Political Thread Of Fail And AIDS (Geeto ahead!)

[LJ]

I don't know why I find her so funny but I laugh at her no matter what she does. I thought this was brilliant - yes I am immature

 

Her Super Bowl ad is the only one I laughed at I think

[BStowers023]

would you say the same thing about fox?

 

 

The one thing (and it may be the only thing) that I like about DJT is that he is forcing the republican party to deal with the split in the party between people who just hate liberals as an abstract concept or because of moral fundamentalism, and people who actually have conservative based political values. Appealing to a social conservative agenda that is largely based on religious morality has cost the party key figures and supporters who have conservative economic and foreign interest outlooks.

 

 

 

 

 

Do you want to have a conversation about this or do you just want to shout your frustrations into the void?

 

 

lol the only people shouting are the far left liberals but you wouldn't know that if you only watch the lefty liberal agenda media sources

[Geeto67]

It is just going to eventually show that the country is truly a center based majority that leans more socially liberal and slightly fiscally conservative. Watching people's reactions on social media when they learn that they will lose their health insurance if the ACA is repealed just shows that what people THINK they believe vs what they ACTUALLY believe may not be the same thing.

 

That's the hope. Although I didn't expect the country to pull enthusiastically toward a platform that was largely built on intolerance when it was initially challenged.

 

One other thing I hope it does is show the political parties are brands as well as being platforms. What do I mean? they sometimes sell on stereotype image rather than what the represent. This is why we have the Nazi/libtard insults flying (although to be fair there are actual Nazi's empowered by the current administrations actions, I am not talking about them), this is like rooting for a sports team more than it is making rational policy based decisions regardless of political affiliation.

 

I wonder how many people know that conservative democrats and liberal republicans are a thing? or that the platforms switched economic policies in the 1930's (Democrats were all conservatives when Lincoln was in office) and Social policies in the late 1960s and early 1970's (When secular-ism drove the religious groups to the republican party).

 

 

Moose-Lambs, McCarthy is crushing it. a) credit to Sean Spicer for finding the joke about himself funny, and b) I love that just the fact it was a woman lampooning him drives DJT into a foamy rage.

[Geeto67]

lol the only people shouting are the far left liberals but you wouldn't know that if you only watch the lefty liberal agenda media sources

 

As opposed to the cowering the right seems to be doing? I despise Marco Rubio's policies, but I have to say I admire that he has more integrity and spine than Mitch McConnell at the moment. I mean I get it McConnell is a party politician and not a real conservative so it pays for him to lay low and dodge so he can advance a party agenda rather than the right thing to do but hey...that's who you seem to want in the party because someone keeps electing him.

 

Also if you think the right isn't shouting then maybe you haven't really been paying attention to all the empowered nationalists in the party that are suddenly shouting that he isn't going far enough. Dude is controversial - every one is shouting at something (except the few who are laying low and working the long con).

[BStowers023]

As opposed to the cowering the right seems to be doing? I despise Marco Rubio's policies, but I have to say I admire that he has more integrity and spine than Mitch McConnell at the moment. I mean I get it McConnell is a party politician and not a real conservative so it pays for him to lay low and dodge so he can advance a party agenda rather than the right thing to do but hey...that's who you seem to want in the party because someone keeps electing him.

 

Also if you think the right isn't shouting then maybe you haven't really been paying attention to all the empowered nationalists in the party that are suddenly shouting that he isn't going far enough. Dude is controversial - every one is shouting at something (except the few who are laying low and working the long con).

 

 

I don't see the right out rioting in the streets but hey, maybe I'm not watching the right news channel, right?

[LJ]

The GOP has no balls right now. To only have 2 vote against Devos, who is CLEARLY not qualified for the job is despicable.

[Geeto67]

The GOP has no balls right now. To only have 2 vote against Devos, who is CLEARLY not qualified for the job is despicable.

 

does that mean we get to call them cucks?

 

I don't see the right out rioting in the streets but hey, maybe I'm not watching the right news channel, right?

 

Could be, or you could just be be ignoring all the recent hate crimes (from grafitti to personal assaults) because in your mind they don't equate. I mean if you aren't being objective the news source really doesn't matter.

 

The overwhelming majority of protests occurring are liberal because let's face it, they are protesting a conservative agenda so conservatives aren't going to protest themselves when they have (some of) the power. but the overwhelming majority have also been peaceful - holding an entire political group responsible for the few isolated acts of idiots who can't control themselves in a crowd well...that's just not being objective (and it's kinda dumb). Noting political about a black friday sale and riots sometimes break out at those.....some people are just animals when in groups.

