Kasich YOU are the IDIOT!

[zeitgeist57]

And thus why I voted for him and would do it again.

 

Most unions are useless in this time and age.

 

+1.

 

If the only thing Kasich gets done is amend collective bargaining in this state, he's done a good job.

 

Vote for Ohio SB 5!

[truckin]

Bingo. Someone has to be responsible.

 

So anyone will do?

 

GTFO with this shit who cares.........

 

You will when you get clipped on the side of the road cause some fucking moron is better than the law.

 

 

I've almost been hit 3-4 times on the side of the road..........this is with a big ass Firetruck blocking a lane while working an accident scene. We try to take every precaution we have at our disposal, People just don't pay attention and could careless about people on the side of the road.........after all it's all about them.

[truckin]

+1.

 

If the only thing Kasich gets done is amend collective bargaining in this state, he's done a good job.

 

Vote for Ohio SB 5!

 

Vote Yes and see devestating effects in OHIO.

 

Do you realize any money that is saved from this GOES DIRECTLY TO THE POLITICIANS to do as they please in regards to labor. You are killing blue collared workers and families....who is the driving force of this country? Who is already struggling? Think about it.

 

Could Unions use alittle revamp? Yep.. The Unions are opposed to working with Legislation to find a common ground......Kasich is. He's pulling the same shit the Democrats did with Healthcare......Hurry up and push through legislation without any forethought.

 

 

And I'm for Merit Pay.........But explain to me how it's going to work? THEY CAN'T!!!!! How is merit pay going to work with teacher's? Based on the state tests? It Can't! Not all grades require the test so how's that fair to other teachers who have to test for it. It dosen't take into account the kids who just have a real hard time learning vs. others who can learn with ease! Or the Useless parents who don't involve themselves in their kids schooling or learning! OH WAIT WE AS A NATION WANT TEACHERS TO RAISE OUR KIDS CAUSE WERE TOO FUCKING LAZY TOO! THEN WHEN SHIT GOES SOUTH BLAME TEACHERS. Does merit pay take into acct. that some teachers due to their demeanor (ease of dealing with slow or problem kids) are given more or most of the problem or lower ability children? NO!

 

Maybe merit pay will depend on how many tickets or how many stops an officer has pulled in this month? Won't you love that......Is that what you want? Or Lets say FF's........how will merit pay work there? Oh I pushed less drugs on a cardiac arrest PT than this guy over here thus saving the tax payer's money, but If I would have given them another round of Mag Sulfate I know I would've busted that SVT thus saving his life, but hey you know what I saved Joe Blow XXXX and now I get my merit pay good for me.

 

HOW's it going to work?

Edited February 17, 2011 by truckin

[BDHG940]

Sounds like a B*tch to me.

[Casper]

Vote Yes and see devestating effects in OHIO.

 

Do you realize any money that is saved from this GOES DIRECTLY TO THE POLITICIANS to do as they please in regards to labor. You are killing blue collared workers and families....who is the driving force of this country? Who is already struggling? Think about it.

 

Could Unions use alittle revamp? Yep.. The Unions are opposed to working with Legislation to find a common ground......Kasich is. He's pulling the same shit the Democrats did with Healthcare......Hurry up and push through legislation without any forethought.

 

 

My posts on this topic on OR:

 

**DISCLAIMER - THIS IS MY PERSONAL OPINION. THIS THREAD IS TO INVOKE INTELLIGENT DISCUSSION ON THE MATTER, BOTH FOR AND AGAINST.**

 

With OSHA and other work safety organizations, the effectiveness of unions has long been overstated. In the 20s and 30s, they played a major role creating safe places to work. Great. Now, all they're about is squeezing more money out of already tight budgets. Raises should be based on merit/performance, not how long you've been there. Work hard, get a raise. Do the minimum, no raise. It's just how it should be. Unions unfortunately take a more socialist approach to it with equal raises for all, even those who don't deserve them. So in the end, you have outrageous payrolls and mediocre employees. Now I'm not saying all state employees are mediocre. However, think if you knew you'd get an X% raise no matter if you gave 75% or 110% at work. What would you do? The minimum? Or your best? It breeds a society of people thinking they deserve more for just showing up. Handouts and gimmes need to be stopped. It's a hard decision, but it has to be made.

 

Does this mean I don't think firefighters, police officers, paramedics, teachers, etc should be paid more? Absolutely not. My brother is a firefighter and a paramedic, and I hope nothing but prosperity for him and his wife. I want to see all people succeed. I believe those who work hard deserve more money than those who do not. This goes for all positions in all professions. Do your job well, get paid well. Suck at your job or do the bare minimum, you can keep making what you're making or even face disciplinary action. If you don't like it, that's the beauty of America; go find a different job, go to school to better qualify for better positions, etc. I love this country. I love this state. And anything I see as a step in the right direction I'll proudly support. I support Ohio Senate Bill 5.

