HB 191 Strret Racing Law, being debated today

[KillJoy]

I love.... Hey, thats racist!!!

 

Nope... that's profilin'

 

 

KillJoy

[Scotty2Hotty]

Given the state of any .Gov at the moment, get ready for this BS to pass. Lord knows of all things how much I'd love for "Law Enforcement" to get an even bigger head than what they already have. Because an officer's discretion is of course 100% correct an should never be questioned. Law Enforcement by example is infallible, so there can be no in between. When this passes, I don't see there being much of a "street car" deffinition anymore. Time for TRACK ONLY cars.

[Kurt B.]

I complain about all profiling of any and every person. Let me tell you about a time my brother was in Dublin visiting me and an officer said he was on the wrong side of town. Or the time I was pulled over and told we see you so dont do anything stupid... I was in a fucking envoy with my kids!!!!! Thats whats worries me about it. Being a victim of past bs I know all it takes is someone being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

 

 

I see PDQGP and Truckin have nothing to say about this scenareo. Typical, but like you said Tim, profiling works. Could someone explain to me what worked here? I must have missed something, Oh wait its that dammed "Race" card again. Shame on me for puttin down every fine upstanding LEO.

 

I have never raced from a stoplight, nor would I. I'm not in a rush to get anyone killed. Maybe I led you fine gentleman from my EXAMPLE situation above to believe I'm bitching about a law going into effect that will stop me from having fun at the expense of others. This is not what I am saying, nor did I.

 

V8beast said it best.

 

The concern is not the majority of the officers that do their jobs right. Of the many sports cars out there most will be ok... The bottom line is it gives the ones that abuse their power another outlet (as most laws do in this day and age). No one is against it, we are simply against the way its being presented. Reckless ops for misjudging your speed through a turn is now street racing There is a big difference between agressive driving, poor driving, and street racing. They need to spend more time on this and write it in a way that will help it pass. As a person that drives my TA for less than 3000 miles a year I dont have to worry.. but I would vote against it for the fact that it is very poorly written imo.

 

I guess to me there are just bigger things in life for me to wory about instead of petty shit like this.

 

 

I'm sorry you wasted your precious time, good luck with all the other worries in your life. Me and my big bad Cobra are now going to continue to help make sure this law goes on the book the right way, so maybe one day no LEO having a bad day see fit to Fuck with you because he can.

[Cordell]

It sounds as though most of us in this thread have strong views on the issue.

 

Has anyone made his views known to his State Senator?

 

It's not too late to do this. I've contacted mine, expressed my objections, and asked that he look carefully at the bill. I've also asked that other viewpoints be considered in the debate. Since my State Senator (Bill Harris) is also President of the Senate, my hope is that he might have some control in keeping this bill from just sliding right through the Senate and into law.

 

Here's how you find your State Senator's contact info:

http://www.ohiosenate.gov/

They all have email, if you prefer to contact them that way.

 

Here's some advice on writing a state legislator:

http://www.nchomebirth.com/HTwriteRepresentative.html

 

Also, CR can draft a petition expressing our common objections, and members can sign electronically. We could forward that to our State Senators.

 

Perhaps I'm too optimistic that a bill with this much perceived support from the public can be modified/defeated, but it seems to me that the best we can do is to make a case that the bill be closely examined. If debate is vigorous enough, then I think that the Draconian elements will be exposed for what they are.

 

Just for those that missed it.

[Kurt B.]

Letter written.

[wagner]

Ok guys I might have some good news on this.

 

One of the guys I race R/C with is a Columbus cop (who has a bad ass R32 and is getting ready to start a slammed F350 project) and I decided to ask him about this.

 

I explained to him our concerns and what people were talking about. His reaction, laughter and "you are joking right".

 

He told me that they were aware of the law and its possible passage. If this is passed the way he told me it would be enforced is "two people lined up racing A to B". The columbus cops according to him are way to busy to try and jam people up with this.

 

He also went on to tell me that any lawyer worth a damn could very easily get someone off the charge if it was brought against someone who was not racing another person. The likely hood of you getting a reckless op is higher from driving like a dumbass.

 

The general feeling I got from him is that they could care less about anybody but those who are street racing. Now if they catch you street racing you might as well bend over because you are going to take it long and slow. That is what this law is designed for to stop people from getting off easy and trust me from what he told me that won't happen again.

