RHill Posted February 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 Wasn't trying to make a big fuss, just reiterating concerns I heard when discussing the requirement to jump back into advanced.....I've done enough days that it is irrelevant to me Ron, look at those chicken strips, you are using all your lean angle! (this is never going to die, is it?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonStopable Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 Yes that was the one comment that just never seemed to make sense. As far as bumping down, rules is rules (and when it comes to safety is good one) . I'll just sign up in "I" and go from there. Ryan we will just have to postpone the 2016 Gopro passing compilation while at Mid O. However it is on at Road Atlanta! Unless of course I'm bloated from all the deer steak we ate, and hungover due to the "perfect mix" cup, then the morning sessions don't count. As an added bonus passing while you screw with your lap timer in the morning won't count either. Dan you are not allowed to participate this year as you will above the horsepower limit of 135. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 On 1/31/2016 at 7:32 AM, Subisti said: So intermediate will be 2 groups running at the same time? I think if safety is the concern limiting to 25-30 people on track at a time should be implemented. Having 35-45 people running at the same time with 20 seconds difference in lap times is just straight unsafe. Track is capable of 40+ at any given time in a safe manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 Echoing what Rusty has already said. If you FEEL you are an "A" rider, get an evaluation. Simple. If you are as good as you feel, that will be an easy transition. We have to start somewhere. We cannot just take your word. You may be accurate in what you say, but the next guy? Not so much. We have to set a baseline. Once established,m it will be easier... But to start, that is where we are picking. So, scenario #1: You rode 3 track days at the "A" level and we are asking for 4. NOTE: This is not finalized and simply a number for my point... You really want to be in "A" Group. You have to sign up in Intermediate. GET THERE EARLY!!! If "I" Group sells out, it sells out. You don't get a freebie bump to "A" Group. So, getting early is a benefit... So you get there, get signed up... Grab an "I" Coach and ask for an evaluation. If you are at the level you feel you are and show that to be the case, you will then get an evaluation from the "A" Coach in the "A" Group. If he/she says everything is okie dokie, you get in to "A" for the remainder of the year unless someone feels otherwise and bumps you down. Remember, there are going to be certain days where the pace will be based on the group and if all are top level guys, the pace may be such where we bump guys down. And up!!! It's all constant... Now, scenario #2: Same deal as before. You get an evaluation from the "I" Coach. Riding with the "A" Coach, he feels that you just are not ready. May be that day's pace. May be that a few things stand out that needs worked on and can be better worked on in the lower group. You are remaining in "I" Group... Now, doesn't have to be because of this scenario. But, everyone can get help one on one from ANY coach at ANY TIME. You just need to ask. So in scenario #2, you want to grab an "I" Coach and have them help you on the things needing sharpened as mentioned by the "A" Coach. Work on the day getting that sorted and have another evaluation. It may be end of day or even the next event. But you can be evaluated any time and multiple times. Just make sure that you work on the issues and get them sorted before you ask. Don't expect to fix the stuff in one session... In the end, it is about safety. Not ego. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 And finally to the 20 seconds difference... In ANY group if a 20 second difference, you are looking at a bump. If you are running 20 seconds slower than the fastest "I" rider, that's probably over 2:00/lap. Not gonna happen... So, to that point in regards to safety, we will bump when we see these types of things. No different than "A" Group. Fastest guy is running 1:30 and you are running a 1:50... That's "I" Group pace. There will not be a true baseline for times. We do not feel lap times are the top indicator. However... They will be used in reference at times like this kind of idea. What are those baselines? I feel differently than most. I hate lap times. I can find a guy in "A" that can run a 1:36 on his purdy laptimer. Has a great session of bench racing with his buddies and shows that one lap he squeeked out that high 1:36. Issue is he was on fire, out of control, murdering his lines and turn in points, etc. Had he slowed down and rode smart and with a reserve, he'd run a 1:39. That guy needs help. He's going to pop can his bike and possibly hurt someone else for a stupid lap time. On the other side, I use lap times to show the difference in what we work on vs. what they were doing prior. I can take a guy and he run a 1:40 and just cannot get into the 30s. I work on lines in the carousel and key hole and we drop 2 seconds instantly. This then is compared and shows him that with the same effort, he is working easier and more efficiently and the result is a faster lap time. Efficiency and smoothness is what I want. Not a damn lap time. Plus, a single lap time os pointless in a track day. Segement work is ideal and what you really need to use those timers for. If I had it my way, I would ban lap timers for most rider... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trackbikez Posted February 1, 2016 Report Share Posted February 1, 2016 I want to ride in whatever group lets me safely run my pace without tearing up my equipment... and for selfish scheduling reasons, isn't the first on the track in the morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 19 hours ago, Trackbikez said: I want to ride in whatever group lets me safely run my pace without tearing up my equipment... and for selfish scheduling reasons, isn't the first on the track in the morning. Intermediate goes out first. Will stay that way for 2016. And it doesn't matter who goes first... If YOU feel the track is too cold or whatever the reason, sit out a session. If your mind tells you it isn't going to be fun, it won't be and you add risk. I've gone out in sub 40 degree weather for race practice. Track is the same for everyone. Ability gets you where you need to be. Whether advanced or intermediate, everyone has the same hurdle. The BS about the track cold is crazy to me. If I HAVE to be out there, I know hoe to ride it. If I can choose, I stay in the garage. It's just that simple. