ZxHooligan Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 So I went to a shop today to look at bikes found an 05 zx12r wanted to listen to it run before I went any further with the salesman. He said it would fire right up just let him get the key. So he gets the key battery is dead. He tells me to wait there so he can hook the battery tender to it and make me wait a half hour for it to charge because it was too hard to get a service guy to come over and unscrew 4 bolts to access the battery. So by this time I am hot to trot and just walked out. I do believe I will no long be doing any type of business with this place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carwhore Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 That's a dumb reason. Think of how many other people want to do the exact same thing you did. And if its only to hear the bike and not an actual ride of course the battery is going to not charge. Now the sales guy should of had enough basic tools to access the battery and jump it for you. Their store is so big 30mins to kill can be done very easy. And if actually would of bought it you would of been there for at least an hour if not two. So doesn't sound like there was a time issue.Sounds like you were just being a hard ass and something happened that you couldn't control and you got pissed off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 So, a used bike that had a drained battery and you go blasting the dealer because they were going to try and start a bike for you just to listen to?Here's the drill. Sure, they could have jumped it. But, jumping isn't the best idea. Maybe they could have replaced the battery in a half ass manner to just get it running, but by the time they found a suitable battery, replaced it and started it, they would have taken almost as long as to charge it. Sounds like you're an impatient dude who has no concept that used bikes can have these issues.Hell, my brand new 1199 had a faulty battery brand new and wouldn't start the first time I went to ride it. Shit happens. It's how the dealer handles it that is how they should be judged. They were trying to get it inning so a squid could hear it. Starting a bike to let it run doesn't allow the battery to be maintained by the bikes charging system. But, they still were willing to accommodate your request.Most dealer would have done the same. And maybe, you were bein such a dick, they decided to charge it because you were a tire kicker or they hoped you just go away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revelstoker Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 They should have had some kind of battery booster or just done a swap with a battery off the shelf. Asking a customer to wait 30+ minutes for a battery to take a charge is a good way to lose a sale. Jump the damn thing. Now, unless you had cash in your pocket and looking to go out the door, I have to say you over-reacted a bit. I worked on a car lot for a short while and this happens all the time. Plus, running them doesn't tell you that much and I am sure IP has some kind of limited warranty and/or would do some kind of minimum service on the bike after you put down the cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 They should have had some kind of battery booster or just done a swap with a battery off the shelf. Asking a customer to wait 30+ minutes for a battery to take a charge is a good way to lose a sale. Jump the damn thing. Now, unless you had cash in your pocket and looking to go out the door, I have to say you over-reacted a bit. I worked on a car lot for a short while and this happens all the time. Plus, running them doesn't tell you that much and I am sure IP has some kind of limited warranty and/or would do some kind of minimum service on the bike after you put down the cash. Yes, you can jump it, but you can also have some issues if done incorrectly. AllI am saying is that I think battery boosters are for cars and they aren't suggested for bikes. You could try and jump with another motorcycle. Again, the time it would take and to get everything sorted, they could have it quick charged in that time. No matter what, let's say it took 15 minutes. Sounds like the OP wasn't going to stick around. I believe that the OP walked in, wanted to hear the bike run and the sales guy read him as a roach and when the bike wouldn't start, OP reacted and the salesman offered to charge thinking the OP wouldn't stick around as he wasn't a buyer anyways. A buyer would have waited... They could have talked and got information in the time it took to quick charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZxHooligan Posted August 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 I had the cash and was ready to buy. I wanted to ride it before I bought it but we all know the first step of a test ride is for it to be started. I've only bought used bikes or cars I know how the used game goes. But I've always bought from private parties so maybe private parties are different but when you go private most people will try to do anything to make a sale maybe I did over react but if they wanted to waste peoples time with a trickle charger that's their prerogative I don't like my time being wasted. The salesman said he had a