BB Mopar guys your opinions please

[99StockGT]

So with "Build/Rebuild" season upon us it's time to get to work on a new motor for the ladies Charger and I'm waffling back and forth as to what to do heads wise. This build is going to be a "in most peoples budget" kind of build so nothing crazy expensive or exotic will be involved. Trying to prove that muslce cars don't have to be for just gear heads and old dudes. A few things to note before we discuss/argue..

 

* Street driven car, DDable and to and from car shows.

* Will occassionally (2-3 times a year) see drag strip use

* Is being based off the late 400 Big Block platform

* Switching to a Holley Sniper EFI system with timing control with MSD handling spark

* Pushing a rebuilt 727 transmission with a shift kit, factory rear end.

* Long tubes to free flowing exhaust

 

Now the decision to be made.

 

Edelbrock E Street Heads $1200

Mancini Racing Heads $2000

Recon 440 Heads and port $1000

 

Now, short block wise all of these will be done with a 451 c.i. stroker kit with forged rods/pistons/crank more for durability than outright monster power. What would CR do?

[99StockGT]

To follow up...

 

Part of what is appealing with the staying "Old Iron Headed" is it will allow us to compare 4 motors we have done in rapid succession across the range of Big Blocks

 

455 Olds

454 Chevy

455 Pontiac

451 Mopar

 

The idea of showing these all running essentially the same displacement with much of the same parts and same carb is appealing for the YouTuber in me.

[buelliganx1]

I don't think you can really go wrong with any of those choices

[zeitgeist57]

From what I hear through Hot Rod, an old-school iron-block builder can't go wrong with E-Streets: aluminum and a more modern flow design for similar pricing to rebuilding the old iron heads.

 

Especially if you're stroking the short block, I'd feel better with a more modern head combo. Plus, if you can shave 100lbs off the nose that cannot hurt.

[99StockGT]

The weight savings would definitely be nice, also the added ability to run a point higher compression versus the iron heads. Unfortunately we have seen a lot of sub par aluminum heads coming with less than stellar parts in them and reasonably commonly guides being too tight. So even with a built set of Edelbrock heads they may need some additional attention.

 

Iron Heads would rebuilt with the best stuff out there on the market so durability wise would be above the level expected from Aluminums. Added bonus point for the car still maintaining a little bit of a stock under hood look, although given how shouty this thing is in appearance that might be a moot point.

[Geeto67]

To be perfectly honest, and knowing that this is your lady's car...I am kinda baffled as to why you don't just find a 5.9 Magnum powered 2wd pickup and throw the whole drivetrain into the car. You get EFI, overdrive, some weight savings (not much, but some), and parts availability.

 

I bet you could buy a whole donor car/truck for the cost of what you are looking to spend on heads for the 400.

 

That being said, are the heads 906 casting heads? if so, use those.

[99StockGT]

Ugh don't make me even start to think about doing an entire drivetrain swap, as it is finding the time to work on this thing over the weekend is going to be tricky. Motor swap should be a quick and easy process, we have a donor motor we will build while keeping hers whole then when it's ready to go... one out one in turn the key. (At least that's the plan)

 

The heads are a later gen casting with bigger valves and hardened seats so they aren't a bad place to start from. With some trickery and high end parts will put those in the $1600 range, but, they'll be very well built with the best of the best and there won't be any worry.

 

However, a drop on set of high end Aluminum heads is STILL realllllly tempting!

[Geeto67]

makes sense from a labor standpoint.

 

I just think at some point you are going to want an overdrive transmission and doing that with a mopar big block is not cheap. It's either a manual conversion, a GV overdrive unit, or a dakota A518 trans and an expensive adapter from JVX.

 

aluminum heads are nice, and if you paint them most people don't notice they aren't stock.

[Green Bastard]

Personally, I would go with iron heads. They tend to be more forgiving if the motor gets hot, expansion rates of different metals (with aluminum heads), ect. It seems you want something reliable, seems the safe route to me.

[gillbot]

Ls swap

[Richard Cranium]

Two thoughts. We used to think that power came from the bottom end of the motor, hence displacement going up and up and up. We know now that power comes from the top end. My vote is the slickest set of modern heads that fit in your budget.

 

The second is more of a question. For a street driven motor, why go with a forged crank? My understanding is the concern is a forged crank is stronger, but also more brittle. The vibration of normal use can cause stress fractures that will eventually cause the crank to break. If you're not talking about high dollar heads, then are you really going to be making enough power that a cast crank can't handle it?

[99StockGT]

We stayed Iron heads on the Pontiac for much the same reason, they are pretty forgiving and can be used up to a pretty acceptable 450hp or so without much trying. High RPM flow isn't there unless you do a lot of porting but these cars won't be seeing 6,000+ so the low end grunt is what's most important.

 

LS swap is something you will NEVER see me do personally, doesn't matter what badge is on the grill. Just not my kind of thing.

 

We have absolutely learned a ton on how to build power, which is why we have gone the route of a 451 CI instead of the 500+ CI set up. More useful power can be found with good quality machine work and setup than just making holes bigger and strokes longer. Also, when you start getting into the REALLY large displacement you have to step up oiling systems and start worrying about breaking other items not built for the kind of torque these things will make.