Moto-Brian Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 There's hope for you. Myself and Ductati Brian are at Mid Ohio a lot look us up if you want help. Nesba, Stt and MidOhio ptr all have great programs. Many here do it and there is always someone willing to trailer your bike to the track.Desmo-Brian, Snuggles... hehehehhehehe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helmutt Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Holy shit......8 damn pages? In 3 days?! Yeah, nobody's "trying" or anything all innocent in here.....sure it is Bet she's feeling like she just strolled into a prison where the men haven't seen TnA in 20 freakin years!!Continue with the testicular swordfighting.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 I guess my point was that if you are braking, and you start to turn, you don't just let go of the brakes because your wheels aren't straight...keep braking until you are happy with your speed.Example: If you come into a corner too fast, and just let go of the brake because your wheels aren't straight, you're going to go wide. If it's a right turn, there could be a cement truck in the area of you going too wide...I think you mean well, but the facts are this... A TYPICAL street rider in that example is going to eat shit no matter what. If they are too hot into a corner, they are going to panic. Too hot means probably too fast an entry for their ability to process, digest and come up with a solution.Now, the typical response is braking. Brakes at a lean angle with a tense rider and most likely target fixing on the outside of the turn or the oncoming car is a recipe for disaster.Fact is that unless they have some sort of advanced training, the result is going to be the same. You need to watch talking trail braking with ANY average rider. I know it is taught at advanced schools like Swantz and Yamaha Champions, but for a green rider or not so experienced rider or even an Intermediate track day rider, trail braking is something that is VERY advanced to be making it sound so simple to pull off...You need to focus on getting braking done before you lean over and work your way up to trail braking. If you got in too hot, guess what? You already have shown you lacked the ability to not get into that spot to begin with. Now, we all make mistakes. It is how much ability or reserve you have to allow you to get out of that situation unscathed.Take this as an example... Running the back straight at Mid-Ohio. Loose your brake pad's braking material off th backing plate. On a liter bike to a normal braking marker and pulling th lever, you have it come clear back to th bar and not a single moment of slowing down.Reserve, ability and experience will determine what occurs. How do you handle it? How to you react? Do you panic? Do you get the heart beat up and a little tense, but kick in the reserve and utilize the ability level and get through without issue?Telling someone to just brake more until you feel happy with your speed. It's not that simple. It's very complex. Chopping throttle, trail braking, brake application - all load the front. Loading the front on corner entry is something that can turn bad VERY easily. It happens all the time and usually, ill experienced riders will blame the road surface, will blame grip of th tire, will blame lean angle.I've watched guys trail brake so deep, so late, so far over that they are literally almost tucking the front. I've been in spots where I have leaned in so deep under braking that I've lost the front and collected it back and continued on as if nothing happened. It was one simple issue - the same issue that plagues the crashes we hear blamed on cold tires, lean, stone, etc... Rider error. Rider input. That's the application of brake while leaned over... Know how to do it? Know how to save a tucked front? Go for it.But, realize this. The same situation where I saved the front and kept on trucking? Same thing happened almost identically and I lost it. Tried REALLY hard to pull it in and push down with the knee to save it. Didn't happen. Lowsided and ate a shit burger... You flirt with the edge of traction and sometimes, you beat physics. Sometimes you do not. But, I know where that is. I know not to overreact. I know what to TRY to save it. Ill experienced riders? Panic. Safety reactions occur. Pulling the brake more than they should. Chopping the throttle. Tense up on the bars. All are common...Just saying that getting the track experience like Todd suggested is by far the best thing almost EVERY rider (new, experienced, average, etc) can benefit from learning the ins and outs of what happens with their bike under severe service... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 I would like to know more about this myself. I've heard of track days and it sounds like a great training tool to insure a much higher degree of safety on the road. Reacting to an immediate hazard can require a split second reaction you don't have time to put thought into.Besides developing a quick reflex for riding, my concern has always been to not develop bad habits that are next to impossible to unlearn. I would rather learn proper techniques the first time.Got a link for how to learn more about track days and where it's offered?.You have no idea of how many street riders (even accomplished ones) develop bad habits... It is crazy. Not saying ONE BIT that street riders have zero clue. I am just saying that you can learn a great deal at track days with the right guide walking you through it. I am always willing to help as much as I can. The issue I always seem to face is that for whatever stupid reason, people are intimidated. I'm a nice guy, brush my teeth and use Right Guard. The idea is that you get to use some techniques that quite honestly if done on the street, are dangerous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twowheelsnake Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 She works at the hospital so ins is good and covers most of it. Im no hero and never claimed to be, also many here have come to visit me at work, so its common knowledge what I do. Not sure what angle youre playing since Ive said repeatedly Im not even trying so your vain attemps at cockblocking are retarded. Futhermore an fyi, ladies dont go for guys that try to run another in the dirt for a shot at her so you just moved yourself to the end of the line without even knowing it. If I want to play the hero card I would hit on ladies while Im working and in uniform way to spread it on thick there buddy. But anyway, I'm not trying to run you in the dirt, I'm just bustin your chops for fun. And in the meantime showing just how predictable you are. I don't have a horse in this race Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 That's my point. If you throttle into a turn you're shifting the weight towards the back tire, removing grip from the front tire for turning.Keep on the brakes and your front tire actually has more grip because there is more downward force holding that tire to the pavement.Just because you start to lean doesn't mean you should just let the brakes go.no, I'm suggesting braking with both front and rear, more with rear, shifting more weight (and traction) to the tire that is working on changing your direction of travel. Once you hit the apex, you have some options.I'm just suggesting that you use all of the tools you have at your disposal, brake, throttle, lean angle, and not stick to some sort of draconian law that says immediately let go of your brakes unless you're straight up and down....This is getting way off