Casper Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 I've never been a huge NRA fan, but I think I'll be joining today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad324 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 cliff notes? I've been in meetings and driving all morning so I have no idea whats going on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gump Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Not sure either but you'd like the Friends of NRA silent auction/ dinners they have every year in tons of different town. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meanie Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 It was about a 25 min conference calling for armed security in all schools. It sounds like they are not going to assist in any way with gun bans or imposing new gun laws. They are working on providing training to any schools who want it. 2 dumbass protestors stood up during the conference, the first one took awhile to be escorted out, the second one was removed pretty quickly. Maybe we should setup some areas, where we can allow people without guns, that think they should be banned, can live with out guns. No armed guards just them and no guns. How long do you think they would last with out a gun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fizzer Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 For those who missed it: http://home.nra.org/pdf/Transcript_PDF.pdf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpoppa Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 I thought it was very respectful to the CT victims to wait a few days before engaging in this dialogue. It is much more respectful than how the media handled it.We'll see what they say... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Point: having called for simple armed security for our children everywhere, the blame shifts to those that refused, should something ever happen again.Like he said, we guard our money and everything else. Why not the kids?Columbus already has off duty or on duty police in the schools as necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedytriple Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Ever been to cleveland? Most public schools have armed security or off duty on site. Looks like its not a bad idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 (edited) Seen in an article from Asheville NC:At least three companies that make armored backpacks designed to shield children caught in a shootings are reporting a large spike in sales and interest. The body armor inserts fit into the back panel of a child’s backpack, and they sell for about $150-$300, depending on the company.Bulletproof Backpack Sales Soar After Elementary School Shooting Edited December 21, 2012 by ReconRat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad324 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Ever been to cleveland? Most public schools have armed security or off duty on site. Looks like its not a bad idea.my girlfriends ELEMENTARY school employs 3 off duty armed police officers. The one was starting to get on my nerves hanging around her all the time but then I realized that if something happened he'd be right there to help so I let it slide.Plus his full time job is in a town my Uncle is the mayor soooo 1 phone call and I can get him canned. I put him on notice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brownsfan1 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Sad we have to think about putting body armor into backpacks to protect kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReconRat Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 (edited) Sad we have to think about putting body armor into backpacks to protect kids.Worse, in some cities or states, any sort of body armor is illegal.Most are written as "when in use during commission of a felony".edit: or use of a firearm, whatever.edit: In Ohio it's "violent felony"2941.1411 Offender wore or carried body armor specification. Edited December 21, 2012 by ReconRat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redkow97 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 My question is "who are these armed security people going to be?"On-duty police officers should not be used to guard schools. Police are not guards. That is a military function.While the police moto might be "to protect and serve," they are not legally responsible for protecting anyone... If they were, we could hold them civally liable for crimes committed on their watch. the police prevent crimes where possible, but their job is to patrol (create a police presence), respond, and investigate. Stationing officers in one place eliminates their ability to patrol or respond to other more pressing matters.IF we think it's a good idea to station armed personnel in schools (and i'm not convinced that it is), then it should be National Guard members, or some other military personnel who are officially stationed or deployed there. THAT is the military's job - defending us from threats, both foreign and domestic.My thoughts on putting armed personnel in schools? It's a nice feel-good measure, but a single armed guard won't make any difference to someone who plans a massacre. The guard will just be the first person shot.It will take at least 3-5 trained individuals to adequately respond to a single shooter, or something like the duo at Columbine. Teachers are already on-site in the course of their daily job. I don't think any teachers should be forced to carry, or undergo any kind of weapons or defensive training beyond hiding their students, but any who are willing should receive as much training as they'll accept. Make it a quasi-military designation that any citizen can obtain in a year or so with some classroom and tactical classes