Tractor Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 Blah, I just had a bride email me wanting to know how many photos I took vs how many I delivered. I decided I'd go with my customer service instincts and simply tell the truth and explain my position behind it. Now we'll see if I have to mail out another disk full of photos I considered crap. Maybe it was a simple inquiry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImUrOBGYN Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 I would've probably done the same. Just said it was common practice to take many multiples to account for possible bad photos, angles, lighting, film issues or whatever so that you compile only those photos of the highest quality for your customers. However, I've never been a photographer, so I don't really know the best way to hanlde it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhett Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 Blah, I just had a bride email me wanting to know how many photos I took vs how many I delivered. I decided I'd go with my customer service instincts and simply tell the truth and explain my position behind it. Now we'll see if I have to mail out another disk full of photos I considered crap. Maybe it was a simple inquiry. When I did Photography for local bands and such. I would get this all the time. Simply let them know that the pictures I gave them were the ones I deemed worthy of putting my name behind. I took Hundreds but sometimes there would only be 50-100 that I actually liked and came out well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhett Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 I would've probably done the same. Just said it was common practice to take many multiples to account for possible bad photos, angles, lighting, film issues or whatever so that you compile only those photos of the highest quality for your customers. However, I've never been a photographer, so I don't really know the best way to hanlde it. This is a very good response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted October 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 Basically what I told them. If they push the issue il give them two thousand small jpegs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurkvinny Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 I wouldn't have expected ALL the pics from the times I've paid a photographer. I expect the good ones. I figured that was just "normal"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckeye1647545503 Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 At weddings you never know what pics may be special to people. Being that is so much to take in that day a pic you may not like may have two family members together that means allot to the bride or groom or something. Anyways personally I would expect a package of the "good" stuff and a cd or something with the rest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted October 8, 2011 Report Share Posted October 8, 2011 Doesn't your policy /contract outline specifics or in IT slang a scope of work? My policy and contract always outline what will be delivered, thus no scope creep will occur. I have basic packages and typically customize the project and adjust the pricing accordingly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrs.cos Posted October 9, 2011 Report Share Posted October 9, 2011 Doesn't your policy /contract outline specifics or in IT slang a scope of work? My policy and contract always outline what will be delivered, thus no scope creep will occur. I have basic packages and typically customize the project and adjust the pricing accordingly. This is how my contract is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted October 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2011 Yes, technically I could "go by the contract" and be a "butt" about it, it basically states that I deliver what I consider "the best", but to me I'd rather bend over backwards to make a customer "happy enough not to publicly complain somewhere" then cause negative rep at this stage in the game. In the end if I can't make them happy I have the contract to fall back on and play it tough later. In my other job I've learned you do what you can while keeping meticulous records to protect yourself later if your customer service efforts fail due to a client that simply doesn't want to be happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clifford Automotive Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 be back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Yes, technically I could "go by the contract" and be a "butt" about it, it basically states that I deliver what I consider "the best", but to me I'd rather bend over backwards to make a customer "happy enough not to publicly complain somewhere" then cause negative rep at this stage in the game. In the end if I can't make them happy I have the contract to fall back on and play it tough later. So you think a client would feel you're being an ass if together you clearly agreed on a specifics up front? Wouldn't that clarity and open discussion lead to an even greater trust and sense of business acumen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tractor Posted October 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 With most people, yes. With others, they'll feel entitled no matter what you do. It's just the human nature of dealing with people. At least when I'm dealing with them in photography I'm not just taking it in the ass to make my boss rich. So I do it with a smile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrs.cos Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 I think its pretty typical for the photographer to say up front how they plan to handle the final shots. I know that i will edit about 15-20 for a six hour time frame, of what I feel are the best shots. I then have ala carte editing available for the shots THEY want edited. You could always go in and say ok, ill send you a proof sheet (from bridge) and have them circle the 15 THEY wanted.. but IMHO, its not always the best shots from me, but the most important to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 With most people, yes. With others, they'll feel entitled no matter what you do. It's just the human nature of dealing with people. At least when I'm dealing with them in photography I'm not just taking it in the ass to make my boss rich. So I do it with a smile. I hear ya. The sense of entitlement though can be completely eliminated by getting them to tell you what within your contract they are in agreement with and what they would like to change and then having them tell you what that looks like. It's only fair if they make a change then they come up with a counter offer right? Key is in asking them the questions. In my case, I've had clients ask me for all the images too, both good and bad. Some even bring me their memory cards. That's fine, they just want my services and skills and nothing more. Based on my contract I ask them to come up with what they then feel is appropriate. I get the occasional stubborn fellow that says it's my business and my place to tell him a price. I simply, put it right back on him by saying that I could do that, but instead prefer he make the first move on the counter as I have done with my initial contract offer. I go on to explain that it empowers them and puts the illness of creating a fair an equitable deal back with them since they are the ones asking for the change to my