 

Bike guys he also said as long as you are not ridding like a moron you should be ok but they planned on cracking down on "aggressive ridding" anyway. I asked him how it would be applied there and again it was the point A to point B answer but they are going to start handing reckless ops out like candy at halloween.

 

So in short don't street race and guess what? You won't get in trouble! You get caught might as well say good by to your car, freedom, license, and car.

[Doc1647545523]

So in short don't street race and guess what? You won't get in trouble!

 

If you get a cop who sees it that way ........

 

Would I be willing to bet forfeiting my car that it will be enforced that way?

 

Story from two weeks ago:

 

Six of us from CR were at my garage late on Saturday night. We left the lot, essentially no other cars on the road, me in front with the Lotus. Others were in Miatas and MR2's, as I recall.

 

We turned onto Liberty road a bit fast, but were never above the speed limit (35 mph). I was told that one car got light in the rear end on the turn. We were all pulled over immediately by Delaware City Police. Allegedly, an officer "thought he heard a tire squealing" on the turn. I expressed my annoyance with the officer about being stopped on such flimsy evidence. Result: two curfew warnings, one disturbing the peace written warning.

 

If the current version of this street racing law passes, I could see that six cars would be forfeited.

 

I'd like to believe that you're right, Wagner, but I wouldn't trust it to be that way based on what one Columbus cop said.

 

And I don't see OSP giving anyone any breaks on this. I've been stopped countless times because, "it appeared as though you were speeding."

 

Bottom line: stop this nonsense before it passes into law. Hoping you get an understanding cop or that you'll win with a good lawyer are last resorts.

[TTQ B4U]

I complain about all profiling of any and every person. Let me tell you about a time my brother was in Dublin visiting me and an officer said he was on the wrong side of town. Or the time I was pulled over and told we see you so dont do anything stupid... I was in a fucking envoy with my kids!!!!! Thats whats worries me about it. Being a victim of past bs I know all it takes is someone being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

I see PDQGP and Truckin have nothing to say about this scenareo. Typical, but like you said Tim, profiling works. Could someone explain to me what worked here? I must have missed something, Oh wait its that dammed "Race" card again. Shame on me for puttin down every fine upstanding LEO.

 

I did comment on it. I've been profiled just the same. ONce a long time ago when driving through...yes.....Gary, IN. I told the story here on CR. The other just a few weeks back on the east side here in Cbus when I was stopped by a CPD Motorcycle on the east side. I rolled stop sign but was "way out of place" in the area I was driving in.....and I absolutely was. I was the only Caucasian for miles outside the cop.

 

My ultimate reply, big deal. We have 72 homes in our subdivision and if there was a black guy walking in the area, he would feel completely out of place if he was just there and not visiting someone. What happened in Brian's situation, don't know....wasn't there. Only he can comment and share one side of the story. I make nothing more of it other than it happened. What can you say?

 

Besides, profiling an individual is completely different than profiling a car. Again, go write me up a profile of all the cars in street racing vids on you tube and tell me then don't fit an exact profile of one another. 90% absolutely do. NOw if you have a car that fits that profile, then you might want to consider putting on your reality hat and not drive like an ass or put yourself in a situation that could lead to being put in a situation that's not favorable to you.

[V8 Beast]

When you leave the courts and law enforcement that much room to interpret the law innocent people will get drug through the mud. The numbers may be low but its still there. I cant condone hurting a few innocents for the greater good. when it can obviously be prevented.

 

p.s... If this passes Gahanna will have a lot less visitors

 

Besides, profiling an individual is completely different than profiling a car. Again, go write me up a profile of all the cars in street racing vids on you tube and tell me then don't fit an exact profile of one another. 90% absolutely do. NOw if you have a car that fits that profile, then you might want to consider putting on your reality hat and not drive like an ass or put yourself in a situation that could lead to being put in a situation that's not favorable to you.

 

Tim you are missing the point... I drive a 10 second transam. Never having had a ticket before in my entire life I would still be doubted, stressed out, have to pay for representation, and hope they believe me. If I was racing I deserve what I get. If somebody decides in the back of their mind that I must be a streeet racer and wants to make my life hell it becomes very very easy to do so. If you saw my car and someone (not even an officer) said I was racing would you believe me? And most people do not street race. The 90% you see on youtube are about 10% of the racing world. Even of the hundreds of active people on CR only a handful street race. At a normal meet of the 90 cars there are only 10 at most would go out to race (on a good day). Most people with sports cars do absolutely test them from time to time but they do not race.