[LJ]

does that mean we get to call them cucks?

 

 

 

 

http://i.imgur.com/lF83EGah.jpg

[TTQ B4U]

I love that just the fact it was a woman lampooning him drives DJT into a foamy rage.

 

being she's about an unattractive a woman as there can be I don't think he would care. that said I do find her funny as hell.

[Geeto67]

being she's about an unattractive a woman as there can be I don't think he would care. that said I do find her funny as hell.

 

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/melissa-mccarthy-sean-spicer-234715

 

More than being lampooned as a press secretary who makes up facts, it was Spicer’s portrayal by a woman that was most problematic in the president’s eyes, according to sources close to him. And the unflattering send-up by a female comedian was not considered helpful for Spicer’s longevity in the grueling, high-profile job in which he has struggled to strike the right balance between representing an administration that considers the media the "opposition party," and developing a functional relationship with the press.

 

"Trump doesn't like his people to look weak," added a top Trump donor.

 

Trump’s uncharacteristic Twitter silence over the weekend about the “Saturday Night Live” sketch was seen internally as a sign of how uncomfortable it made the White House feel. Sources said the caricature of Spicer by McCarthy struck a nerve and was upsetting to the press secretary and to his allies, who immediately saw how damaging it could be in Trump world.

[l36tols1]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4FXSKhWEAUttww.jpg

 

Must be nice to be unqualified and still get the job.

[o0n8]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4FXSKhWEAUttww.jpg

 

Must be nice to be unqualified and still get the job.

 

just have to know which members of congress and their price to buy a vote from.

[TTQ B4U]

Must be nice to be unqualified and still get the job.

 

Looking back at the past 30 years of our public education systems, especially in the cities and knowing that things are still as bad as they are yet we continue to chase flat-line shit results with more and more tax dollars I think your point also applies to the system as we know it today.

[Exodus]

Looking back at the past 30 years of our public education systems, especially in the cities and knowing that things are still as bad as they are yet we continue to chase flat-line shit results with more and more tax dollars I think your point also applies to the system as we know it today.

Agreed. We keep throwing money at the system and nothing has happened. The same people are complaining about about the same problems year after year.

 

I'm not particularly of the belief that the State should be involved in any way in the educational system... but because that's where we are and will most likely stay... I do believe that if parents are going to have money taken from them for educational purposes, that the parents should be able to choose specifically on an individual level how that money is spent. Vouchers? I don't know what it would look like but hopefully something better than what we have today in the publically funded school system.

[Exodus]

Looking back at the past 30 years of our public education systems, especially in the cities and knowing that things are still as bad as they are yet we continue to chase flat-line shit results with more and more tax dollars I think your point also applies to the system as we know it today.

https://www.downsizinggovernment.org/education/k-12-education-subsidies

 

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[TTQ B4U]

Agreed. We keep throwing money at the system and nothing has happened. The same people are complaining about about the same problems year after year.

 

The teacher unions and those in charge don't like people having choice. I went to a college prep catholic high school that was located in the City of Cleveland in an area that even 30-35 years ago was the hood. Kids in that area with smarts but no money had relief provided to them to go there and excelled and have done great.

 

It just makes sense that kids everywhere have a choice to do the same or to pick a school other than the shit-hole ones in their area that they may be stuck with. Let the parents choose and let the money flow to where the results are being seen.

 

Just like with anything run by the gov't they often set the bar low and keep it low. Obamacare is a failure and intended to be but it's much better to give people more control and responsibility and then hold them accountable for their own choices. HSA's and other voucher type programs are better avenues in many cases. I believe the same will be the case for schools.

[Geeto67]

Looking back at the past 30 years of our public education systems, especially in the cities and knowing that things are still as bad as they are yet we continue to chase flat-line shit results with more and more tax dollars I think your point also applies to the system as we know it today.

 

30 years....that would be a public education system that suffered under Reagan Funding cuts, Bush I funding cuts, Bush II funding cuts, and only Clinton and Obama who couldn't secure as much funding as were cut out of the program for 20 years (12 of them consecutive). If there is one thing that has been proven is that education in this country responds to money. When we pour money into education we go to the moon. When we cut educational spending over 12 years you get get a 38% competency rate (like we had in 1990 following Bush's administration). Clinton and Obama both saw improvement for their investments, but it's just not enough to undo Reagan's damage (which is seen as some of the most drastic cuts made by a president) compounded with Bush's cuts.

