much of our economy is debt based.

[Disclaimer]

Ok, I just did a quick read of the article, and if an additional .5% increase is only going to be $350 Million, that's a mere drop in the bucket, let themn have it.

Just write them a check Porter. NBD.

[Uncle Punk]

The top 2% of earners are already taxed too much leave them alone in fact I think their rates should be reduced beyond what the current rates are set up for. The government should be cutting programs or budgeting better; if they would stay out of programs they shouldn't be fucking around with they could afford to pay for national defense like they are supposed to be doing. You can't bail out companies and cry poor mouth at the same time when your job isn't to bail out people but it is to protect them.

[chevysoldier]

First off, let me say that for what they do, most of the troops are underpaid.

I don't have time right now to read the article, so if what I say, or ask has been addressed in it, sorry.

Now, I pose this question: With two wars, or conflicts going on right now, what are the numbers like of people actually in the military? Are they higher than normal? I could AMLOST see this as valid reasoning.

Ok, I just did a quick read of the article, and if an additional .5% increase is only going to be $350 Million, that's a mere drop in the bucket, let themn have it.

Yes the numbers are higher than normal. With the economy, everyone ran to the military. I know the Army was, as of about a month ago, only taking new recruits with high school diplomas and were not taking prior service personnel of the pay grade E-5 and higher. Bonuses are still to be had, but not like they have been in the recent past. They are more for very particular MOS's like linguists.

[r1crusher]

It's blatantly obvious that this government has not been FOR THE PEOPLE for decades. If people really want to make change for the better how about not electing professional politicians and instead people from the normal ranks of society with sound morals that the majority can agree with.

Republican...Democrat...Left wing...Right wing....flush all that right down the fuckin' toilet. Elect PEOPLE not PARTIES!!!!

[AOW]

I was working for Rite Aid Corp when their stock went from $75/share to $.75/share in about 60 days. We still got a 3% raise and were expecting nothing considering all that was going on.

1.4% for those that are willing and obligated to sacrifice EVERYTHING for an ungrateful asshole like me, is just an outrage. Congress needs skull fucked

[YSR_Racer_99]

Wealth envy. Classic. "You earned it, but I deserve some of it". I'm giving you "some of it" already. A couple of times. First, by giving you a job and a paycheck, and secondly by paying taxes at a higher rate than only one other civilized country. If people would put as much effort into working as they do into trying to find ways to take my money away from me, we'd both be better off.

[Bad324]

Wealth envy. Classic. "You earned it, but I deserve some of it". I'm giving you "some of it" already. A couple of times. First, by giving you a job and a paycheck, and secondly by paying taxes at a higher rate than only one other civilized country. If people would put as much effort into working as they do into trying to find ways to take my money away from me, we'd both be better off.

i heart you

[Disclaimer]

Hey look, ignorance reared it's ugly head again...

Wealth envy. Classic. "You earned it, but I deserve some of it". I'm giving you "some of it" already. A couple of times. First, by giving you a job and a paycheck, and secondly by paying taxes at a higher rate than only one other civilized country. If people would put as much effort into working as they do into trying to find ways to take my money away from me, we'd both be better off.

Where does this come from? FACTS can't be pulled out of thin air, dude.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/background/numbers/international.cfm

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=306&Topic2id=95

[RVTPilot]

See, now JRMMiii...you take all the fun out of a debate when you go presenting things like facts, and data. Man! Can't we just bicker and argue for the sake of bickering and arguing. This is probably why you aren't married yet. 'Cause all your arguments have to make sense and have merit. Man, you're my boy, but you suck sometimes.

[Disclaimer]

Sry.

I never was a very creative or imaginative-type. It's hard enough dealing with reality, I didn't need to live in a whole other world as well.

It appears the trick is to ignore reality and just live in that fantasy world of your choosing. I'll work on it. Proceed with the OUTRAGE.

[RVTPilot]

Outraging, with permission.

[tyler524]

My question is do those charts state total taxes? Property tax, sales tax, the business tax that is passed down to the consumers, and government fees are all taxes we pay on top of income tax. Hell, tax what we get paid and then when we spend our money we get taxed again and again.