 

The whole envoy situation.. I was in the envoy at a redlight. The cop pulled up next to me. Light turned green I drove off. He stayed back and followed me for a few minutes then pulled me over for no damn reason. I was driving 34 in 35 on my way to take my kids to get Coldstone. He was reported but thats all I could do. Never heard anything after that. The worst part of it all was having to explain to my kids that not all cops are dicks so they should still repsect them. Is profiling good in this situation? Did he stop me from selling drugs with my kids in the back by saying Im watching you? Nope, all he did was teach an 8 year old and 5 year old kid that they never want to be cops when they grow up... and make me waste time writing a letter.

Edited December 12, 2009 by V8 Beast

[TTQ B4U]

When you leave the courts and law enforcement that much room to interpret the law innocent people will get drug through the mud. The numbers may be low but its still there. I cant condone hurting a few innocents for the greater good. when it can obviously be prevented.

 

p.s... If this passes Gahanna will have a lot less visitors

 

I agree that there's a lot of room for interpretation and it needs tightened up. I also had dinner last night with my wife and our friends, one of whom is a criminal lawyer and they both said, there's lots of room to fight this one should you end up in court.

 

Bottom line what they are after with this bill is to stop/lesson idiots from hitting triple digit speeds on public roads and getting off with nothing but a reckless op and 6pts. ie...and I'm only picking this thread since it happened to be right there on page 1:

http://www.columbusracing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74817

 

Hell, even those that have run from the police in such situations, lose their license and take a hit on their record have gotten off pretty easy IMO. They deserved more and that's exactly what the intent of this law aims to deliver. The time for negotiating such lenient deals is coming to an end.

 

It will certainly be interesting to see how it all plays out.

[V8 Beast]

I agree that there's a lot of room for interpretation and it needs tightened up. I also had dinner last night with my wife and our friends, one of whom is a criminal lawyer and they both said, there's lots of room to fight this one should you end up in court.

 

Bottom line what they are after with this bill is to stop/lesson idiots from hitting triple digit speeds on public roads and getting off with nothing but a reckless op and 6pts. ie...and I'm only picking this thread since it happened to be right there on page 1:

http://www.columbusracing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74817

 

Hell, even those that have run from the police in such situations, lose their license and take a hit on their record have gotten off pretty easy IMO. They deserved more and that's exactly what the intent of this law aims to deliver. The time for negotiating such lenient deals is coming to an end.

 

It will certainly be interesting to see how it all plays out.

 

Ok, ignore the part of my post about you missing the point You obviously get it.. looks like you are playing devils advocate. There is a good side of this (the people going triple digits for instance) it just needs t be tightened up a little like you said.

 

Edit: I really do think street racing and DUI's should be handled the exact same way. Make the penaltys harder for both and keep repeat offendeers off the street.

[Kurt B.]

 

 

 

The other just a few weeks back on the east side here in Cbus when I was stopped by a CPD Motorcycle on the east side. I rolled stop sign but was "way out of place" in the area I was driving in.....and I absolutely was. I was the only Caucasian for miles outside the cop.

 

A white guy profiled in a black neighborhood, that has got to be the funniest shit I've heard in awhile. You got stopped because you ran a stop sign, no other reason, hell he probably thought you were lost.

[TTQ B4U]

A white guy profiled in a black neighborhood, that has got to be the funniest shit I've heard in awhile. You got stopped because you ran a stop sign, no other reason, hell he probably thought you were lost.

 

So it would never cross your mind that a white guy would perhaps be there to buy drugs? I quoted the cop. "way out of place in the area" His words, not mine. Needless to say, he also said he wasn't going to bust me for rolling through the stop sign. Just told me to be careful and let me on my way. He was very cool.

 

What the hell are you worried about in terms of this bill? Cops aren't going to go around hassling you for driving a Mustang. You're car isn't what's going to get you busted. If you drive it like an ass, that driving is what will get you busted. They have the same power today to bust you with your word vs theirs. They don't have to clock you to say you were speeding and if they nail you for racing, then you'll be in court just the same.