 

This, of course, is only my opinion, which I am entitled to. So before the name calling starts, sit back and think about what I'm saying. If you disagree with me, that's your right, but let's keep this discussion civil.

 

 

If you don't know what Senate Bill 5 is, you can read it here: http://www.legislature.state.oh.us/BillText129/129_SB_5_PSC_N.html

 

 

If they'd abolished the unions in Detroit and allowed renegotiations of employee contracts, how many people would've kept their jobs? How many businesses that GM owed money wouldn't have been stuck with $$millions in unpaid bills? How much taxpayer money would've been saved in the bailouts?

 

If I were a state worker, I'd be a whole lot happier taking a paycut or receiving no raise than I would be if I lost my job all together. With the way things are looking with the budget, if unions keep pushing for more raises and benefits, I'd venture to says a whole lot of state jobs will be on the chopping block.

 

 

I was a state employee when I worked for Columbus State, and was not a union employee. But in those most affected positions, you have people who do the minimum and people who go above and beyond. Teachers are a prime example of this in my mind. The teachers who want to be there and want to make a difference are the ones that should be getting the raises/bonuses/etc. Raises based on performance. I can think of several teachers I had in the past who were complete wastes of my time. On the flip side of that coin, however, I can think of several who made a serious difference in my life. Those are the ones that should be recognized. While on the subject of education, I'm also a firm believer that teachers should make more. Gasp! An anti-union guy wants teachers to be paid more!? Seriously though, most teachers are there teaching because it's what they want to be doing. I think one way that could happen is to get rid of individual school districts. Have one state ran school district. One state school tax based on income, not property values. All the money gets divided equally among the schools. Teachers are paid X amount per year, with annual cost of living raises matching the federal estimates for COLI (usually 2-3.5%). Teachers who have done exceptionally well get bonuses. These also are evenly distributed throughout the state. No more rich areas having the better schools, while inner city schools crumble and students continue to fail. A junior at Columbus Public Schools should have the same exact opportunity for a good education as a junior at Dublin City Schools. This is just the tip of the iceberg, however. With one state school district, you'd get larger fuel discounts by buying in such large quantities. Same with computers, supplies, buildings, etc. You have one general inventory of all equipment. You cut the costs of having so many different upper and middle management employees. You open the door to new industries specific to the new school system setup. With money more evenly distributed and so much money freed with these savings, it'd be economically feasible to build more schools. Thus enabling smaller classroom sizes, more jobs, and again a better education for the students. There are my thoughts on education.

 

 

 

 

 

At any point in time my employer could decide they need to cut payroll. That happens in one of two ways, people take pay cuts or people get laid off. It's just simple math.

 

For simple math, say your payroll is $1,000,000, and you have 20 employees making $50,000/yr. Your budget for this year cannot afford that. You have to cut payroll costs to $800,000. How do you do this? Do you lay off four people? Or do you drop everyone's pay to $40,000/yr? Or (as I would try to do if ever in the position), do you find the top 10 performers and try to leave them at $50,000/yr; find 5 mediocre employees, and cut their pay to $40,000/yr; then look at the bottom 5 performers and offer them a demotion to $20,000/yr or the opportunity to leave?

 

With unions involved, people get laid off because most are unwilling to accept pay cuts. The automotive industry is a prime example. Look at all the layoffs that occurred before the government bailed them out. Hundreds of thousands of jobs were lost. How many could've been saved if they cut people's pay instead? Lots.

 

A 20% cut in payroll costs is roughly what the state is facing right now. It's either cut individual programs all together, or cut costs across the board. I vote cut costs and try to save as many jobs as possible.

[craig71188]

Vote Yes and see devestating effects in OHIO.

 

Do you realize any money that is saved from this GOES DIRECTLY TO THE POLITICIANS to do as they please in regards to labor. You are killing blue collared workers and families....who is the driving force of this country? Who is already struggling? Think about it.

 

Could Unions use alittle revamp? Yep.. The Unions are opposed to working with Legislation to find a common ground......Kasich is. He's pulling the same shit the Democrats did with Healthcare......Hurry up and push through legislation without any forethought.

 

Devastating??? Lower taxes and smaller government?

Struggling? $80K a year janitors in the schools?

I should have such a struggle for so much pay and so little work!!!