jump box but would not take the panel off to jump it because he couldn't do it and refused to ask someone to do it. Maybe I might have come across as a dick when I corrected him about it being fuel injected he said it was carbureted but if your gonna sell bikes and don't know about a bike you should ask someone instead of just rattling off the first thing you can think of cause it has a choke like device on the handlebars. But who knows maybe I am just a dick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 Yup... You sound like you were a dick. Point is simple. The guys should know the bikes they are selling. They also should be able to get service to help out in the case of a serious buyer. If you had cash in hand and were serious, they dropped the ball. But I am guessing as in any of these types of stories that there is another side of the story. As far as missing the FI vs. Carbed - it happens, man. I understand they should know the product. He made a small error and after all, he's human. I bet you've made small errors or mistakes in life or at your job. Happens. Lighten up, Francis and give them a second shot. Go in and ask for Lenny and you'll get treated right. You just maybe got a green horn or on a day where they were slammed and he knew that service would have taken a while to get to the bike which again would have probably been the same amount of time as if he had quick charged it himself. Realize that he did try and accommodate and help you out. It's not wasting people's time if he is willing to help you or try and get it started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 Happens at car dealerships too sometimes, but you can't denounce the whole dealership because of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZxHooligan Posted August 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 I guess I just ask too much of people who sell stuff to know their product I guess I'll give them another chance but I'll deal with someone else. Thanks guys for helping me open my eyes to the real world instead of my own world where people should know their product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZxHooligan Posted August 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 No I don't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Copeland Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 I've bought several bikes from salespeople that have no clue what there selling ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 Hooligan- you really need to be realistic. Now you're pissed because they didn't know a bike was FI. I bet I can ask you questions about your bike and face to face, you won't know the answer. It's like racing. It's a series of racers that do it as a profession. Some are better than others. But, even the best make mistakes. Again, I highly doubt that you've done your job with 100% accuracy. The bottom line is that you really need to just stay away from anyone in retail and buy everything from CL or someone else. You are the customer that is never happy and most likely wasn't going to buy. If you were, you wouldn't have walked. I've dealt with a lot of people that just don't know. But if it is something I want, I can bear dealing with them. You walked because you had to wait 30 minutes. That's BS. You walked because you had no intention of buying and was irritated and walked out. In your mind they lost a sale. In reality they will sell the bike to someone that is a buyer and not a time waster. I had a kid at a shop come in looking at Ducatis. He said he had a 2012 zx10R. Great bike. So, it was a bit if a shock to hear him say the 848evo he was looking at was such a better bike than what he had now. He didn't own a zx10R. If he had, how the fuck is the 848 better? Then to ask if this is the one with titanium rods. That's the 1199R. I just grin and deal with it. Walked him around, have him the tour and blew smoke up his ass. He wasn't a buyer and wasn't a potential customer. He was kicking tires and wanted to be looked upon as someone that was cool and deserved to look at the Ducs. I didn't mind. I didn't care. In fact, he was a potential. Maybe he will remember that visit and come to the shop and buy. Some sales guys would have dropped him like a pinto transmission. I suspect that was a bit of the case in your situation. Before you go asking me how I can judge if you were a buyer or not - save your breath. I am heading out to ride. Pony is a good shop. Good staff and overall, probably one of if not the best shop in Columbus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RVTPilot Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 IMHO, the one who should be most educated on the product to be purchased is the consumer. And the last person you should depend upon to inform and educate you is someone who stands to profit by your ignorance. If you know what you are talking about, and he doesn't, fine. I've been around plenty of good salesmen that weren't resident experts on everything they sold, and so long as they gave me the honest answer of "I don't know but will find out", then all is fair. At the end of the day, the deal is more important than the dealer. Again, just my $.02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2fat2fly Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 