on weekends, or an accelerated 6-week full-time course over summers.Then you have a set of uniform standards nation-wide (or at least state-wide), and any adult employee in the school district could obtain it. I'm talking janitors, teachers, coaches, or any other staff member who is in the building on a daily basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brownsfan1 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Worse, in some cities or states, any sort of body armor is illegal.Most are written as "when in use during commission of a felony". I learn something new everyday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madcat6183 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 For those who missed it: http://home.nra.org/pdf/Transcript_PDF.pdfthanks! Reading it now, looking forward to it, so far everyone around me has basically said the NRA is stupid and to think this is feasible is retarded. Personally I agree with the NRA, there is no reason we do not employ a guard or 2 at every school. Don't bring up the $$ either, because in the end it all falls back on the people voting on the school levy's or not voting for them. It's their kids, their families, maybe they need to think about that when voting against them. That however is a different debate for a different time.Definitely liked the first few pages, now back to the others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad324 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 My question is "who are these armed security people going to be?"at my girlfriends school in E Cleveland its 2 off duty police officers and 1 armed security guard who is ex military. Frankly I'm all in favor for this to be a job creation opportunity for ex military members looking for that kind of work.Can you imagine how great it would be if you had ex military members being the security/guards at schools and then if interested they could then go to school on the side to become a teacher and then they can be that hidden air marshall type teacher.but hey lets just ban guns and make things out to be evil instead of coming up with positive reactions. Reason #5969338 New America sucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fizzer Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 My question is "who are these armed security people going to be?"On-duty police officers should not be used to guard schools. Police are not guards. That is a military function.While the police moto might be "to protect and serve," they are not legally responsible for protecting anyone... If they were, we could hold them civally liable for crimes committed on their watch. the police prevent crimes where possible, but their job is to patrol (create a police presence), respond, and investigate. Stationing officers in one place eliminates their ability to patrol or respond to other more pressing matters.IF we think it's a good idea to station armed personnel in schools (and i'm not convinced that it is), then it should be National Guard members, or some other military personnel who are officially stationed or deployed there. THAT is the military's job - defending us from threats, both foreign and domestic.My thoughts on putting armed personnel in schools? It's a nice feel-good measure, but a single armed guard won't make any difference to someone who plans a massacre. The guard will just be the first person shot.It will take at least 3-5 trained individuals to adequately respond to a single shooter, or something like the duo at Columbine. Teachers are already on-site in the course of their daily job. I don't think any teachers should be forced to carry, or undergo any kind of weapons or defensive training beyond hiding their students, but any who are willing should receive as much training as they'll accept. Make it a quasi-military designation that any citizen can obtain in a year or so with some classroom and tactical classes on weekends, or an accelerated 6-week full-time course over summers.Then you have a set of uniform standards nation-wide (or at least state-wide), and any adult employee in the school district could obtain it. I'm talking janitors, teachers, coaches, or any other staff member who is in the building on a daily basis.I like the idea of it being a voluntary core of teachers who are trained to a certain competency level(nice the NRA has offered to provide this service), and I think as mentioned in another thread on here(TPoppa maybe?) they should be anonymous and exist much like the federal air marshals, with no one knowing who is a member unless the need arises. Also support the idea of their arms being securely stored but quickly accessible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted December 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 My question is "who are these armed security people going to be?" They mentioned on and off duty police, reserve police, retired police and military, firefighters, etc.On-duty police officers should not be used to guard schools. Police are not guards. That is a military function.While the police moto might be "to protect and serve," they are not legally responsible for protecting anyone... If they were, we could hold them civally liable for crimes committed on their watch. the police prevent crimes where possible, but their job is to patrol (create a police presence), respond, and investigate. Stationing officers in one place eliminates their ability to patrol or respond to other more pressing matters. I wholly disagree with you. IF we think it's a good idea to station armed personnel in schools (and i'm not convinced that it is), then it should be National Guard members, or some other military personnel who are officially stationed or deployed there. THAT is the military's job - defending us from threats, both foreign and