 

How will this devastate the unions - actually having merit based increases like REAL businesses? Maybe allow some of the slackers/stealers actually get fired as opposed to being protected at all costs by the union?

 

Oh yea, and while most private industry got no pay raises over the past three years, the unions kept getting theirs - thus continuing to contribute to higher taxes.

 

BTW - most all politicians are assholes, Kasich included, it's just whether or not they do more good than harm - I voted Kasich.

[Casper]

Another:

 

Let Detroit be your case study for unions. Did they work for Detroit? Or how about Pittsburgh? Youngstown? Cleveland? Do you really think they have YOUR best interest in mind?

[V8 Beast]

Unions are corporations/businesses. A corporations main goal is to be profitable. The problem with unions are that people are dropping them left and right so they have to make sure they are supporting themselves as companies. Having the best interest of the people you support takes a back seat to making sure they will still be a company tomorrow. Its not that they are bad, its that they are in a very difficult position and are slowly fading away. Its a dog eat dog world.

[Littleguy]

I can't stand him. This is just one more reason why.

 

You damn socialist bastard.

[truckin]

Devastating??? Lower taxes and smaller government?

Struggling? $80K a year janitors in the schools?

I should have such a struggle for so much pay and so little work!!!

 

IT'S NOT GOING TO LOWER TAXES......THEY'VE ALREADY SAID ALL MONEY SAVED WILL GO TOWARDS THE POLITICIANS TO LEGISLATE.....COME ON TAXES AINT' GOING DOWN BRO. I AGREE THERE ARE WAY OVERPAID UNION EMPLOYEE'S......JUST AS THERE ARE PRIVATE SECTOR EMPLOYEE'S.

 

How will this devastate the unions - actually having merit based increases like REAL businesses? Maybe allow some of the slackers/stealers actually get fired as opposed to being protected at all costs by the union?

 

DIDN'T SAY IT WILL DEVASTATE THE UNIONS.......IT WILL DEVASTATE THE UNION MEMBERS...BLUE COLLAR WORKER'S. AS I SAID ABOVE I'M NOT AGAINST MERIT PAY......BUT SHOW ME OR ATLEAST EXPAIN TO ME HOW IT WILL WORK? I HAVE YET TO HEAR IT. MERIT PAY SITTING BEHIND A DESK AT A COLLECTION AGENCY DOES NOT TRANSLATE TO HOW MERIT PAY WILL WORK WITH PUBLIC SERVICE OR TEACHER'S.

 

Oh yea, and while most private industry got no pay raises over the past three years, the unions kept getting theirs - thus continuing to contribute to higher taxes.

 

REALLY? WHERE'S MY PAY RAISE? I WAS ACTUALLY AWARDED A PAY CUT......MY HEALTH INS, PENSION COST ACTUALLY WENT UP.....SO DID MY GAS EXPENSE, HOME EXPENSES ETC. I'M MAKING LESS THAN I DID LAST YEAR. WE ARE GETTING HIT HARD WITH OUR INS COST AGAIN ALONG WITH PENSION FUND. AND PLEASE KEEP IN MIND UNIONS CAN ASK WHATEVER THEY WANT......IT STILL HAS TO BE APPROVED BY THE GOVERNING AGENCY....EX: CITY, STATE, FED. WE TOOK A PAY FREEZE FOR OVER A YEAR SO OTHER CITY EMPLOYEES WOULD NOT LOOSE THERE JOBS.....TO THEN TUR AROUND AND PAY MORE FOR OUR INS.

 

BTW - most all politicians are assholes, Kasich included, it's just whether or not they do more good than harm - I voted Kasich.

 

 

I AGREE 100%......I VOTED FOR HIM AS WELL......HE'S HURTING THE BLUE COLLAR EMPLOYEES CAUSE HE HAS A PERSONAL VENDETTA.

 

 

I'm a union employee.......do I love the Union? NO. Do I hate the Union? NO. Do I think Union's sometimes protect pieces of shit? Yes. So do private sector business's. Do Union need a revamp? Probably.

 

In my job I have to constantly stay in the books and renew my certifications, have continuing education and monthly classes which I'm required to pass with a score of 80%. I have over 10 certification's including one that was classified as the most stressful posistion in the city ( which at times i agree with), and I recieve NO extra pay for. I GET LESS THAN 4 HRS ASLEEP ANIGHT, HAVE BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH SEVERE SLEEP APENIA DUE TO MY JOB. Am at high risk for 3 types of cancer before i'm at the age of 60 due to particles inhaled on the job, have a bad back and high BP due to my job. All the while working a second job on my days off so my family may have luxuries and so my kids may not know what i went thru as a kid.

