Mr. Jones Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 http://www.fastestlaps.com/comparisons/abarth_500_essesse-vs-vw_golf_gti_mk_vi.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Not fast, doesn't corner better than big cars, doesn't get outstanding MPG numbers either. Nor is it particularly cheap. What exactly is the car's niche ? The car does not have a price yet, nor do we have U.S. Spec performance or EPA figures. You and I can only speculate on performance of the Abarth, but what I do know is that a base 500 Sport at $18k provides, IMO, unparalleled performance, gas mileage (most people say the EPA is between 7-10mpg off on highway figures), and warranty in a car that gets a LOT of the right kind of attention. The car's niche is people who love performance in small cars and Italian style. I like driving GTIs, but I don't like the sterile, soulless feel of their interiors. If the minimalist, contemporary feel is what turns you on then you're right, the FIAT would probably mean little to you. I completely understand that the FIAT will not make everyone happy. However, if you're like me and you like seeing little differences like a color-matched dash (note how the new Beetle has gone back to doing that, like in the Karmann Ghia) and an interior that feels like it was designed to make a fun environment for the driver instead of geometrically proportioned to most efficiently place each button, then there is really no other vehicle in the market that offers what FIAT does. It's hard to explain, but when we had a MKV R32 here, we put a lot of customers out in that immediately before/after driving a FIAT. Overwhelming response was "yeah, that R32 is a hell of a car, but it didn't make me smile the way the FIAT did". Hell, that R32 owner was driving around for 2 months with a vanity plate before he got his FIAT Prima Edizione. That plate? "ABARTH". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Comparing the mkv interior to the current generation mkvi is foolish. It is 9 years old... Compare to the MKVI and get back with me. The MKVI GTI interior is better than anything in its class, and tons of cars much more expensive, read base 3 series, c class, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Fanboi status deflating. Unable to defend performance. Unable to defend handling. Unable to defend pricing. I know, I'll compare it to a 9 year old Volkswagen as a benchmark! I sense a new ad campaign: "Fiat, nicer inside than your brother's old GTI!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Fanboi status deflating. Unable to defend performance. Unable to defend handling. Unable to defend pricing. I know, I'll compare it to a 9 year old Volkswagen as a benchmark! I sense a new ad campaign: "Fiat, nicer inside than your brother's old GTI!" Unable to provide facts Unable to add new insight to thread Unable to read rest of thread I know, I'll troll the SHIT out of this thread :gabe:. Point out to me where I compared the FIAT's interior to the MKV R32's interior. I can't help if you inferred thats what I was saying. I was comparing customers' experiences driving a 3 year old 260hp AWD performance hatchback to the FIAT. Which, when new, cost nearly double what a FIAT does. And even used, cost more than a loaded FIAT. I've been in MKVI interiors, and while they're nice, they still feel sterile and uninspired to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 This thread is a perfect example of why I love the Abarth. Its a polarizing car. Not only do people who not like it hate it, but they all have the reaction of "I DON'T LIKE IT BECAUSE I THINK THERE ARE BETTER CARS AND IF YOU LIKE IT YOU'RE WRONG AND YOUR OPINION IS WRONG". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRD2BDF Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 50 points to House of Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 This thread is a perfect example of why I love the Abarth. Its a polarizing car. Not only do people who not like it hate it, but they all have the reaction of "I DON'T LIKE IT BECAUSE I THINK THERE ARE BETTER CARS AND IF YOU LIKE IT YOU'RE WRONG AND YOUR OPINION IS WRONG". You can use that argument about any car... The fiat is a nice car, ok, fine. The fact of the matter is it isnt an extraordinary performer in any category, and you seem to portray it as so. That alone is perfectly fine. My main issue is the price. My wife absolutely loves the 500, and I am happy they brought it over. Hopefully it will pave the way for other smaller performance cars from VW. I won't buy any of the small cars, but glad they exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 You can use that argument about any car... The fiat is a nice car, ok, fine. The fact of the matter is it isnt an extraordinary performer in any category, and you seem to portray it as so. That alone is perfectly fine. My main issue is the price. My wife absolutely loves the 500, and I am happy they brought it over. Hopefully it will pave the way for other smaller performance cars from VW. I won't buy any of the small cars, but glad they exist. I like this comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 PS, what cars do you see customers comparing to the 500? What about the dealer, what cars do you guys compare it to? If I had to guess, Fit and mini the most? Seems odd to compare it to the much larger cruze, focus, golf, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 PS, what cars do you see customers comparing to the 500? What about the dealer, what cars do you guys compare it to? If I had to guess, Fit and mini the most? Seems odd to compare it to the much larger cruze, focus, golf, etc. In terms of what we should be compared to, the FIAT is an A segment car making it a direct competitor to the Smart Fortwo, and other B segment cars such as Fit, Yaris, Accent, Cooper, Sonic, the smaller Scions, Kia Soul, Versa, Fiesta, and I can't think of any others. Most of the time, however, we're finding that our customers are looking at the 500 as the small economy car option on their list of possible purchases. As in, they're not looking at any of the cars listed above, but they are comparing the 500 to Golf TDI which I believe is C segment, I find myself competing against the Prius more than the Yaris. I get a lot of people comparing FIAT to small SUVs instead of the Fit, more like the CR-V and Rav4. The most common competitor I face is the Hyundai Elantra or Veloster, both of which are great cars IMO. We did just take a 425 mile Veloster in on trade though. We definitely face a lot of competition from Cruze because its a well equipped vehicle, same story with the Focus. If there was one car, however, that I'd say I hate to compete against, its the Mazda 3 because I like that car as much as I like FIAT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ry_Trapp01647545522 Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Another car