domestic. In no way would I advocate active duty military protecting our schools. My thoughts on putting armed personnel in schools? It's a nice feel-good measure, but a single armed guard won't make any difference to someone who plans a massacre. The guard will just be the first person shot. Banning assault rifles is a feel-good measure. Gun free zones are feel-good measures. Etc. At least with someone armed in a school, there would've been a fighting chance. Without, it was literally like shooting fish in a bucket. It will take at least 3-5 trained individuals to adequately respond to a single shooter, or something like the duo at Columbine. Teachers are already on-site in the course of their daily job. I don't think any teachers should be forced to carry, or undergo any kind of weapons or defensive training beyond hiding their students, but any who are willing should receive as much training as they'll accept. Make it a quasi-military designation that any citizen can obtain in a year or so with some classroom and tactical classes on weekends, or an accelerated 6-week full-time course over summers.Then you have a set of uniform standards nation-wide (or at least state-wide), and any adult employee in the school district could obtain it. I'm talking janitors, teachers, coaches, or any other staff member who is in the building on a daily basis. I agree. The NRA speech today went along the same lines, and they even said they'd fund it. National School Shield. They are developing the courses and training, and will train any volunteers interested. No schools would be forced into it, but all schools would be welcome to participate.Like I said, I've never been a huge fan of the NRA. However, they're the first to come to the table with a real, logical proposition to resolve this issue of gun violence in our schools. Laws don't work. If they did, the shooters would've abided by the gun free zone and homicide laws. Criminals aren't law-abiding citizens. Creating more laws simply isn't a logical solution. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madcat6183 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 They mentioned on and off duty police, reserve police, retired police and military, firefighters, etc.I wholly disagree with you. In no way would I advocate active duty military protecting our schools. Banning assault rifles is a feel-good measure. Gun free zones are feel-good measures. Etc. At least with someone armed in a school, there would've been a fighting chance. Without, it was literally like shooting fish in a bucket. I agree. The NRA speech today went along the same lines, and they even said they'd fund it. National School Shield. They are developing the courses and training, and will train any volunteers interested. No schools would be forced into it, but all schools would be welcome to participate.Like I said, I've never been a huge fan of the NRA. However, they're the first to come to the table with a real, logical proposition to resolve this issue of gun violence in our schools. Laws don't work. If they did, the shooters would've abided by the gun free zone and homicide laws. Criminals aren't law-abiding citizens. Creating more laws simply isn't a logical solution.:bow: Did we lose the clapping one? Casper hit it on the money, and I was the same way, I actually didn't like the NRA because I just couldn't get into them, and always seemed like it was ONLY a political thing. In fact I see now it isn't, they do plenty of good, always have, I was just too blind to it.Casper, good write up man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C-bus Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 I like the idea of it being a voluntary core of teachers who are trained to a certain competency level(nice the NRA has offered to provide this service), and I think as mentioned in another thread on here(TPoppa maybe?) they should be anonymous and exist much like the federal air marshals, with no one knowing who is a member unless the need arises. Also support the idea of their arms being securely stored but quickly accessible.+1One of the teachers at my kids' school is a young ex-military guy. Train him further and allow a CHL. May turn 28 dead into 5. Crazy people will always find a way to do evil. Our job is to mitigate the end result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Worse, in some cities or states, any sort of body armor is illegal.Most are written as "when in use during commission of a felony".edit: or use of a firearm, whatever.edit: In Ohio it's "violent felony"2941.1411 Offender wore or carried body armor specification.So unless the kid is the offender, he's good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted December 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 So unless the kid is the offender, he's good? Owning and wearing body armor (as far as I've read) is completely legal in Ohio unless done so while committing a crime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Did anyone see Feinstein's response to the NRA? By the time i saw the "live: feinstein response to nra statement" story on CNN.com the presser had ended and now I can't find the text or video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruit Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 (edited) Now I can't find any reference to it? Possibly a headline put in cnn.com too early? Edited December 21, 2012 by Scruit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casper Posted December 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Now I can't find any reference to it? Possibly a headline put in cnn.com too early? Lots of Google search results: https://www.google.com/search?q=feinstein+response+to+nra+statementBut none of them seem to have any info??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.