 

All kids of people are struggling, this will NOT Save tax money....you will not see more on your tax return. WE Need to create jobs not destroy Families.

 

 

My response is in caps in quote.....thats why it's in caps...not yelling. Didn't feel like cut and paste.

[Casper]

I AGREE 100%......I VOTED FOR HIM AS WELL......HE'S HURTING THE BLUE COLLAR EMPLOYEES CAUSE HE HAS A PERSONAL VENDETTA.

 

 

I'm a union employee.......do I love the Union? NO. Do I hate the Union? NO. Do I think Union's sometimes protect pieces of shit? Yes. So do private sector business's. Do Union need a revamp? Probably.

 

In my job I have to constantly stay in the books and renew my certifications, have continuing education and monthly classes which I'm required to pass with a score of 80%. I have over 10 certification's including one that was classified as the most stressful posistion in the city ( which at times i agree with), and I recieve NO extra pay for. I GET LESS THAN 4 HRS ASLEEP ANIGHT, HAVE BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH SEVERE SLEEP APENIA DUE TO MY JOB. Am at high risk for 3 types of cancer before i'm at the age of 60 due to particles inhaled on the job, have a bad back and high BP due to my job. All the while working a second job on my days off so my family may have luxuries and so my kids may not know what i went thru as a kid.

 

All kids of people are struggling, this will NOT Save tax money....you will not see more on your tax return. WE Need to create jobs not destroy Families.

 

 

My response is in caps in quote.....thats why it's in caps...not yelling. Didn't feel like cut and paste.

 

So what exactly has the union done for you then, and why are you so against this bill?

[sgtschulze]

And thus why I voted for him and would do it again.

 

Most unions are useless in this time and age.

 

+1

 

They are just middlemen looking for their cut.

[craig71188]

HE'S HURTING THE BLUE COLLAR EMPLOYEES CAUSE HE HAS A PERSONAL VENDETTA.

 

Really? Please tell me more about this...

 

 

IT'S NOT GOING TO LOWER TAXES......THEY'VE ALREADY SAID ALL MONEY SAVED WILL GO TOWARDS THE POLITICIANS TO LEGISLATE.....COME ON TAXES AINT' GOING DOWN BRO. I AGREE THERE

 

And as such, I will not see a tax increase to pay for more deficit spending...

 

 

DIDN'T SAY IT WILL DEVASTATE THE UNIONS.......IT WILL DEVASTATE THE UNION MEMBERS...BLUE COLLAR WORKER'S. AS I SAID ABOVE I'M NOT AGAINST MERIT PAY......BUT SHOW ME OR ATLEAST EXPAIN TO ME HOW IT WILL WORK? I HAVE YET TO HEAR IT. MERIT PAY SITTING BEHIND A DESK AT A COLLECTION AGENCY DOES NOT TRANSLATE TO HOW MERIT PAY WILL WORK WITH PUBLIC SERVICE OR TEACHER'S.

 

Any position can be evaluated based on performance.....

 

REALLY? WHERE'S MY PAY RAISE? I WAS ACTUALLY AWARDED A PAY CUT......MY HEALTH INS, PENSION COST ACTUALLY WENT UP.....SO DID MY GAS EXPENSE, HOME EXPENSES ETC. I'M MAKING LESS THAN I DID LAST YEAR. WE ARE GETTING HIT HARD WITH OUR INS COST AGAIN ALONG WITH PENSION FUND. WE TOOK A PAY FREEZE FOR OVER A YEAR SO OTHER CITY EMPLOYEES WOULD NOT LOOSE THERE JOBS.....TO THEN TUR AROUND AND PAY MORE FOR OUR INS.

 

Guess what, everyone's health insurance went up, and gas, food & utilities went up for everyone. Most in private industry don't have a pension fund, nor do they get comp time, nor are they allowed to perpetually carrry over "sick days" and vacation time. And that said, guys in my industry have had 3 years of pay freezes while these costs went up.

 

 

In my job I have to constantly stay in the books and renew my certifications, have continuing education and monthly classes which I'm required to pass with a score of 80%. I have over 10 certification's including one that was classified as the most stressful posistion in the city ( which at times i agree with), and I recieve NO extra pay for. I GET LESS THAN 4 HRS ASLEEP ANIGHT, HAVE BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH SEVERE SLEEP APENIA DUE TO MY JOB. Am at high risk for 3 types of cancer before i'm at the age of 60 due to particles inhaled on the job, have a bad back and high BP due to my job. All the while working a second job on my days off so my family may have luxuries and so my kids may not know what i went thru as a kid.