on the way is the Fiesta ST. Simply based on looks, i would go with the Fiesta(but I hate the style of the 500 with a passion...), and I guarantee that it performs every bit as well. Now, the Fiesta ST vs the Cooper S is an interesting comparison. I expect the ST to be on par with the Cooper S and cost a few $k less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Another car on the way is the Fiesta ST. Simply based on looks, i would go with the Fiesta(but I hate the style of the 500 with a passion...), and I guarantee that it performs every bit as well. Now, the Fiesta ST vs the Cooper S is an interesting comparison. I expect the ST to be on par with the Cooper S and cost a few $k less. I, too, am looking forward to driving both the Focus and Fiesta ST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiji ST Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Another car on the way is the Fiesta ST. Simply based on looks, i would go with the Fiesta(but I hate the style of the 500 with a passion...), and I guarantee that it performs every bit as well. Now, the Fiesta ST vs the Cooper S is an interesting comparison. I expect the ST to be on par with the Cooper S and cost a few $k less. That car is going to be a BLAST. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 In terms of what we should be compared to, the FIAT is an A segment car making it a direct competitor to the Smart Fortwo, and other B segment cars such as Fit, Yaris, Accent, Cooper, Sonic, the smaller Scions, Kia Soul, Versa, Fiesta, and I can't think of any others. Most of the time, however, we're finding that our customers are looking at the 500 as the small economy car option on their list of possible purchases. As in, they're not looking at any of the cars listed above, but they are comparing the 500 to Golf TDI which I believe is C segment, I find myself competing against the Prius more than the Yaris. I get a lot of people comparing FIAT to small SUVs instead of the Fit, more like the CR-V and Rav4. The most common competitor I face is the Hyundai Elantra or Veloster, both of which are great cars IMO. We did just take a 425 mile Veloster in on trade though. We definitely face a lot of competition from Cruze because its a well equipped vehicle, same story with the Focus. If there was one car, however, that I'd say I hate to compete against, its the Mazda 3 because I like that car as much as I like FIAT. Thats interesting. I think the Veloster is a cool car, wish they would come out with a performance one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tripleskate Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Thats interesting. I think the Veloster is a cool car, wish they would come out with a performance one. Hyundai has already confirmed that the Veloster Turbo will be coming out soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWW$HEEET Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 i drove the fiat 500 yesterday. pretty much what i expected. pretty cool little vehicle. very responsive wheel and braking, a tad underpowered, but I think FIAT achieved what they wanted from the car. It gets great mpg, its stylish, great features (bluetooth, aux input, usb input), comfortable ride, does well at speed (even with 3 passengers) and it competes well with the cooper. again, this was the base model, i cant wait to see what the abarth does with possibly 50% more power. im probably forgetting a ton, but it was overall a very positive experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 The lighter, better geared 6 speed car oversea's does 0-60 in 7.6 with 160hp. God only knows what the US version will end up doing.. something in the 8's, which would be cool, if this was 1985. http://www.topgear.com/uk/fiat/500-abarth/road-test/c-driven According to the above, welcome to 1985. At least it's fun if you can't afford much but want something that at least looks decent. At least, at least, at least..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTQ B4U Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 i drove the fiat 500 yesterday. pretty much what i expected. pretty cool little vehicle. very responsive wheel and braking, a tad underpowered, Underpowered is likely spot on. I was coming home from Michigan Friday down some two lane country roads when there was a guy from NJ driving a 500 in front of me going 45mph due to the fact that there were two fully loaded semi's in front of him with some space between them, but not enough to jump into without being a dick, should you need to. Poor bastard was afraid to try and pass as I could see him even with a clear lane of open road inch over and then pussy out. I blasted past the three of them crossing over the 100mph mark by the time I was past the lead truck. Zero issues in a 4 door sedan with a 6spd slush box. He never did try. But hey, he gets great gas mileage :fa: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Jones Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 http://www.topgear.com/uk/fiat/500-abarth/road-test/c-driven According to the above, welcome to 1985. At least it's fun if you can't afford much but want something that at least looks decent. At least, at least, at least..... "The Fiat 500, for when "at least" is enough!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10phone2 Posted November 20, 2011 Report Share Posted November 20, 2011 Are the fiats FWD? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 Are the fiats FWD? Yes. And thanks for the review Gabe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyM3rC Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 I can't see any redeeming features. Not fast, doesn't corner better than big cars, doesn't get outstanding MPG numbers either. Nor is it particularly cheap. What exactly is the car's niche ? Agreed. I'd be interested if it was more along the lines of the diesel golf with the gti suspension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trouble Maker Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 El Karacho, did you guys sell any cars last month? ...29 of 130 dealers didn't sell one last month http://www.autoblog.com/2011/11/21/fiat-usa-has-half-year-supply-of-500-models-29-of-130-dealers-d/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Karacho1647545492 Posted November 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 El Karacho, did you guys sell any cars last month? http://www.autoblog.com/2011/11/21/fiat-usa-has-half-year-supply-of-500-models-29-of-130-dealers-d/ Yeah absolutely. And that includes dealers like the one in Pittsburgh who had 0 cars on the lot but who were technically open for business. This whole Laura Soave exodus should be good for the company. Getting a Chrysler guy to head the brand will help market it as a car for all instead of as a luxury item. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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