[Guest Hal]

So it would never cross your mind that a white guy would perhaps be there to buy drugs? I quoted the cop. "way out of place in the area" His words, not mine. Needless to say, he also said he wasn't going to bust me for rolling through the stop sign. Just told me to be careful and let me on my way. He was very cool.

 

So how much did the drugs cost you?

[SRT-4 8U]

FYI - A DUI is also a 1st degree misdemeanor. Using nitrous anywhere other than a track under this law is the same as a DUI.

 

So what if you have a saleen focus that comes with nitrous?

 

I guess it's just a better reason to go turbo

 

 

Damn what a law. only if they could put that kind of effort into......... fuck-it

[Kurt B.]

So it would never cross your mind that a white guy would perhaps be there to buy drugs? I quoted the cop. "way out of place in the area" His words, not mine. Needless to say, he also said he wasn't going to bust me for rolling through the stop sign. Just told me to be careful and let me on my way. He was very cool.

 

What the hell are you worried about in terms of this bill? Cops aren't going to go around hassling you for driving a Mustang. You're car isn't what's going to get you busted. If you drive it like an ass, that driving is what will get you busted. They have the same power today to bust you with your word vs theirs. They don't have to clock you to say you were speeding and if they nail you for racing, then you'll be in court just the same.

 

We dont live in the same world obviously, Cam's been harrased twice this summer by the Minerva park cops, for no other reason than driving while black in a nice car. The second time a Franklin Cty. Sherrif rolled up on the stop, and told them to impound the car because his rear tires didn't have enough tread on them, and the tires were a hazzard, total BS that my lawyer had a field day with.

So dont give me "what the hell am I worried about" I worry about driving past every cop I see, hoping he's not having a shitty day. A problem you probably will never have to worry about.

[truckin]

I see PDQGP and Truckin have nothing to say about this scenareo. Typical,

 

I'm sorry you wasted your precious time, good luck with all the other worries in your life. Me and my big bad Cobra are now going to continue to help make sure this law goes on the book the right way, so maybe one day no LEO having a bad day see fit to Fuck with you because he can.

 

Sorry, I couldnt respond to your post. I had moved on with my life.......some people have those.

 

 

Thanks for the thoughts..........Merry Christmas

[Kurt B.]

Sorry, I couldnt respond to your post. I had moved on with my life.......some people have those.

 

 

Thanks for the thoughts..........Merry Christmas

 

If your life is so important why bother saying anythig more..................you bore me.

[truckin]

We dont live in the same world obviously, Cam's been harrased twice this summer by the Minerva park cops, for no other reason than driving while black in a nice car. The second time a Franklin Cty. Sherrif rolled up on the stop, and told them to impound the car because his rear tires didn't have enough tread on them, and the tires were a hazzard, total BS that my lawyer had a field day with.

So dont give me "what the hell am I worried about" I worry about driving past every cop I see, hoping he's not having a shitty day. A problem you probably will never have to worry about.

 

 

How old is Cam? I assume he is a younger adult or teen, probally driving a pretty quick car? Loud exhaust? maybe drawing attention to himself? I dunno....maybe....... maybe not? This isn't the first time in history this stuff has happened pal, and not saying Cam is this way, but most kids aren't angels behind the wheel. If the cops were just harrassing him with no proof then you fight it and you'll win. Some cops are dicks, but those are ones that you'll win in court cause they won't bother showing up or don't have enough proof, or figure a person won't fight it.

 

And last time i checked if tires dont have enough tread on them they are a hazzard. Now I don't know how much tread was on those tires cause you didn't provide that info, so either there wasn't a sufficent depth according to dot regulations for street tires or they were close to being a hazzard. So the officer felt it might be a hazzard? Were they dot legal slicks? MT's? Nitto DR's? Sounds like it went your way in the court room....and good for you and Cam, you must have provided more info to them to change the ruling than you did with us trying and prove a point.

 

I'm sure They were street tires and I'm sure he had some tread wear where he was doing burnouts "at the track" or in "your driveway" or possibly in "Mexico" and not breaking laws on public streets.

 

If you seriously "worry about driving past every cop you see, hoping he dosen't have a shitty day"..........you have some serious issues and either need some help maybe some meds.....or you just need to grow a set. I could give a shit less if I pass a cop or a cop is following me.

 

Like I said I've got more important things to worry about.