course and a LOT of bad info here... Steering with the rear as they say is 100% true. To a point...You can steer with the throttle and again, something you would learn at the track vs. the street. The loading of the front places a lot of load to a point you use up the credits of traction. Loading the rear and taking that load off is a key ingredient.Watch the racers as they exit under load. The front wheel will typically be pointing towards the iside of the turn they are starting to exit. You will catch a rider crossed up on further exit if the tire is lifted under accel. But, I am talking exit just after mid turn or exit while the front is skating. The wheel turns in the direction of the turn... There is no steering input and the bike is carrying the turn and handling the exit well and NOT under steering. We can produce an understeer reaction with the RC8 when I would not have enough preload. The end would squat too much and while I was getting STOOOPID traction on exit and hooking up rather well, it was pushing the bike out and creating that understeer.Now, add preload and the rear will spin a lot more, but allows for more steering input even with the front really skating more than tracking... The rear was helping finsih the turn or allowing me to exit better and point out where I needed to be.Rear traction and load is essential to a good turn exit. But, that entry to a turn is critical. Is a turn a braking turn or a drive turn? Most are driv turns... It is how you exit that is important to the efficiency to getting through it. Braking too much or with too much focus is going to destroy the efficiency of a turn.What is being stated here is really mis information and while I think it is unintentional, it really just needs to be avoided unless it is acurate without any doubt... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 this is trail braking 101http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_brakingUh, this is information that should never be posted. This is very dangerous and as seen by several posts, not understood. This is really dangerous in my mind and should NOT be practiced.What is being stated while somewhat accurate is really not accurate to a point that is something that should be shared or recommended... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
granda080 Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Two things:1. Reading this is like flipping between an episode of Maury and the Speed Channel. 2. Curse the PB rule. I wanna say something. I'm gonna put it out there; if you like it, you can take it, if you don't, send it right back. I want to be on you.Please continue to hold two totally different conversations in the same thread. Welcome to OR. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o-no-moto Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Wooooo Hoooooo i am post # 293...and yet i still havent tryed to hit on her....( very proud of myself)....carry on gentleman......bhahahahahahaah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidgetTodd Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Desmo-Brian, Snuggles... hehehehhehehe. Hey not my fault you change screen names every two weeks, I cant be expected to keep up with that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Jesus, I go to bed get up and go to work and this thing is still going. haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 So...in summary...welcome to OR.Thank you, it was QUITE the WELCOME!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 and thank you Desmo-Brian for clarifying all that for me. I think I actually understand it all now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapphy Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Wooooo Hoooooo i am post # 293...and yet i still havent tryed to hit on her....( very proud of myself)....carry on gentleman......bhahahahahahaahpfftttt!!!I been here the whole time and yet to hit on her. Hell in 2.5 years here, I have never hit on anyone hereO waitthere was that one timebut we don't speak of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 pfftttt!!!I been here the whole time and yet to hit on her. Hell in 2.5 years here, I have never hit on anyone hereO waitthere was that one timebut we don't speak of that. uh oh....I kinda want to know about that!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Well guys, I got my bike back now who wants to ride? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Copeland Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 Congrats on getting your bike back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 ... not have enough preload. The end would squat too much and while I was getting STOOOPID traction on exit and hooking up rather well, it was pushing the bike out and creating that understeer...I know that feeling when the bike does that. And I knew what it was. I don't like it at all... Somewhere between freekin' annoying and scary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moto-Brian Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 I know that feeling when the bike does that. And I knew what it was. I don't like it at all... Somewhere between freekin' annoying and scary.It's annoying. Bike under steering just makes shit more work at speed. Gotta really almost force the bike to complete a turn. I'd rather have spin and lighter front end. Crazy that it happens that way. People kind of get a confused look on their faces when I tell them I had too much traction and need more wheel spin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbot Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 i was searching for my mom and found this thread.y? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 ok guys so I kind of have to cool it on the leg humping comments for a while until some wounds heal. sorry. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magley64 Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 If youThis is getting way off course and a LOT of bad info here... Steering with the rear as they say is 100% true. To a point...What is being stated here is really mis information and while I think it is unintentional, it really just needs to be avoided unless it is acurate without any doubt...Sorry brian, you're confusing me... either the physics works this way or it doesn't, you can't have it both ways...I have no doubt you are a talented rider, and I'm sure you could run circles around me on the track, but the physics don't lie... loading the front tire with the brake DOES increase traction. Same lean angle, same speed, same bike, same rider... someone who has their front tire under load from braking will have more traction to stop faster mid turn (if needed) than someone freewheeling through that same turn.Is it your practice to let go of the brakes completely as soon as you begin to lean from vertical? Obviously you can cause a low side if you brake too hard, so I understand the apprehension to encourage new riders to use their brakes unless they are straight up and down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninjachic Posted October 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2012 Well tried to take the bike out for a ride and it flooded and now I'm stuck. Awesome. Yeah think I need to ride with someone else a little more before I try to go out on my own Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snot Posted October 18, 2012 Report Share Posted October 18, 2012 Honestly you should wait to ride after you take the safety course. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.