Harb67 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 (edited) I'm [finally] getting another bike in a few weeks. Found a gorgeous '09 Daytona 675 with low miles out in Maryland that I am aiming to pick up in early December. I'm a first-time used bike buyer and the sale situation is somewhat 'unique' and involves a lein, so I was hoping some of the more experienced used bike buyers here could assess my situation and let me know if there is any way this can go wrong. Here's the deal:-Seller is a contractor currently working in Iraq, but the bike has been transferred to his wife's name who will be present at the time of sale-Seller has a friend who is a police officer - this guy takes care of the bike while seller is out of the country and he will assist with the bike delivery-Bike has a lein on it - seller has stated the following: "we can write up an agreement stating you paid for the bike and the loan will be paid in full within 48 hours and have it notarized. As well as mailing the title to you once it is recieved. Once the money is deposited in my account I'll pay off the bike and request for an expedited delivery of the title. I will also 24 hour it to your address to ensure you have it as soon as possible. I will also be keeping the full coverage insurance on my bike until that is done" [sic]. Now, given that the seller's friend is a cop and will be present at the time of sale, I'm betting that this guy is legit and isn't trying to screw me. What I'm assuming he means by 'writing up an agreement' is that we'll type up a document stating the terms of the sale and then take it to the bank where myself and his wife (the title holder) will sign it and have it notarized. Would this notarized agreement be enough to ensure I am covered in case there are any issues with the lein release? Is there anything else I should do to ensure a safe, smooth transaction?Also, this bike has a quite a bit of mods done to it and all original parts are included in the sale. As such, the seller has agreed to consider the majority of the total price to be cash for the bike and the rest of the price to be for "parts". We have agreed to a number to put on the bill of sale which, while certainly at the low end of the spectrum for this model and year of bike, isn't an unreasonable figure for a used sportbike. Is there any way that this arrangement can come back to bite me in the ass down the road?Sorry if this topic has been beaten into the ground - I searched and read some older threads but I'm new to this and really want to cover all the bases and make sure this goes well. Thanks! Edited November 11, 2011 by Harb67 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester3681 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Man, this has craigslist scam written all over it. If the owner is not present, do not buy. Another bike'll come along. We're coming into the winter now. Good deals will abound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drew95gt Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Sometimes a bank will release the title to a bike if it is being sold so he can give you the title. At least that is how my credit union has done it when I sold bikes that I still owed a small amount on. Make 100% sure that you guys know what the "selling price" is listed on the title. Sometimes the state will follow up if they suspect that fraud has been committed and they will send you an affidavit to fill out regarding the selling price. As long as you guys both put the same amount then you are golden, but if either of you put a different amount then they will investigate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harb67 Posted November 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Man, this has craigslist scam written all over it. If the owner is not present, do not buy. Another bike'll come along. We're coming into the winter now. Good deals will abound.If this was something I found on Craigslist I would have bailed immediately, but the seller is a regular on a triumph 675-specific forum. Not saying that makes everything legit, but then again I'm asking on here for a reason Sometimes the state will follow up if they suspect that fraud has been committed and they will send you an affidavit to fill out regarding the selling price. As long as you guys both put the same amount then you are golden, but if either of you put a different amount then they will investigate.We will both be putting the same amount - 4k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saacattack Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 I just bought my 07 Daytona 675 today. I found it on Craigslist and the owner is deployed but his wife had power of attorney so she could sign it over. I spoke to the owner multiple times. So I sort of got lucky with it being legit.But the fact that the title will be mailed to you? no way, that threw up a red flag in my head as soon as I read that. We all find good deals all the time. So you'll always find another one. You just have to keep looking. I personally wouldn't go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin0469 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Yeah, I'm thinking it's a scam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carwhore Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 sounds like a scam to me. I sell cars and deal with banks all the time.what you need to do is have the seller meet you at the bank and the bank will have the title there, you sign off infront of the banks notary and take the bike with you all done. if its a larger bank they will have to have the banker at the local branch get the title transfered that that bank. this can be done and isnt an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 If your going to the bank with her to pay the lien off then the bank should be taking your info and sending the title to you or have it right there for you to take. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conn-e-rot Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Seeing how you can't carry in Maryland take a buddy with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jst2fst Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 If your going to the bank with her to pay the lien off then the bank should be taking your info and sending the title to you or have it right there for you to take.^^This when I bought my CBR this February I had a cashiers check from my bank and went with the seller to settle the lein at the bank. Was told that had I not brought in a certified cashiers check that they would just have to mail me the title. Just my two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harb67 Posted November 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 (edited) If your going to the bank with her to pay the lien off then the bank should be taking your info and sending the title to you or have it right there for you to take.Sounds like this is what I'll do, if anything at all. I shot the guy an email asking if the bike was financed through a bank we could visit in person. Hopefully this is the case, otherwise I guess I'll keep looking *edit*Just curious - is a notarized bill of sale a legally binding document? Edited November 11, 2011 by Harb67 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh1234 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 If your going to the bank with her to pay the lien off then the bank should be taking your info and sending the title to you or have it right there for you to take.This. Like Jst2fst also quoted.man, that write-up reeeeeeeeeks of scam. The ONLY way I'd go to pick up this bike is if the title holder meets me at the bank and you pay the bank the lien so they release the title into YOUR NAME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harb67 Posted November 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Well crap. The bike is financed through Freedom Road Financial - a company that specialzies in bike financing. Meaning there is no bank to deal with in person, so I'll probably keep looking Just to be sure, even if I had a bill of sale signed by all appropriate parties and that included all the nescessary language detailing the lein, lein payoff, and title transfer agreement, and had it notarized, this is still not a good idea? