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Casino collapse in downtown Cincinnati


Simplysix

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Cincinnati:

original.jpg?1327685525

http://s3.amazonaws.com/newscloud-production/newscloudcms/2012/01/4f22df507fd0dc19d20000b4/photos/1029764/original.jpg?1327685525

Cleveland:

10493585-large.jpg

http://media.cleveland.com/metro/photo/10493585-large.jpg

Gives me a warm fuzzy feeling about going in a poorly built casino full of people... or not.

edit: In the Cincinnati pic: I-beam shear rivets failed. They... well... they sheared... nice design.

You can see where the middle horizontal I-beam simply fell to the ground.

The Cleveland pic it appears something pretty much the same happened. A center I-beam dropped.

edit: How would that happen. Assuming that proper strength rivets were used, the rivet has to fully form in the drilled holes (properly lined up drilled holes). If it does not, then a tiny spot on top of the rivet in the hole, takes the full load and it starts to break/crack. You need both experienced riveters and good inspectors. As usual, about three things have to go wrong before you'll get a major disaster/failure. The rivets might not have been strong enough, giving it the third wrong.

Edited by ReconRat
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I would of thought OSHA would of been more involved with safety on such alarge project.

Should of used Inconel instead of just steel. The rivets could of been the wrong length too.

Edited by snot
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The big thing on the radio was these things:

1. Rushing and taking shortcuts to meet time requirements

2. Steel imported from China that is just crap and not made well like American Steel

:dunno:

Steel today is just not of the same integrity. When we lost all the steel industry to the offshore along with it went quality. All the 're manufacturing' of scrap steel has to effect its strength among other things, or so I'm told.

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I'm no engineer, but it looks like a design flaw to me, which could include overestimation of material properties.

probable but highly unlikely. there are so many engineers that go over those plans it would make it highly doubtful all of them overlooked a design flaw.

besides buildings have to be built to a building code. the engineers at the building dept approved the drawings too. and those codes are not thought up by one guy in a few minutes.

and they are being investigated about how much of a rush they're working. either someone installed some things wrong or something got overlooked.

Edited by serpentracer
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Same company, non-union workers, foul play? Just a thought.

Same designer, and engineer. Different G/C's and project managers. Same building owner.

All union contractors.

Foul play, I don't think would even enter into my mind.

I have some plumber buddies that were on that deck the day before putting in sleeves for piping. They have said that there was the obvious rush, but not to the point of putting in stuff half a$$ed. But a push nonetheless. Rain has been stressing the schedules down there.

-Might be a design flaw in steel sizing?

-If there was bare ground underneath with piers and the beams were mounted to the piers. Did they sink in the ground when the weight was applied (concrete), by not getting a good ground compaction test?

-Could the rivets been sized incorrectly for the shear strength that was going to be applied? Or bad rivets? I'm sure a metallurgist will be involved, I've seen them in cases where this has happened.

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Have you ever worked with engineers? They could miss tires on a car :lol:

trust me the people at the building dept don't miss much. that's also why they send out inspectors for each phase of construction. one part has to pass before you can begin on the other.

so that means 1st the pier holes were inspected. they look for the correct size and depth to meet codes. then the forms (the rebar etc) was inspected before the concrete was poured over them.

then the framing of the metal structure was inspected before the concrete on it was poured and so on...

the only thing the inspectors never care about is the "quality" of the work being done. they only care about if your structure is built to the building codes they have in place.

some of the stuff we built we did to what our engineer had on the drawing. and that was passed by the building dept. and when the inspector came out he made us change it. often it was made us add more fasteners to something or another brace to something. usually always something dumb like that just so he/she felt better on signing off on the work.

Edited by serpentracer
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