 

Here is why I don't like Devos - she represents a lot of the negatives of charter school system with not a lot of the positives. Currently the accountability is weak, and it needs to remain weak for religious based charter schools to continue to discriminate on several basis (like accessibility and gender) as well as continue to allow parental influence into the overall structure. I don't agree with this tact.

 

I am also very leery on the for profit model of education. As we have seen with technical schools like ITT, a for profit model with little accountability has the potential to turn into a scam more than it does to educate. Personally I feel core education (k-12) should be a non-profit endeavor. A symptom of this is the general less qualified workforce that tends to work at charter schools, since they don't have to meet public school teaching requirements and the pay is lower it doesn't attract the best candidates. Keeping costs low to maximize profits means keeping pay low and invites anti-union activities.

[BStowers023]

Get rid of teachers unions. Create a voucher program to give public schools competition. As stated earlier. Everyone complains about the public school system but then they cry when someone isn't appointed that wants to expand the public school system. Have we learned that the more control the government has on almost anything, the worse it becomes? Private > Govt.

[Exodus]

Get rid of teachers unions. Create a voucher program to give public schools competition. As stated earlier. Everyone complains about the public school system but then they cry when someone isn't appointed that wants to expand the public school system. Have we learned that the more control the government has on almost anything, the worse it becomes? Private > Govt.

 

I'm with you. At the very least get rid of mandatory membership (including fees) in any sort of direct or indirect taxpayer funded union. Let those who want the benefits to be allowed to join and those who do not, voluntarily opt out and not get the benefits. Key word there is voluntary.

 

 

Competition breeds innovation... but when you have an entity that has a monopoly on education (the state) then there is no incentive to improve and save the taxpayers money.

 

I'm in favor of some school choice/voucher program. In the end it's my money and my child's education... Shouldn't I have a bit more control over that? Why does the State get to choose for me?

 

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[Geeto67]

 

Competition breeds innovation... but when you have an entity that has a monopoly on education (the state) then there is no incentive to improve and save the taxpayers money.

 

yes but it may not breed the innovation you want if the student is no longer viewed as the product. This is one of those areas where things get dicey. Private not for profit might continue that line, private for profit - the innovation might be how to cheat children out of education to maximize profit. It's a way more complex issue without a simple solution.

 

 

 

Have we learned that the more control the government has on almost anything, the worse it becomes? Private > Govt.

 

I'm fairly sure most of US history would disagree with you.

[Exodus]

yes but it may not breed the innovation you want if the student is no longer viewed as the product. This is one of those areas where things get dicey. Private not for profit might continue that line, private for profit - the innovation might be how to cheat children out of education to maximize profit. It's a way more complex issue without a simple solution.

 

But that's just assuming that if you are a for profit entity that you are automatically not going to act in the best interest of the child/customer. That you are a scam artist or more prone to be one. And I just don't believe the evidence supports that. We have seen government corruptness and private sector corruptness. Unfortunately this isn't a perfect world. But I'd rather give my child the opportunity of a better education by being able to vote with my child's education dollars, rather than throwing it in a bucket and hoping the federal government knows what's best for my child and knows how to spend my money.

 

If a school is cutting corners for profit, not for profit, charter, public, or private. I don't care, I am going to take my child elsewhere and that should be my choice as a parent. If my child leaves that institution, the money should go with my child. That's a great incentive for schools to better educate our children.

 

But then again, this entire conversation is assuming I believe the State should be involved in education in the first place.. which I don't.

[BStowers023]

I'm fairly sure most of US history would disagree with you.

 

 

Oh yeah? I saw it first hand, guy. I saw how much the military charged for items that in the private sector cost a fraction of the cost the government was paying. I saw my battalion throw away over 100 perfect good, brand new battery powered drills (literally never used) because they didn't want to "waste money" shipping them back to the states. I'm sorry, but I think most people can agree with me that government run institutions are poorly managed and some of us have seen it first hand. Why should the government care about saving money when they aren't the ones funding it?

 

 

But that's just assuming that if you are a for profit entity that you are automatically not going to act in the best interest of the child/customer.That you are a scam artist or more prone to be one. And I just don't believe the evidence supports that. We have seen government corruptness and private sector corruptness. Unfortunately this isn't a perfect world. But I'd rather give my child the opportunity of a better education by being able to vote with my child's education dollars, rather than throwing it in a bucket and hoping the federal government knows what's best for my child and knows how to spend my money.

 

If a school is cutting corners for profit, not for profit, charter, public, or private. I don't care, I am going to take my child elsewhere and that should be my choice as a parent. If my child leaves that institution, the money should go with my child. That's a great incentive for schools to better educate our children.

