Democrats are selling out America

[Casper]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40565987/ns/business-going_green/

[RFM]

So... The money that we have borrowed from China to spend ourselves back into prosperity has made it's way back to China, with us paying for it for years to come... What's new?

[Disclaimer]

I don't understand why it's a big deal other than showing the Democrats do the same things Republicans have always been doing.

I hope you just put the thread title in to troll some of the more free-thinkers on here into discussing a this because many of the more conservative people on here own foreign vehicles they claim are built in red states that court overseas companies through massive TAX cuts and incentives that total as much or more than $450M. Don't you own a Toyota, Ben?

Toyota, Honda, Nissan - money goes overseas, but jobs created in the US.

Chinese energy firm - same

But, it's the EVIL EVIL Democrats that are selling out. Got it.

[Casper]

I don't understand why it's a big deal other than showing the Democrats do the same things Republicans have always been doing.

I hope you just put the thread title in to troll some of the more free-thinkers on here into discussing a this because many of the more conservative people on here own foreign vehicles they claim are built in red states that court overseas companies through massive TAX cuts and incentives that total as much or more than $450M. Don't you own a Toyota, Ben?

Toyota, Honda, Nissan - money goes overseas, but jobs created in the US.

Chinese energy firm - same

But, it's the EVIL EVIL Democrats that are selling out. Got it.

We own a Toyota Camry, built in Kentucky. American's were paid to build it. That's a far cry from a Chinese company owning the land, building the windmills, etc. Did you read the part about even the windmills are going to be built in China and shipped here? It'd be much different if one of the windmill companies here in Ohio or in PA were building these. That'd still be quite a bit of employment and dollars going back into our economy. But with this deal, every penny and job is going to China. We also own a Ford Ranger that was built in Minnesota.

And lumping Honda in there? They're the only reason Marysville and Bellefontaine still exist. The only other real employer is Scotts, who last I heard was laying people off and making serious cutbacks.

And did US tax dollars go to pay for my car? Was it part of a stimulus package created to keep the US economy afloat? Nope.

So be a free-thinker all you want, but don't forget the thinking part.

PS: As I've said time and time again, I am not a Republican. I'm registered as a Libertarian, and lean a bit more towards the Constitution Party.

[Disclaimer]

We own a Toyota Camry, built in Kentucky. American's were paid to build it. We also own a Ford Ranger that was built in Detroit. That's a far cry from a Chinese company owning the land, building the windmills, etc. Did you read the part about even the windmills are going to be built in China and shipped here? It'd be much different if one of the windmill companies here in Ohio or in PA were building these. That'd still be quite a bit of employment and dollars going back into our economy. But with this deal, every penny is going to China.

I read that part, thats still little difference than what this Japanese automakers do... many of their parts come from Japanese suppliers (though because of their mfg setup, many of those suppliers relocate to the automaker "campus"). How's that different from getting parts from China? They can't ship a fully assembled windmill, so it'll be in pieces (like car parts) and assembled here by Americans to a complete assembly. This will also add business to the logistics companies who have to move all this stuff - more income for Americans and American companies.

I'm not saying I wouldn't rather have AMERICANS build these, but it's no different from what's already going on, so why the Democrat hate? If the ignorant congresspeople would've mandated TARP funds only go to Americans, this wouldn't be an issue. Maybe there was a reason it wasn't written that way? We should answer that question first.

Where's all the "free market" people now? How come they aren't clamoring to support this? The incentives were there for American capitalists to step up and get these incentives too - right? So, the free market won out. China lobbied for it and won the bid. Making it only available to Americans wouldn't be free market. You're going to decry the gov't (and Democrats in particular in this instance) because they're letting the market dictate who builds the windmills? When so many on here b*tch about "socialism"? That doesn't seem equitable.

The Chinese must have a better business model than anything an American could come up with so... they win moniez.

And once again, the $450M is really a drop in the bucket compared to the entire ~$800B package - less than 0.1% So, put that in perspective. Hell, the same people that lambasted the bailout and are anti-tax and spend, anti-earmarks, anti-waste (tea partiers) just asked the gov't for $1B worth of earmarks themselves. Hypocrites.

