When do you change your oil?

[Moto-Brian]

As long as the car oil does not contain molys (read: no EC logo) it won't effect your clutch. Look at your manual, it's in there.

You seriously think oil companies spend all that money developing synthetic oils and they're sub par to motorcycle oil? It's called marketing.

Me, as well as plenty of others have been running normal off the shelf car oil with no ill effect.

The point is that while you are right (cannot conatin the EC logo/name) it is still a situation that under severe stress and abuse that a motorcycle engine will produce (Oil will break down faster in a motorcycle than a car - 15k RPM redline does that...) is something to consider. I'm not about to get into a debate as to what oil is best or car vs. motorcycle...

Do what works for you. He asked, you flamed. End of story. You seem wise beyond your years. Me? I'll continue to use motorcycle specific oils and as of 14 years, I've never had a clutch issue...

[Moto-Brian]

It isn't true. There have been studies showing OEM filters are worse than the cheaper cross referenced filters.

Simply because it comes on the bike stock doesn't make it the best...

Granted, the stock filter will work fine but if you can buy a better filter for less money, why use the stock one?

Show us the study you refer. You think Purolator does tests on motorcycles?? Also, tell me why you think the OEM filter isn't good or as good... Try not quoting the Wikipedia or whatever it is called...

[Moto-Brian]

I've got 22k miles and counting with not a single issue on a stock clutch, stock transmission and stock motor.

I'm not the only one, there are plenty of racers that abuse their bikes quite a bit more than what mine sees and none of them have issues.

Again, tell us these "plenty of racers" and let's hear what they are using. A lot of guys use Rotella (oil for diesel trucks) as it contains many the same if not more than what is found in motorcycle oils. It also has anti foaming agents in it, as well...

Again, you got 22k miles. You're proof it can work, but I have proof that motorcycle oil works perfect too. So, what's the right answer? Both?

[kenny]

Article on the oil test already posted, filter info,

http://www.calsci.com/motorcycleinfo/Filters.html

What would I know though, I can't even use Google.

[kenny]

Again, tell us these "plenty of racers" and let's hear what they are using. A lot of guys use Rotella (oil for diesel trucks) as it contains many the same if not more than what is found in motorcycle oils. It also has anti foaming agents in it, as well...

Again, you got 22k miles. You're proof it can work, but I have proof that motorcycle oil works perfect too. So, what's the right answer? Both?

I never said stock stuff wouldn't work, I simply said it costs more.

Both net the same results, you pay more for one. Why spend more when the end result is the same?

Here is a single thread with plenty of people using Mobil 1,

http://www.r6messagenet.com/forums/r6-maintenance-technical/41403-definitive-oil-thread.html

Edit: IIRC the diesel oil thing is actually a pretty bad idea, but it's been a while since I read about that and I'm about to leave work so I don't feel like digging into it, just going off memory. Maybe I'll be bored enough at work tomorrow to re-read that one.

[Moto-Brian]

wat

Do you have any proof of this or just hearsay?

Considering there are TONS of racers using it I'm pretty sure you have no facts to back this statement.

Again, "TONS" now... I can give you a "TON" of top shelf racers and teams that AREN'T using CAR oil... But, enlighten me. Please.

[Moto-Brian]

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Motorcycle_Oil_FAQs.aspx#FAQs2

i think you stated you ran mobil.

What do you know anyways? He's got 22k miles and knows TONS of racers...

He checked Wikipedia and found that the EC shouldn't be on there and as long as it isn't, they are the same.

[Moto-Brian]

I've met plenty of mechanics that have no business turning a wrench, so that argument doesn't really fly.

Let's make this simple for those of you that have to run whatever came in the bike from the factory:

Show me ONE bike that has had a failure due to any of the filters/oil I mentioned.

K&N filters had a VERY bad track record to the point they were banned for race use. Does that mean they should NEVER be used? No. They've fixed the issues and moved on. But, you asking for examples? Dude, you're the one throwing out generalizations. YOU need to provide proof... Not what your "buds" are running or the three amateur racers you know are running due to budgets and such...

[kenny]

Again, "TONS" now... I can give you a "TON" of top shelf racers and teams that AREN'T using CAR oil... But, enlighten me. Please.

No shit. You can probably find guys that run dino oil too.

I use what I use because its much easier to find and a little less expensive and does the exact same thing with no side effects.

Believe what you want, act like you know everything, it doesn't matter to me.

[kenny]

K&N filters had a VERY bad track record to the point they were banned for race use. Does that mean they should NEVER be used? No. They've fixed the issues and moved on. But, you asking for examples? Dude, you're the one throwing out generalizations. YOU need to provide proof... Not what your "buds" are running or the three amateur racers you know are running due to budgets and such...

Read the article.

What's next, you're going to say it isn't valid because they did the test in 1994?

[Moto-Brian]

Take your own advice and do some research.

http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/oiltest1.htm

Just one of the many. Again, find me ONE bike that failed due to Mobil 1 extended life. You said it would be easy, you said you know how to Google it, get on it.

