duty to inform case dash cam video

[Casper]

Didn't realize it was a law to inform. Just thought it was a good idea. Got pulled over last week for window tint/speeding. Cop already had an attitude (because my tint was so dark??) so I felt like I would be adding fuel to the fire. If he asked, yeah I'll inform, just as I did when I lived in Indiana. He didnt ask, I didn't mention it. After the stop, I realized/remembered he probably didn't ask/get tag notification because the car was registered to my dad

So anyone want to post a link to this? This hippy still can't see the original link:)

I have to put it in code tags else it'll automatically embed, which you can't see for some reason.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kassP7zI0qc

It's a YouTube video. YouTube blocked where you're at?

[Casper]

You are correct, I come across a lot of them, and this is an example of only 6. That being said, the statement was that a "legal" CCW permit holder does not pose a threat to officers. I stand by my statement of bullshit.

I'm not looking to start an argument, but I would like to reverse your logic and ask how many officers are there in Ohio compared to asshole interactions you have had with them? There are bad cops! Every department has them, however, there are bad CCW permit holders, motorcycle riders, bank tellers,....etc. My frustration comes in with the generalization of "all cops are bad", which is a frequent theme with Ohio Riders (patrons). Most of the people who have had one of these negative interactions need to keep on mind that, had you been operating your vehicle within the law, you never would have been in the position to have that negative interaction to begin with.

(John, that was not necessarily directed toward you, it just fit).

For the record, I'm not anti-cop in any way, I'm simply playing devil's advocate.

How man CCW permit holders, motorcycle riders, bank tellers, etc threatened to execute you while restrained in the back of a car?

My point here is when you're given a firearm and the duty to protect the public, I believe you should be held to a higher level of accountability and higher standards of professionalism. The bad apples should be dealt with swiftly. That would greatly help resolve this negative perception of police officers (which is EVERYWHERE, not just on Ohio Riders). I believe the same is true of politicians, teachers, etc. Not all officers are bad, not even a majority. It's a small fraction of the police force. Not all of the teachers in Atlanta helped their students cheat on tests to advance to the next grade. Not all politicians are lying, two-faced fucksticks. Unfortunately the few bad make the whole look bad. If a pie is sliced into eight slices, and you find a worm in one, you probably won't eat any of the other seven pieces of pie.

[John]

The bad apples should be dealt with swiftly. That would greatly help resolve this negative perception of police officers (which is EVERYWHERE, not just on Ohio Riders). I believe the same is true of politicians, teachers, etc.

exactly.

i think the negative perception comes from all the stuff the public sees, for example every few days we are seeing a cop arresting someone for video taping in public, which we all know is legal...

police took an oath to protect the constitution, and if they break that oath, they should be fired. not suspended with pay and required to take a sensitivity class or something.

the guy in this video is a bully and should be fired ASAP. he is not the type of police we need.

there needs to be a real change in the way police interact with the public. police should see themselves as a part of the community, not as separate from it. they should be someone you want to come up and talk to, not someone you're scared of because you think they are going to try to pin someonthing on you.

Edited July 21, 2011 by John

[Scruit]

Didn't realize it was a law to inform. Just thought it was a good idea. Got pulled over last week for window tint/speeding. Cop already had an attitude (because my tint was so dark??) so I felt like I would be adding fuel to the fire. If he asked, yeah I'll inform, just as I did when I lived in Indiana. He didnt ask, I didn't mention it. After the stop, I realized/remembered he probably didn't ask/get tag notification because the car was registered to my dad

So anyone want to post a link to this? This hippy still can't see the original link:)

How did you get an Ohio CCW without knowing about the duty to inform?

[John]

How did you get an Ohio CCW without knowing about the duty to inform?

probably doesnt have an ohio license, but has reciprocity from another state.

now, that doesnt excuse anything. you are supposed to know the laws of the state you are visiting.

[idodishez]

Guess I missed it. I remember it being discussed, but remember it as more of a suggestion/good idea than a state law.

[Casper]

police should see themselves as a part of the community, not as separate from it. they should be someone you want to come up and talk to, not someone you're scared of because you think they are going to try to pin someonthing on you.

I remember as a kid always going up and talking to police officers. When they came to school to talk about anything, it was exciting. Every boy wanted to be a cop. It just isn't like that anymore. Then again, the same thing has happened with the presidency.

[Scruit]

Guess I missed it. I remember it being discussed, but remember it as more of a suggestion/good idea than a state law.

Yup, it's required. That could have been an ugly scene for you if the officer had discovered an unexpected gun during the traffic stop.

[Casper]

For the record, this was posted by Canton PD today:

https://www.facebook.com/notes/canton-police-department-ohio/dash-cam-video/207621069290829

I want to assure our citizens that the behavior, as demonstrated in this video, is wholly unacceptable and in complete contradiction to the professional standards we demand of our officers. As such, appropriate steps were placed in motion as dictated by our standards, policies and contractual obligations. Those steps included: The officer immediately being relieved of all duty. The incident has been referred to the Internal Affairs Bureau for what will be a complete and thorough investigation. As bad as the video indicates our officer’s actions were, there is a due process procedure to follow. That process is designed in the best interest of both our employees and the citizens at large. That process will be followed in this case as in all others. Anyone shown to be in violation of our rules and regulations will be help appropriately responsible as dictated by all the facts. ~Chief Dean McKimm

Kudos to Police Chief Dean McKimm.