Now the sales guy should of had enough basic tools to access the battery and jump it for you ZX12R batteries are not easily accessed. They are inside the frame backbone and if all the bolts are in the cover then you have to pull the fuel tank cover to open it.The fuel tank cover is blocked by the front seat, which is blocked by the rear seat. Once you get all of that out of the way then it's absolutely no problem to pull the battery out. You'll need 8mm & 10mm sockets and 4& 6mm allen wrenches along with a phillips screw driver. I'd say the guy was pretty motivated to be a salesman willing to tackle that job on a 12R on a showroom floor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dying Shadow Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 A salesman doesn't have to know his product. He just has to know how to sell his product. Most don't know fuck about anything they sell. Hell, I was argued with by a local Ducati parts guy about fucking motor oil. Don't tell me what oil to buy. Just give me the oil I ask for...you fucking desk monkey. You're simply the middle man, between me and the shit I want. Shut up, hand it to me and take my money. I also had a salesman try to tell me that "throttle bodies aren't fuel injection". I just shrugged and walked away. No need to get twisted because a dealership bike monkey is stupid. They're all stupid. That's why they sell motorcycles for a living. That, or they're all trust-fund kids that don't need a real job.agreed I need oil for my quad its a Honda and the dude just kept pushing the Honda OEM shit lol and I run Suzuki oil in it and he was acting like the damn thing was gonna blow up by running the other brand, little did he know I've ran it for years in my perfect running trx.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted August 25, 2013 Report Share Posted August 25, 2013 ZX12R batteries are not easily accessed. They are inside the frame backbone and if all the bolts are in the cover then you have to pull the fuel tank cover to open it.The fuel tank cover is blocked by the front seat, which is blocked by the rear seat. Once you get all of that out of the way then it's absolutely no problem to pull the battery out. You'll need 8mm & 10mm sockets and 4& 6mm allen wrenches along with a phillips screw driver. I'd say the guy was pretty motivated to be a salesman willing to tackle that job on a 12R on a showroom floor. And thus, maybe the salesman WAS more educated than the buyer... Good call. I forgot that the tank cover... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDBGoalie Posted August 26, 2013 Report Share Posted August 26, 2013 (edited) I had the cash and was ready to buy. I wanted to ride it before I bought it but we all know the first step of a test ride is for it to be started. I've only bought used bikes or cars I know how the used game goes. But I've always bought from private parties so maybe private parties are different but when you go private most people will try to do anything to make a sale maybe I did over react but if they wanted to waste peoples time with a trickle charger that's their prerogative I don't like my time being wasted. The salesman said he had a jump box but would not take the panel off to jump it because he couldn't do it and refused to ask someone to do it. Maybe I might have come across as a dick when I corrected him about it being fuel injected he said it was carbureted but if your gonna sell bikes and don't know about a bike you should ask someone instead of just rattling off the first thing you can think of cause it has a choke like device on the handlebars. But who knows maybe I am just a dick Well, it is not that they aren't willing to do anything to make a sale, they just have limits. If the showroom is full and there is three people working, he isn't going to take on a 20 minute task and leave others waiting for a low-potential customer. If it was a trickle charger, you'd be there for hours. A fast charge will still take 30 minutes unless you're pushing enough amperage to potentially damage the battery (Again, not worth the risk for a low-potential). Running a bike for 2 minutes with a low/weak battery is bad for it, and will likely help finish it off. Would you take your bike at home with a dead battery and jump it for it to only run for a few minutes? It isn't service's job to help a salesman change a battery. If they aren't busy (Which doesn't ever happen in the summer at a motorcycle shop) then they may have a chance to help, but it is not a requirement. If you were that stressed about it, why didn't you offer to change/access it yourself? With many years of sales experience, I can tell you first hand that knowing your product is very important to making good sales. But I can also tell you of many times that I learned something new about something I was selling (Usually it was minor, not the fuel delivery method, but still..). I'm sure he apoligized for his error and continued running through the list of positives, as a good salesman does. Not to mention that I've had times where I had to sell something I knew very little about and as long as you're honest and friendly to the customer, you're still doing your job right. I tend to agree with the