initial offer. I can't read minds and can't tell them what "success" or "fairness" looks like to them. It's a power-play and I play it soft as of course I want to make it fair. Just keep asking questions and they are forced to answer and eventually come up with a solution. Many times it's a better deal than I would have come up with too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 I think its pretty typical for the photographer to say up front how they plan to handle the final shots. I know that i will edit about 15-20 for a six hour time frame, of what I feel are the best shots. I then have ala carte editing available for the shots THEY want edited. You could always go in and say ok, ill send you a proof sheet (from bridge) and have them circle the 15 THEY wanted.. but IMHO, its not always the best shots from me, but the most important to them. ^^ exactly. I do lots of proof sheets. Today I have 6 soccer teams to photograph and will do exactly that. Clients get x number of photos from the shoot and games for X $$ and if they want more then they pay ala carte. Sun is out today which will hurt the 2pm games, but overall, it's been a stellar season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
99FLHRCI Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 I agree that most photographers that we looked at only returned some of the images taken. However, that was a deal breaker for me. I finally found a photographer that was willing to give me all of the shots taken. We talked about it and I explained that I understood that for her price only about 25% (if that) of the shots would be edited. I explained that being our wedding day and people coming from around the country I don't have many pictures of them and can never redo the wedding shots. I also let her know that I completely understood I may get pictures of the ground, huge blinding glares, etc. I have not received the disk yet (it was only a couple weeks ago) however, what I have seen on Facebook is looking great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrs.cos Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Oh dont get me wrong, my clients get ALL of the shots i take, but i only EDIT some of them. I also realize this is not commonplace, but it was a dealbreaker for me as well when i bought my wedding photos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clifford Automotive Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Typically "people" starting out in the photography business give all their shot to a client. They feel it will get them business. Digital makes everyone a photographer now. Heres the problem with that. 1. You just ripped yourself off; they didnt even have to do it. 2. Your selling yourself short of what you "could" be. At weddings you never know what pics may be special to people. Being that is so much to take in that day a pic you may not like may have two family members together that means allot to the bride or groom or something. Anyways personally I would expect a package of the "good" stuff and a cd or something with the rest This is why all wedding should have disposable cameras at the table. Its not the photographers job to catch Bob and Joe, and know that you'll like that shot because they havent been together in 5 years. No matter the sweet talk or sob story I have heard I would never give someone all the shots Ive taken. In saying that if Im just shooting to shoot and not make money, I have photobucket for people to take what they want. For example, a lot of signatures and animated avatars are pictures Ive taken at track days or at meets. Back to it, if the senior I just shot was to receive all the pictures I took, their end opinion would be "well they look okay" Its an overall experience. If I deliver only the best shots to them, their opinion has now change to "ahhh these are beautiful". Those two results go to the next person they show and talk about their photos with. Bringing me in the next customer. That's why a "Portfolio" is what it is. Your best shots. Not all of them. Like Tim, I shoot youth sports on the weekends. This is a different league, I take tons of pictures. These are "all" available on smugmug to customers. The only thing I do is delete the OOF shots and upload. Never give all your shots away. And never give a CD of your images. Thats not who a photographer is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrs.cos Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Starting out or not, this is not something i plan to change. I may change the format i give them to them as, but right now, its how i want to do things. It angered me that i had to work so hard to find a photographer who would give me the photos of the whole event, even when i was offering to pay for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clifford Automotive Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 In my opinion you will excel further by not offering all of your photos. Like you said its not commonplace to do so. Side by side with another photographer that offers all their photos, I guarantee I will get a better sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrs.cos Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Side by side with another photographer that offers all their photos, I guarantee I will get a better sale. Why? its not something that sold me, and i didnt cheap out on my photos.. paid almost 4K for my package from BanksPix.com and that was 7 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Like Tim, I shoot youth sports on the weekends. Unfortunately today sucked. I had hoped for much better than I got in terms of results. My games were at 1-3pm, harsh bright sun, windy as hell, fields and shooting positions sucked too putting the parents in the background. On top of that the kids were all clumping together around the ball too. Very few good shots. Good news is I secured team photos for both our opponents today and the team on the field next to me for next weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clifford Automotive Posted October 16, 2011 Report Share Posted October 16, 2011 Why? its not something that sold me, and i didnt cheap out on my photos.. paid almost 4K for my package from BanksPix.com and that was 7 years ago. Like I said presentation and reference. Im very familiar with Banks Photography. Tim, I didnt do too hot either today. I know we missed out on this weekend for Lynds Fruit Farm, but we are still talking about going. We have a foreign exchange student and got pretty tied up with her. Did you guys go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted October 16, 2011 Report Share Posted October 16, 2011 Like I said presentation and reference. Im very familiar with Banks Photography. Tim, I didnt do too hot either today. I know we missed out on this weekend for Lynds Fruit Farm, but we are still talking about going. We have a foreign exchange student and got pretty tied up with her. Did you guys go? You have PM on Apple Picking. Pic whore time: Just a couple of my son from yesterday. When a crowd gathers. I call this Clumping. http://www.pbase.com/timothylauro/image/138891007/original.jpg Saving The Day http://www.pbase.com/timothylauro/image/138891009/original.jpg How Not to Guard the Goal http://www.pbase.com/timothylauro/image/138891213/original.jpg To Be a Kid Again. I would love to roll back time. http://www.pbase.com/timothylauro/image/138891008/original.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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