You are quoting a HD twin technology based website? Are you serious? Do you understand the differences between the HD platform and your own? Another trip to Wiki...

[kenny]

You are quoting a HD twin technology based website? Are you serious? Do you understand the differences between the HD platform and your own? Another trip to Wiki...

You can not be this daft.

Let me make this painfully clear for you,

This article is from the February, 1994 Motorcycle Consumer News in the article "Motorcycle Oils vs. Automotive Oils". Full credit for this article and study go to the original authors.

[Moto-Brian]

You probably should have read the article I posted before typing that reply, that is EXACTLY what they did.

Christ.

Did they use a HD or a Japanese in-line under today's technology? Hmmmmm...

Also, Isaac hit the nail on the head. Pull a motor a part and check the journels. Run it for 60 plus hours and see what blues and what doesn't. Do as you wish, but I am willing to bet that your motor looks like shit compared to another one with proper oil being used... Maybe not - there are ALWAYS exceptions to every rule, but you have been put out there as being asked to prove points and you pull up a HD Twin based result and site...

[kenny]

Did they use a HD or a Japanese in-line under today's technology? Hmmmmm...

Also, Isaac hit the nail on the head. Pull a motor a part and check the journels. Run it for 60 plus hours and see what blues and what doesn't. Do as you wish, but I am willing to bet that your motor looks like shit compared to another one with proper oil being used... Maybe not - there are ALWAYS exceptions to every rule, but you have been put out there as being asked to prove points and you pull up a HD Twin based result and site...

Read. The. Article.

The motorcycle oil producers have suggested that other criteria. such as the amount of wear metals and contaminants, might be unacceptable when using automotive oil in a motorcycle. To test this theory, I sent a sample of the Castrol GTX at 1500 miles to SpectroTech. Inc., for a complete oil analysis. Their findings were that all contaminants (water, dirt, coolant and sludge) were normal.

SpectroTech also reported that all wear elements (antimony, titanium, silver, copper, lead, tin, aluminum, nickel, chromium, cadmium, sodium and boron) were normal except for iron, which was reported as "mildly above normal" at 51 parts per million.

SpectroTech lists acceptable levels for all of the above listed metals except iron, for which they state, "values vary greatly with systems and parts." so it is not clear what exactly is meant by "mildly above normal." Perhaps it was in comparison to cars with 1500 miles on the oil. Also, this could have been due to cam wear, since the early Honda V-4s were known for excessive cam and rocker arm wear.

In any case, again I could find nothing to support the argument that automotive oils were somehow less effective than motorcycle-specific lubricants when used in a motorcycle.

[Moto-Brian]

Read. The. Article.

Ok, since I am daft... Kawi Kid produced a good article from Mobil 1. You apparently thought it was a poor read. You have an article in your hands that I skimmed over and had enough to realize it was one article that SUGGESTED car was the same as motorcycle. They (from your supplied quotes and I couldn't find where they did more) pulled oil samples and sent them off. I asked what the journals looked like. Was there any blueing of the metal parts internally? What was the amount of time on each motor? What did the clutch look like?

Good questions with zero answers.

Enough time, one can find results supporting AND against said topic. You, however, have thrown out VERY generalizing comments. "tons of racers using it", etc. You get the idea. You also base your opinions on the R6 forum? Whoa.

Anyways, run what you want. Nobody here is really wrong apparently so, drop it. Run in your R1 what you will. I personally will always suggest and use CONCRETE examples of how well motorcycle oils worked for us in our endurance racing bikes and sprint bikes. Also from what I have seen personally with street bikes that were torn down.

All I am asking is to quit with the generalizations...

[kenny]

I guess all that you read on Wikipedia didn't give you the basic reading comprehension needed to grasp simple concepts like authors, facts, data, etc.

With that, I'm going home. Thanks for the laughs during my boring day of work.

[f4isvt]

so if your car calls for 5-20 would you run 10-30 or rotella if a forum said it was ok to do so?

[Disclaimer]

No manual can tell you the perfect oil for your application. There are suggestions, but depending on your usage and application, you, as a responsible owner, need to make the call as what's best for your powertrain.

[dustinsn3485]

Canola oil FTW

[wolfman]

Canola oil FTW

F that! I've been running olive oil (extra virgin!) for 17k...no problems! Adds 10 hp, too!

[wolfman]

It all depends on how long I plan on keeping the bike.

On my first (02 R6) I changed it once in 12,000 miles because it was my first bike and knew I would sell it after a year or 2.

Remind me to never buy a used bike again!!

[f4isvt]

^^^ or a lease turn in. People out there are amazingly selfish and don't care who gets screwed over with what they had. Talked to a guy that never changed his oil because he leased never added oil, checked it nothing. Drove the piss out of it for how ever long his lease was and did not do one maintence item.

[max power]

Yeah, I think I'd buy a rental car over a lease return. Wait, no I wouldn't, people do neutral drops in those puppies.

BTW, hookers is in the lead.

[zerocrash]

My bikes don't ever get put up for winter storage. I change the oil around every 3k miles and I use Honda oil.

[max power]

I heard you don't change your oil because you trade them in first.