[truckin]

If your life is so important why bother saying anythig more..................you bore me.

 

I had stopped saying anything........but you felt it was necessary to bring me back into this thread.

 

You need our quotes to make some sense in whatever your trying to say. I must not bore you cause you keep comming up with another sad story of how you and your family are being profilied and harrassed.

 

 

I find you funny

[Cordell]

I'm just going to put in my 2 cents and side with Kurt, this thread has gotten stupid anyway. For those of you who think that racism, profiling, and general injustice don't still exist are living in a dream world. Come back to reality and quit burning up posts with stupid bullshit in regards to your fantasy.

[TTQ B4U]

So dont give me "what the hell am I worried about" I worry about driving past every cop I see, hoping he's not having a shitty day. A problem you probably will never have to worry about.

 

Who is Cam? Son/Daughter? I don't know you, so I'm sorry. Either way, if they or you really truly worry about driving past a cop then there's no doubt the unwanted attention you all are getting is something specific to you and your cars. You have a nice looking mustang, but I don't see it crying out "pull me over" all by itself.

 

I travel for a living and for the past two years, all over Cbus via car. I have zero issues about being hassled. And you're right, I probably will never have to. Keep in mind, my MS3 isn't my only nor my first car. I've had two very modified GTP's and others. The only issue with either my 97 or 99 was one ticket for 80mph in a 65mph zone. My fault and I reacted slowly to the situation. No big deal.

 

Again, the law is pretty vague, I'll give you that. However, I don't see cars being auctioned off because someone has low tread or is pulled over for taking a curve with spirit. Racing IMO can be done alone or against another car. So next time I race up 33 along my scenic route, I'll certainly remember my stance and the new bill. However I don't see my way of driving as an issue.

 

Best of luck to you.

[TTQ B4U]

I'm just going to put in my 2 cents and side with Kurt, this thread has gotten stupid anyway. For those of you who think that racism, profiling, and general injustice don't still exist are living in a dream world. Come back to reality and quit burning up posts with stupid bullshit in regards to your fantasy.

 

I'm not saying any of it doesn't exist. I am saying that I don't see you being pulled over for racing and having your car taken simply because you're not white and driving a sporty car. Could you be hassled? Sure. Shit happens we all know it. However, I don't see a cop initiating a car being taken and a court allowing it, simply for "looking" like you were doing something. We all know what is written in a bill or a law isn't carried out to the letter. That's what courts are there for. Hell, just look at how many people actually do wrong and pretty much walk.

[Cordell]

I'm not saying any of it doesn't exist. I am saying that I don't see you being pulled over for racing and having your car taken simply because you're not white and driving a sporty car. Could you be hassled? Sure. Shit happens we all know it. However, I don't see a cop initiating a car being taken and a court allowing it, simply for "looking" like you were doing something.

 

Honestly I do, that is why I have made my feelings on this bill clearly known to everybody, including my elected officals. I get harrassed and followed all the time in my Camaro, and when I'm driving Starmaster03's Trans Am. I hardly even speed when I drive those cars. Point is cops are human, and as such can be vindictive or prejudice. I don't trust any of them, and as loosly as this bill is written give them room to give me a harder time. Maybe I will get my car back if something happens, but if some cop wants to push it I could be stuck having to pay out money in legal fees just to fight it when it shouldn't be able to get that far in the first place.

[truckin]

I'm just going to put in my 2 cents and side with Kurt, this thread has gotten stupid anyway. For those of you who think that racism, profiling, and general injustice don't still exist are living in a dream world. Come back to reality and quit burning up posts with stupid bullshit in regards to your fantasy.[/Quote]

 

I don't think anyone is denying it dosen't exsist.........but their are justified circumstances and situations for profiling. Racism is not right and shouldn't be tolerated.

 

But face the facts.........profiling saves lives regardless if it's fighting terrorism, DUI checks, Drug enforcement, prostitution, Pedifiles, Street racing, reckless driving etc. etc. etc. If your going to profile........profile everyone! If you dont thats the true injustice. People feel law enforcement is out to get them........if the same people that feel this way spent half the amount of time they do bitching and crying about being harrassed and profiled and put that towards talking to others who may be more prone to act carelessly and endanger others while on roadways. THIS WOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE!

 

Instead lets remain blind and not face the facts of reality and continue to blame Law enforcement for our own stupid decisions.