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 I get it that people want to show up and ride with their friends, but is it really a big deal to ride in Intermediate? You may not be setting personal bests navigating through Intermediate traffic at and Advanced pace, but it shouldn't be hard to get through and past the pack if you're really that much quicker. I was having a fucking blast in Intermediate - felt like king of the world for about 3 sessions before someone slapped an "A" sticker on my bike and told me to rest up, because they were sending me out first in the next Advanced session, and then letting the whole A group track me down. Anyone who I kept behind me owed me a beer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 2, 2016 Report Share Posted February 2, 2016 Red nailed it. I think everyone is over thinking this whole deal. If you honestly feel slighted that you cannot be in Advanced Group, get an eval and ask to be bumped up. Simple as that. The quality instructors at the "A" and "I" groups will be able to assess without bias. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhughes Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 On the complete opposite end of the spectrum there and people like me . I feel like this will help a lot since I am new but get bored in novice. However didn’t think I was ready to move to intermediate 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludwb675 Posted February 3, 2016 Report Share Posted February 3, 2016 I just want to show up and ride. I was a walk-in every time last year into I group. I'm hoping to be able to do that as well this year. I'd hate to show up and get turned away cause they start limiting the group sizes. I was usually between numbers 33 and 38, never in the 40's. Can't wait for spring to get here. Need to put the finishing touches on the new bodywork and put the forks back on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted February 4, 2016 Report Share Posted February 4, 2016 I applaud any effort that puts safety before profit. That's admirable. It's much easier to over-sell the groups and pocket the cash than it is to acknowledge that not everyone is safe in Advanced, and turn away intermediate riders who want to purchase spots that may otherwise go un-sold. The other alternative is that TD organizers start running Beginner and 2 Intermediate groups, or just turning away the fastest riders as unsafe to ride with intermediate traffic. I don't think any of us think that's a good 'solution.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niles Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Can I get bumped back to novice so I look like a hero? I'm not going for big fish in a small pond, I'm going for whale in a bathtub here! Looking forward to this year. Sounds like the group running the show is putting in a lot of effort. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jschaf Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Just curious, coaches. Assuming I am riding safely & not gaining 5 seconds by being ruthless and riding like an asshole. What lap times are appropriate for Novice, Intermediate, & Advanced? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 It really isn't about lap times. Sure, you run a 2:00 in advanced and you will get the boot. But honestly, it is really smoothness, predictability and consistency. There are thoughts to speed differences in each group, but those can be different day to day. If the "A" group is running 1/2 of the field at 1:35 and faster, then the speed is higher and a guy running 1:46s isn't going to be doing well. But if the group is running 1:39ish, then he's good. I hate lap times. They can't be precise in telling anything because you rarely get clean, full laps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trackbikez Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 (edited) Now I'm a little more confused...so the groups are a moving target based on who's there each trackday? Am I going to be bouncing back and forth between I and A? I'm the "on the cusp" guy you keep talking about with respect to laptimes - running mid-to-high 1:40s on the SV. I can only speak to my experience over the last couple years. It seems I'm passing 90% of people in "I", but getting passed by 50%+ of the guys in "A". My riding has improved by being on track with guys in "A" as I learn from their lines and braking points. Subjectively, I feel much safer in "A" as well. Just stating that my preference is to be the slow guy in "A", rather than the fast guy in "I". I hope that how things shake out. Edited February 6, 2016 by Trackbikez Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rusty Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 I think it's better if we stop talking about this. People just reading between lines and coming to wrong conclusions. Sign up to group like you did before,and leave it the rest to the coaching staff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Rusty nailed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesmoDuc Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Hey Rusty, you working the track days this year? I'm signed up for May 23, June 13 and June 30 to get my fat arse on the track. Need someone to show me how my crappy riding can be improved .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rusty Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 That's the plan.stepping up to 1000 so it will be learning year for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndonD454 Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 Does anyone know if the novice class usually fills up quickly? I have a gift certificate and was hoping to avoid rain on my first track day if possible, so I was hoping to walk up for the May 23 session, or register within a week of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesmoDuc Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 I talk with Gwen at Mid O yesterday and she seemed to indicate all the bike days were open ... had figured some of the early date might be full. I registered for may 23, june 13 and june 30 to prep for Vintage Days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RHill Posted April 28, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 41 minutes ago, AndonD454 said: Does anyone know if the novice class usually fills up quickly? I have a gift certificate and was hoping to avoid rain on my first track day if possible, so I was hoping to walk up for the May 23 session, or register within a week of. Couldn't say for novice, I'd just give them a call a few days before and ask how full it is. Everyone at Mid-O is always very helpful and that also give you the opportunity to sign up right then if it is filling up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiztedRabbit Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 its hit or miss with mid o... sometimes it fills up fast others you can walk up the day of and get in.. I agree call a few days ahead and see how full it is.. maybe a week before if the weather looks to be awesome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndonD454 Posted April 29, 2016 Report Share Posted April 29, 2016 Thanks guys! That works for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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