 

But then again, this entire conversation is assuming I believe the State should be involved in education in the first place.. which I don't.

 

 

That's the liberal mindset. Bernie Sanders agrees with Kerry.

[Geeto67]

But that's just assuming that if you are a for profit entity that you are automatically not going to act in the best interest of the child/customer. That you are a scam artist or more prone to be one. And I just don't believe the evidence supports that. We have seen government corruptness and private sector corruptness. Unfortunately this isn't a perfect world. But I'd rather give my child the opportunity of a better education by being able to vote with my child's education dollars, rather than throwing it in a bucket and hoping the federal government knows what's best for my child and knows how to spend my money.

 

If a school is cutting corners for profit, not for profit, charter, public, or private. I don't care, I am going to take my child elsewhere and that should be my choice as a parent. If my child leaves that institution, the money should go with my child. That's a great incentive for schools to better educate our children.

 

But then again, this entire conversation is assuming I believe the State should be involved in education in the first place.. which I don't.

 

That's a fair point, however, with the current system's lack of oversight there are certainly less restrictions to cheating. I don't see the new boss as one amenable to increasing oversight of the charter school programs. I also don't think these things start of with bad intentions, but migrate there when they lose sight of the original goal of education. Again the for profit college model is the closest corollary but it is not an approximate match.

 

Educational funding is really interesting when you dig into it because overall the end result success rate isn't just affected by the school but by outside factors as well such as post high school educational opportunities. The state and local tax funding goes directly to the school your kid attends. Federal funding can go directly to the school your child attends but it can also go towards programs that your kid qualifies for that supplements his/her education while in school and increases opportunity post graduation, as well as go directly to the child to facilitate opportunity. These are things like grants, scholarships, after school programs, facilities improvements, etc...

 

State funding on it's own can't carry the day. when Federal funding goes down, even if state funding goes up, the metrics measuring proficiency and growth suffer, as well as post graduation employment statistics, college acceptance/attendance rate, etc... No amount of charter school competition is going to fix that issue. I agree that one of the goals of education is to insure the quality of the education that all children in America receive improves, but it isn't the only goal, and often the other stuff tied to federal funding has a greater effect.

 

The federal government theory of education is to provide everyone (as best it can) access to pretty much the same secular education, and if different education is needed it is on the students and parents to seek that out on their own. Do they meet that goal? no they don't in practice but they continue to try, and rely on the states to make up the difference based on geography, resources, etc.... Part of the difficulty is that federal funds can't be used for religious purposes, and a lot of private schools and charter schools are religious based and opening up the charter model pushes some restrictions on them as well.

 

In the context of Devos, I don't trust her to act in the best interests of students, and her philosophy on education (particularly religious education) and general lack of experience with education in this country is inviting trouble, despite charter schools having some overwhelming positives.

[Geeto67]

Oh yeah? I saw it first hand, guy. I saw how much the military charged for items that in the private sector cost a fraction of the cost the government was paying. I saw my battalion throw away over 100 perfect good, brand new battery powered drills (literally never used) because they didn't want to "waste money" shipping them back to the states. I'm sorry, but I think most people can agree with me that government run institutions are poorly managed and some of us have seen it first hand. Why should the government care about saving money when they aren't the ones funding it?

 

You are talking about one branch of government with a specific mission, it is not representative of the whole. Many books have been written regarding the military's balance of financial efficiency vs resource efficiency vs operational efficiency and the only underlying theme is some kind of waste is a constant.

 

I think a lot of government institutions have low customer satisfaction and low employee satisfaction, but I don't necessarily think they are all worse of being run by the government. The military is one thing you can't have run any other way - there is no other option and it's gigantic and hugely bureaucratic.

 

Remember the Federal government doesn't run your local schools - it sets the standards and provides some funding but they don't micromanage the whole of the system. To think the school system is run like the military misses the point entirely.

 

 

 

 

That's the liberal mindset. Bernie Sanders agrees with Kerry.

 

It's not a liberal mindset. It's a fact that absent regulation people and organizations will eventually gravitate toward operating in their own self interests. We have laws against monopolies because they were a problem, we have laws against discrimination because it was a problem, we have rules to protect the weak from being taken advantage of by the strong because that's how you end up with tyranny. You can always count on the selfish prick to ruin it for everyone.

[SpaceGhost]

She may not have a position in 23 months.

 

https://massie.house.gov/newsroom/press-releases/rep-massie-introduces-bill-to-abolish-federal-department-of-education