[Tonik]

For the record, this was posted by Canton PD today:

https://www.facebook.com/notes/canton-police-department-ohio/dash-cam-video/207621069290829

Kudos to Police Chief Dean McKimm.

No mention of the failure to inform charges being dropped. They should be dropped instantly, and restitution for all expenses incurred by the guy trying to hire a hooker.

[lammiepie615]

I've been pulled over a couple times while CCW-ing.

One time, the officer just started speaking without giving me much of a chance to talk. So, I interrupted and spoke over him about the CCW. He was visibly irratated, but only for a couple seconds. Then it was fine.

Unless, I'm mistaken...when the office runs your plate he will know if the plate is registered to a CCW holder. Seems like they would want to give you a second or 2 to speak up.

The computer or the dispatcher should indicate, in a perfect world, if the registered owner is a CCW permit holder. There is no duty to inform if you aren't the permit holder, but you can indicate this to the officer if you wish to deescalate the traffic stop. I definitely appreciate it, because I have encountered CCW permit holders who are not driving their own registered vehicle.

[Steve Butters]

what i dont get about duty to inform is if a person is intending to do harm with their gun, why would they inform the officer? if they arent out to do anything wrong, whats the point of informing, its not like theyre getting ready to shoot the guy.....either way, it just doesnt make sense to me.... kinda along the lines of a bank robber deciding not to rob the bank because the sign on the door says he isnt allowed to have his gun in there....wouldnt wanna break any laws before breaking some laws lol

courtesy? sure. law? unnecessary.

[Fazerlady]

So the cop was uneasy about someone carrying a concealed weapon, if he gets that bent out of shape he damn sure should not be out there with a gun himself.

I mean, come on, this guy was totally sedative - what would the cop have done if the driver would have been the confrontational type or the driver would have gotten mouthy??

And all that cussin was so unnessecary!!! UGH I can't stand ppl that can't get their point accross without every second word beeing a cuss word!!! I wonder what his wife goes through, IF he is married....lol

[redkow97]

i think that overall accountability is just not part of the police culture.

You mean the UNION culture. I don't think there's anything inherent about law enforcement as a profession that breads a disdain for accountability.

In fact, if you think about it, that would be a rather hypocritical stance.

[John]

You mean the UNION culture. I don't think there's anything inherent about law enforcement as a profession that breads a disdain for accountability.

In fact, if you think about it, that would be a rather hypocritical stance.

i disagree. the union may have something to do with them getting paid vacation instead of getting fired, but the blue wall of silence doesnt have anything to do with unions. cops just dont snitch on other cops.

if they do, well google Max Seifert to see what happens...

just like if i get pulled over drunk i go to jail and my car gets impounded, but when a cop in my hometown got pulled over drunk by his buddy, they give him a ride home and get someone else to come down and drive his car home.

[redkow97]

There's a thin line between "professional courtesy" and a lack of accountability, but your point is well taken.

The union comment was more about the fact that this guy won't, and probably CAN'T be fired. He's not on his 10th strike yet. <eyeroll>

[FZRMatt]

For the record, I'm not anti-cop in any way, I'm simply playing devil's advocate.

How man CCW permit holders, motorcycle riders, bank tellers, etc threatened to execute you while restrained in the back of a car?

My point here is when you're given a firearm and the duty to protect the public, I believe you should be held to a higher level of accountability and higher standards of professionalism. The bad apples should be dealt with swiftly. That would greatly help resolve this negative perception of police officers (which is EVERYWHERE, not just on Ohio Riders). I believe the same is true of politicians, teachers, etc. Not all officers are bad, not even a majority. It's a small fraction of the police force. Not all of the teachers in Atlanta helped their students cheat on tests to advance to the next grade. Not all politicians are lying, two-faced fucksticks. Unfortunately the few bad make the whole look bad. If a pie is sliced into eight slices, and you find a worm in one, you probably won't eat any of the other seven pieces of pie.

I agree with you. We should be held to a higher level of accountability, but what a lot of people forget is that officers are still only human and are still going to make mistakes. I would be lying if I said that I have never mother-fucked someone on duty or in cuffs for that matter. The heat of the battle sometimes brings out the worst in you. I don’t think there is a single officer on here that can say they have never done the same, and I don’t fault them for that.

[Disclaimer]

It made jalopnik now...

Cop threatens to execute driver over concealed weapon permit

http://jalopnik.com/5823543/cop-threatens-to-execute-driver-over-concealed-weapon-permit

Among the pressures facing police officiers working the streets of America is the rising number of people legally carrying concealed guns. But when one such licensee was pulled over in Canton, Ohio, an officer threatened to shoot him on the spot. Here's the chilling video. The arrest took place in early June, but the video only came to light today from a group called Ohioans for Concealed Carry. They had been working on behalf of the driver of the Pontiac Grand Prix, known so far only as William, who was arrested and charged in the stop.