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mykill Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 I wouldnt do this. Ive had so many scammer emails that were essentially the same. They post on craigslist all the time is it really much more difficult to post on a forum?Keep looking move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harb67 Posted November 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 (edited) Fair enough.If anyone sees a black '09+ Daytona 675 for sale, let me know...*edit*Googled his loan provider and didnt find anything good whatsoever. No way I'm going to deal with them. This guy is going to have to have the loan paid off or transferred to his bank somehow before I do business with him. Damn, really wanted that bike, too... Edited November 11, 2011 by Harb67 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
accel_is_my_drug Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 *edit*Just curious - is a notarized bill of sale a legally binding document?NO!!This sounds scamalishous! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 The owner should have a memorandum title. Ask them to fax or email you a copy (of both sides).Post here, and we can give better advice. I've never seen a Maryland title, but Ohio titles have spaces on them for listing liens against the vehicle.I believe the theory is that the owner can transfer the lien to you, and just cut the balance out of your buying price, rather than forcing them to front the money, and then you pay them back.But definitely do not hand someone money, and only receive a promise in return. You want whoever has the title to be 100% clear that YOU own the bike now, and they should send the title directly to you.If you go to the BMV with the seller, they should be able to sort this out for you. You're not the first person to attempt to buy a vehicle with a lien on it. The only draw back would be that you may end up paying taxes twice... Once to get a MD title, and then possibly again if you need to get an Ohio title. But I'd like to think they thought of that and realized it's not fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
600ZZ4eb Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 http://m.cycletrader.com/find/listing/100035782?searchUrl=/find/listings/results/page?data=/pageName-find+listings+results/pageNumber-9/perPage-10/searchId-7626400/currentMax-80/zipCode-43068/radius-1000/categorytype-0/makeName-TRIUMPH/keyword-daytona/minPrice-0/maxPrice-0/minYear-0/maxYear-0Only one I found... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad324 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 http://m.cycletrader.com/find/listing/100035782?searchUrl=/find/listings/results/page?data=/pageName-find+listings+results/pageNumber-9/perPage-10/searchId-7626400/currentMax-80/zipCode-43068/radius-1000/categorytype-0/makeName-TRIUMPH/keyword-daytona/minPrice-0/maxPrice-0/minYear-0/maxYear-0Only one I found...i've never put a bike on cycletrader and have sold several. Personally, that means nothing to me as most people would prefer to use FREE places to post a vehicle for sale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 (edited) Yeah, only dealt with a lien once. I paid it off at his bank, and received the title directly from the bank. He called that bank to see if they would do that. The bank will notarize the transfer. You walk out the owner. If the sale amount is higher or lower, pay or receive that at the same time. This only works if the title is kept local at the bank holding the lien. As noted, many titles are squirreled away at a national location. I have no idea how to transact that, and would keep looking somewhere else.edit: well ok, I bought my Jeep from a neighbor, and I paid off her loan for her. But that was some one I knew and trusted. It took a while to figure out where the "out of town" title went. It was mailed directly to the Ohio BMV, waiting for me and her. When I found that out, we both went down and transferred ownership. Still was pretty smooth, considering the Jeep was owned by her husband that died. She had to have the BMV paperwork filed ahead of time for that, to take over ownership. Edited November 11, 2011 by ReconRat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh1234 Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Find out what command he's at and give them a call. Don't let the "He's deployed in Iraq" line fool, you, either. If he is, then he DEFINITELY has a command, an OIC (Officer in charge) A commanding officer with a 24/7 support staff, and someone that you can call who will answer the phone and verify he is, in fact, under their command. I'm willing to bet you won't get so much as the name of a command out of the "wife." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harb67 Posted November 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Find out what command he's at and give them a call. Don't let the "He's deployed in Iraq" line fool, you, either.For what it's worth, he never claimed to be deployed - he said he's a contractor. For all I know that means he's with Blackwater out shooting children all day, but regardless he's not in the states and that throws up some warning signs - hence me asking for advice here I believe the theory is that the owner can transfer the lien to you, and just cut the balance out of your buying price, rather than forcing them to front the money, and then you pay them back.I'm going to contact his loan servicer and see if this is something they can facilitate, but unless it'd be a relatively simple process then I am not going to pursue this any further. I emailed the guy last night and told him I'd be happy to do business if he could either have the title/loan transferred to a local/national bank or if he could pay it off and have the title in hand, but that I would not do business simply based on a promise of title delivery after cash changes hands. I've been waiting over a year to buy another bike - I can wait a little longer if it means avoiding a potentially nasty transaction/scam.Thanks again for all the input, everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Copeland Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Just go to:www.triumph675.netAlways good deals with legit ppl on there.Sold my there and it had a lien on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motociclista Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Just go to:www.triumph675.netAlways good deals with legit ppl on there.Sold my there and it had a lien on it.I thought that's where he found this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beegreenstrings Posted November 11, 2011 Report Share Posted November 11, 2011 Did I miss how you were to pick it up?If you contact the bank ahead of time. Let them know the intention to buy and the wife lets them know the intention to sell to you. Maybe the bank can have the title there for you and you just pay them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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