And lumping Honda in there? They're the only reason Marysville and Bellefontaine still exist. The only other real employer is Scotts, who last I heard was laying people off and making serious cutbacks.

Doesn't matter why those towns exist... Honda does the SAME thing this Chinese company is doing. Just because they're "established" now doesn't mean they won't up and leave tomorrow for a better place that'll give them more tax breaks. Marysville, the city of, has to ensure they give Honda ongoing incentives, enough to keep them from moving because the city is SO dependent on them. So yes, they get lumped in as well.

And did US tax dollars go to pay for my car? Was it part of a stimulus package created to keep the US economy afloat? Nope.

Indirectly, yes. The lack of taxing what other manufacturing corporations pay has, in effect, cost America tax revenue and thereby financed your vehicle.

And as I stated earlier, just because this money is going to China doesn't mean it doesn't stimulate the US economy (to what level is debatable). There will be construction jobs and logistics carriers chomping at the bit to build and transport this stuff here. Plus, there will have to be US-based maintenance for these, which are ongoing and permanent positions.

PS: As I've said time and time again, I am not a Republican. I'm registered as a Libertarian, and lean a bit more towards the Constitution Party.

I'm not, nor was I, labeling you -- I'm just saying hating on the Democrats in this case is a scapegoat move for something that is clearly not a "Democrat-only" cause for concern.

[Bad324]

if you ask me, America sold out America years ago. As much as I would love to place the blame on Democrats and those crazy Liberals, I cannot in fairness

[cmh_sprint]

if you ask me, America sold out America years ago. As much as I would love to place the blame on Democrats and those crazy Liberals, I cannot in fairness

+1. this all began when some of us were very young and before a good portion of the members were born. IMO both parties have a hand in this but the main culprit is Wall Street. When Wall Street took over the board rooms the selling out of America went into high gear.

[chevysoldier]

Politicians are selling out America, it is just to varying degrees.

[shittygsxr]

Hey there is this new think called the stock market and it lets you buy partial overship in companies. I guess people in other countries have heard about it before us because foreigners own portions of our american companies. So when all of the union workers go shopping at walmart and buy chineese goods you can benefit frm that by purchasing shares in chineese companies

[jhaag]

...lots of words...

i dont see how this is an example of the free market at work. i cant quote specific details about this particular deal other than what i've read here, so i might be typing out of my ass, but was there a majority demand for this wind farm or was it the result of a federal mandate requiring a certain percentage of renewable energy? if the latter, then it wasnt the free market at work, was it? it was simply lobbying and political posturing for a small group to receive stimulus money (i dont buy for a second that their little visit to the white house had nothing to do with this). so, if this was as simple as the free market at work then why are neither Reid nor the white house commenting? i mean, whats the big deal if thats the case?

anyway, i just have a problem with (paraphrasing) "the republicans always do it", so its ok. the obama admin as well as congressional dems have had a wonderful opportunity to make a really positive "change" in our economy and foreign policy and have simply carried on with political bullshit as usual. they have shown nothing but that they can continue to be more intrusive into our freedoms as the last admin, which was more intrusive than the last, and so on and so forth. the only thing this article has shown me is that money is king and is to be obtained at any cost and that it seems more and more everyday that for many there is very little pride in being an american, as well as the fact that the middle class has no representation in d.c.

[jhaag]

Hey there is this new think called the stock market and it lets you buy partial overship in companies. I guess people in other countries have heard about it before us because foreigners own portions of our american companies. So when all of the union workers go shopping at walmart and buy chineese goods you can benefit frm that by purchasing shares in chineese companies

do your parents know that you're posting on the internet again?

[Casper]

do your parents know that you're posting on the internet again?

He's posting from Peru none the less.

[Disclaimer]

Isn't GM's 3.5V6 made in China?

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/26/business/worldbusiness/26chevy.html

Ford is outsourcing it's 2011 Mustang 6-speeds to China. So' date=' all this "Buy American" is bunk anyway. Never mind all the other parts that are made in Mexico, Canada or China.[/quote']

Which is the Dems fault...

[Disclaimer]

I was jussayin' according to the thread... it's their fault.

I'll pass on a $58,000 HI-UN-DAY