As the 17-minute dashcam video shows, the two Canton police officers see the car pulled over in a neighborhood and detain a male passenger and a woman standing outside, whom the officers quickly identify as a prostitute. After telling the driver to stay put, they detain the male passenger and search the back of the car for a few minutes.

Only after that search does Officer Daniel Harless start questioning William, some seven minutes into the video — who then admits, when he can get a word in, that he has a concealed weapon, and tries to show Harless his permit. When he discovers William's gun in his belt, Harless instead becomes enraged: "You are supposed to say that right off the goddamned bat!"

Right now, the shit that you just pulled, I could blast you right in the mouth...I am so close to caving in you're goddamn head...you're just a stupid human being...People like you don't deserve to move throughout public. Stupid idiot."

After searching the car, getting worked up with his partner, and hearing from police dispatch that William does indeed have a legal permit to carry a concealed weapon, Harless comes back to the cruiser where William has been detained:

I swear to God man this little bull crap you just pulled right now has got me so hot. You know what I should have done? I'll tell you what I should have done. As soon as I saw your gun, I should have taken two steps back, pulled my Glock 40 and just put ten bullets in your ass and let you drop. And I wouldn'tve lost any sleep. And he would have been a nice witness as I executed you because you're stupid.

William was charged with two misdemeanor counts; one for stopping in the roadway, and another for failing to inform officers of his weapons.

After the video surfaced, the Canton police announced that Harless had been put on indefinite suspension last month, and the case forwarded to Internal Affairs. Ohio gun activists are raising money for William's defense. And the rest of us get to hope the next misunderstanding ends more amicably, rather than less.

[fox_racing_guy]

I think the officer was just having a bad day and took it out on the "john". That section of Canton is a real shithole and I'm sure the police have to put up with that kind of stuff daily. The building just to the left is a flea bag hotel that john's take the hookers into.

I worked in that section of town for 17 years and use to arrive to work between 3:30 & 4AM. It was not uncommon to hear gunshots, screaming, loud music or see homes on fire even. One morning I opened the building where our trucks were parked and flipped on the lights. The lighting was those sodium vapor jobs that take a min or 2 to warm up. I walked over to my truck and grabbed my winch bar from behind the drivers seat so I could tighten my straps before leaving. As soon as I closed the door I see a naked guy running at me with a maple 2x4 in his hands. As he swung the 2x4 at me (& missed) I swung my winch bar at him baseball bat style right across the chest and he was down for the count. I pulled out my cell phone and called the police and they were there within 2 min.

Another time I arrived to work and noticed some flames inside a home across the street. I called 911 first than climbed over our fence to the home to see if anyone was inside. When I got on the porch and looked through the window I could tell there was no way I could make it inside the home. I could hear kids screaming but could not see where they were inside, I just kept screaming at them "break a window, through anything through it" but they never answered. 5 people were killed in that fire, it turns out the gas was shut off so they turned the electric oven on with the door open and they think one of the children through some paper inside of it.

Those 2 stories I remember the most but I could go on & on about that section of town. Whats that have to do with the officer? Nothing, but if I had to put up with that kind of shit nightly multiple times I would be a edgy as well. I know it's not a excuse for his behavior but everyone has a bad day every so often.

As soon as the Timken company sends all their jobs overseas Canton is going to be the next Youngstown.

[crb]

The story is national.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/you-fu-with-me-cop-threatens-concealed-carry-gun-owner-during-traffic-stop/

The Canton police Facebook page is down.

[John]

The Canton police Facebook page is down.

uh oh, we're getting some flak.

SHUT

DOWN

EVERYTHING

[Casper]

They deleted their Facebook page? WTF?

[Scruit]

The press release that Ben posted earlier had been commented more times that I could count - and it was all negative that I saw.

This officer should be criminally charged with one count of assault for every time he threatened any kind of violence (that was not legitimately in line with his duties)

I believe that an assault charge deos NOT require physcial touching, just that you put the victim in reasonable for of voilence. Any officers or lawyers care to back me up or prove me wrong?

[FZRMatt]

I agree with you. We should be held to a higher level of accountability, but what a lot of people forget is that officers are still only human and are still going to make mistakes. I would be lying if I said that I have never mother-fucked someone on duty or in cuffs for that matter. The heat of the battle sometimes brings out the worst in you. I don’t think there is a single officer on here that can say they have never done the same, and I don’t fault them for that.

I want to clarify my "I don’t fault them" comment. I am not referring to the knuckle-head in this video. As I said before, this was handled incorrectly from the start. His comments were not delivered after the heat of battle. This guy is pisses that he got caught with his pants down (tactically) by a person with a gun. If he chooses to vent afterwards, that's on him. However, there is absolutely no justification EVER for a comment like the "execution" comment.

[Scruit]

Cops are human and make mistakes just like the rest of us. Of course a mistake by a cop could have much more dire consequences than my IT job... Still...

This video doesn't show a mistake. It shows an intentional pattern of actions.