majority, if you're not willing to wait, you weren't going to buy anyways. I've used methods like what the salesperson used today to multitask with seperate customers and eliminate the tire-kickers at the same time. I don't lose sleep over it. Edited August 26, 2013 by BDBGoalie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2talltim Posted August 26, 2013 Report Share Posted August 26, 2013 (edited) agreed I need oil for my quad its a Honda and the dude just kept pushing the Honda OEM shit lol and I run Suzuki oil in it and he was acting like the damn thing was gonna blow up by running the other brand, little did he know I've ran it for years in my perfect running trx..You realize 90% of the time it all the same stuff? We used to make boxes for Pennzoil and also made supertech(walmart oil) boxes, we vizited the bottleing facility one time and watched them change over all the bottles and boxes from one to another and was putting the exact same oil in them. So im quessing Suzuki, Yama lube, and Honda suff is mostly the same stuff.You should be putting hi end syntetic in that beast anyways..but we will save that for another thread. Edited August 26, 2013 by 2talltim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Butters Posted August 26, 2013 Report Share Posted August 26, 2013 (edited) when i bought my bike (here in AZ, not from pony), the salesman didnt know the bike by the model name, didnt know where it was, and had no idea they even had it.....they even had two....he said "are you sure we have that?" and i told him yea and he had me take him over to see it....he was cool about it and didnt know shit about the thing, but he was asking me about stuff i had looked up on it, helped me with the details of buying it etc....even called me a few weeks later to ask how i liked it and how it rides....awesome salesman the finance manager signed me up for a yamaha card because honda turned me down, and he tried rushing me out the door with an FZ1 that cost several grand more than my bike....very very push and rude, saying fuck honda for turning me down that i should buy the yamaha to get back at them....but it wasnt what i wanted so i left....next day he ran the honda through a credit union and they approved it and i came to get it....i knew what i wanted, had to deal with some bs to get it, but its the one i wanted so i dealt with it. They even killed the battery on it before i ever even sat on it...left the key turned while filling it up with oil and the headlight killed it....wanted me to wait 45 mins for their charger, but i had them just jump it for me since i had an hour ride home anyways i put up with the shit because its the exact bike i wanted....if you were an interested buyer, i dont think you would have really walked out over a 30 min inconvenience....i think total between financing, having vfr appraised, doing paperwork, etc etc....i spent probably 4 hours in the dealership over the 2 days i was there (first time i went to look at it, i didnt bring the vfr to get appraised because i took car to work that day and saw it posted last minute) Edited August 26, 2013 by Steve Butters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dying Shadow Posted August 26, 2013 Report Share Posted August 26, 2013 You realize 90% of the time it all the same stuff? We used to make boxes for Pennzoil and also made supertech(walmart oil) boxes, we vizited the bottleing facility one time and watched them change over all the bottles and boxes from one to another and was putting the exact same oil in them. So im quessing Suzuki, Yama lube, and Honda suff is mostly the same stuff.You should be putting hi end syntetic in that beast anyways..but we will save that for another thread.this be it Mr Tim also agreed another thread. See you at Wayne I hope lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2talltim Posted August 26, 2013 Report Share Posted August 26, 2013 this be it Mr Tim also agreed another thread. See you at Wayne I hope lolAtta boy..lol.. probably won't be going to Wayne this weekend I've got 2 other engagements to make if the home schedule pans out. sent via GS3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dying Shadow Posted August 26, 2013 Report Share Posted August 26, 2013 Booooooooooo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Pony Posted August 27, 2013 Report Share Posted August 27, 2013 05 zx12r wanted to listen to it run - battery is dead. Thanks for pointing this out to us. The ZX12 you were interested in now has a new Yuasa battery. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZxHooligan Posted August 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2013 Thanks for pointing this out to us. The ZX12 you were interested in now has a new Yuasa battery.No problem these guys on here have opened my eyes I'll be back up to do business with y'all soon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbot Posted August 27, 2013 Report Share Posted August 27, 2013 the real question is, how awful are the oil changes on THIS kawi? 08 zx6r = AWFUL it makes my weiner hurt just thinking about it. i don't know why my weiner hurts when i think about oil changes on that bike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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