[chevysoldier]

You're born you get taxed, you die and you get taxed. Can't even give a gift without getting taxed. Just wait until they track the air you breath and tax it too.

[YSR_Racer_99]

Just for fun, sit down and add up all of your taxes one day. Payroll, SS, Fica, etc. Property tax. Sales tax. All of those deceptive little charges on your phone bills (universal connectivity charge, so the less fortunate can have phones, paid for by YOU). License plates/ renewals. If you're one of the few who actually pays taxes (i.e. doesn't get them all back at the end of the year, or a large portion of them), odds are that you're paying north of 35%- 40% of your income. THEN tell me that you're not taxed enough. Wouldn't you like to spend some of that yourself? And shouldn't you? If you really feel that you're still not paying enough taxes, please pay some of mine each quarter. Throw me a PM, we'll work it out.

If you're forunate enough to have a good salary job with good benefits, you probably have noooo idea how much your employer really invests in you, and (depending on the company) how much they sacrifice to make it happen.

Take a ride on I-75 between I-70 on the north and Cincinnati on the south. Look at the chronic construction going on (for yearssssss) and the people standing around, and tell me that thats something you're okay paying for. Nice roads? Yep, because they're in a constant state of tear-it-up and lay-it-down (Ratt rocks, BTW). Over. And over. And over.

Does it REALLY not piss you off, the way they waste OUR money? I realize that an infrastructure needs to be supported, but the federal government is using our own money to enslave us, by holding out funding for state projects unless the state bows down to the Federales' wishes. Seat belt law came to being that way, didn't it? And aren't they now trying to make a 50-state helmet law for riders, using the same tactic? The founders didn't intend this. States were supposed to be separate entities, which would attract personality types based on their state government (some more liberal, some more conservative, some more libertarian, etc). To some degree, this happens (i.e. California will probably always be viewed as very liberal, and some midwest states not so much), with the officials elected by people seeking a certain type of governance.

IMHO, Washington is too big, with too much power, and it needs to stop.

If you want communism/ socialism, there are already plenty of countries available to you. And take Danny Glover and Sean Penn with you.

Edited December 6, 2010 by YSR_Racer_99

[tyler524]

I believe that it is the same way for the drinking age. That is set by state but school funding is held over the heads of the states to force them to abide by what the feds want.

[2Wheeler]

How much is minimum wage increasing?

[Disclaimer]

My question is do those charts state total taxes? Property tax, sales tax, the business tax that is passed down to the consumers, and government fees are all taxes we pay on top of income tax. Hell, tax what we get paid and then when we spend our money we get taxed again and again.

From the link - it's right there:

U.S. taxes are low relative to those in other developed countries. In 2006 U.S. taxes at all levels of government claimed 28 percent of GDP, compared with an average of 36 percent of GDP for the 30 member countries of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD).

• Among OECD countries only Mexico, Turkey, Korea, and Japan had lower taxes than the United States as a percentage of GDP. In many European countries taxes exceeded 40 percent of GDP, but those countries generally provide much more extensive government services to their citizens than the United States does.
  
• The United States relies less on consumption taxes—17 percent of total 2006 tax receipts—than any other OECD country. Revenue from such taxes averaged 32 percent of total taxes among the 30 OECD countries. Mexico, in contrast, collected 56 percent of its 2006 tax revenue from consumption taxes.
  
• Personal income taxes made up 36 percent of U.S. tax revenue in 2006, more than in most other OECD countries, where such taxes averaged 25 percent of the total. However, individual taxpayers paid a larger share of tax revenue in Denmark (50 percent), New Zealand (41 percent), and Australia (37 percent).
  
• Corporate income taxes accounted for a slightly larger share of U.S. tax revenue, 12 percent in 2006, than the OECD average of 11 percent.
  
• U.S. employees, on average, contributed more in taxes for retirement and disability insurance—10 percent of total tax receipts—than many of their OECD counterparts, where such taxes accounted for 9 percent of total receipts on average. U.S. employers, however, contributed less: 12 percent of the total compared with OECD employers’ average of 15 percent.