 

A noble pursuit to take care of your kids - let me ask - is you position available in the private sector? Would it likely pay more or less than you make now?

 

WE Need to create jobs not destroy Families.

 

Absolutely, and I think Kasich can and will do this - but we need more private sector jobs that produce revenue - more private sector growth and less government bulk means we all get to keep more of our paycheck.

 

My response is in caps in quote.....thats why it's in caps...not yelling. Didn't feel like cut and paste.

 

No problem, my responses are in blue...sorry, I did cut and paste.

[Supplicium]

So what exactly has the union done for you then, and why are you so against this bill?

 

ahahaha thats what i was thinkin...

[Nitrousbird]

Isn't the Marion Sherrif an idiot for not patting down the person he put in the back of his car?

[copperhead]

schools and police departments need privatized. make them bid on contracts, and the money needed from the taxpayers will drop fast. If a private school company can't produce quality kids, the company loses the contract and another gets to bid to run the school. If a police department can't keep a positive revue from the people of their district, they get booted out of the building and another company gets hired. Guess what, they will work to EARN their paychecks just like the rest of us, which means not only improving the quality of the work but cutting out wasteful spending. Unions only hurt the general public - look at Wisconsin, the teachers are striking there because the government is debating over either ending the unions or laying off thousands of people, so of course the unions would rather have massive layoffs. These protests mean the teachers are skipping school, and kids aren't able to get a quality education. If I had kids in a school with striking teachers I'd pull them out and find somewhere else for them to go.

[zeitgeist57]

Hey Truckin, but I couldn't help but notice:

1) You have 5 cars, with at least 3 of them being worth over $15k.

3) If your 2 jobs make your life so stressful, how do you have time to post on CR during the workday???

[Brandon]

+1

 

They are just middlemen looking for their cut.

 

They call it a profit layer.

[wnaplay1647545503]

Anyone else think Kasich looks like he just fell off the wagon?

[Brandon]

schools and police departments need privatized. make them bid on contracts, and the money needed from the taxpayers will drop fast. If a private school company can't produce quality kids, the company loses the contract and another gets to bid to run the school. If a police department can't keep a positive revue from the people of their district, they get booted out of the building and another company gets hired. Guess what, they will work to EARN their paychecks just like the rest of us, which means not only improving the quality of the work but cutting out wasteful spending. Unions only hurt the general public - look at Wisconsin, the teachers are striking there because the government is debating over either ending the unions or laying off thousands of people, so of course the unions would rather have massive layoffs. These protests mean the teachers are skipping school, and kids aren't able to get a quality education. If I had kids in a school with striking teachers I'd pull them out and find somewhere else for them to go.

 

Yeah Mike, I am a flaming conservative but no offense privatizing the police force is a stretch, there are a lot of issues of ethics that arise from this. Ill keep it short at I disagree with this.

 

Privatizing schools and bidding on contracts is fine, however you must make the terms long enough to measure change, rotating administrations constantly and school boards is part of the reason schools are failing to begin with. Again charter schools have their pros and cons, unfortunately I believe they are necessary however some of the rules they play by are not the same we allow public schools to adhere to putting public schools at a disadvantage.

 

I will compare carbon taxes to teachers getting merit pay, neither right now can work. There is no standardized agreed upon measure or metrics to properly calculate usage and performance. You would need to come up with individualized testing measures for each student to generate realistic goals and achievements on a per student per case basis. (geodemographics, age, per captia family income, all these factors and more can statistically be linked to education results). Also because as you should realize, no one learns at the same rate nor through the same methods hence the diminishing value of standardized testing, and or teach to the test methods.

 

Although I have harped on our education system, does any one realize how successful no child left behind was? For all the Dubya haters, he really did help education...Its NObamas turn now.

 

How about what happened in Wisconsin today...pay attention.

[copperhead]

So every two years put up to a PUBLIC vote the renewal of the police company's contract. If they have screwed up publicly they won't last.

 

As for schools, really the only fair thing to do would be eliminate school taxes from property tax, adjust it into income tax for EVERYONE, so that EVERYONE is evenly paying it instead of just the homeowners. Then, come up with a dollar amount that a school needs for every individual student, then spread the money evenly. This will fix the crumbling inner city schools, and if the rich folk aren't happy that their school's have less money, they can use private schools.

[SpaceGhost]

So his point in the video is the officers need to show drivers and taxpayers (the public) more respect. Yep, I'm on board 100%. I agree, can't tell you how many times an officer is speaking in a condescending tone when he walks up to my vehicle. Show me some respect and I'll give you respect back. The governor is 100% correct.