How Long Did It Take You?

[blue03636]

Yep I was there with my blue and silver checkered 03 zx6r. That girl was moving.

[NinjaNick]

Yep I was there with my blue and silver checkered 03 zx6r. That girl was moving.

Pretty damn cool that we've probably crossed paths before. That was a HOT day. IIRC air was 96-100 degrees and the track was hot as hell. We had a 24pk of 16oz waters and some Gatorade and I didn't piss ONE TIME! I was soaked all day long.

Oh yeah, I was there on my 2003 BLACK 636.

[MidgetTodd]

I have benifited from all the time and money that Uncle Punk has invested in track days too........Because all of my balls out ride it like you stole it releasing the demons paced rides on the street have been following him and trying my damdest to stay close enough to see his lines and body postion I have improved many areas of my ability from following him and listening to him.

I haz not road wif u. I r Squid. Can I brink my Katana and break it luse at 140.

No but you can bring the R6 or the Husky.

[jbot]

here is an interesting article i read some time ago. somebody might've even posted it in a thread somewhere before. I think it pertains to this discussion. i have mixed feelings about it, but that's what makes it interesting for me.

by Hiro Minowara

THE FAST GUY. Everyone knows him, or has at least heard of him. Almost everyone, anyway. For those few who may not have made his acquaintance, here's a brief introduction (insert the location of your choice for local color):

"You know so-and-so, right?"

"No, never heard of him."

"He's the fastest guy on the mountain. He's been riding up here forever. Knows the road like the back of his hand. He's the smoothest rider I've ever seen. Rides a such-and-such brand bike, bone-stock. No one's ever been able to keep up with him. One time, I had him in sight for a couple of turns, but then he just disappeared..."

The Fast Guy is legendary no matter where one hears of him. Many riders believe he possesses such a high level of skill it would be quite impossible for him to crash, no matter what the road conditions might be. I queried one middle-aged sportbike pilot about this phenomenon. He explained that if a rider could turn such-and-such a lap time at a certain race track, said rider would then have proven sufficient skill to run at a blistering pace on the street and never crash. I found this perspective rather peculiar, as I had turned similar times at that self-same track, and didn't feel myself especially immune to crashing.

Other riders—the sort who never see the Fast Guy until he's finished his third cigarette while waiting for them to catch up—seem to think being smooth is the key. The Fast Guy's ethereal fluency is lauded ad nauseam, until the listener becomes so disheartened with his own riding he very nearly pushes his bike off the nearest cliff. But is it really a seamless and facile style, or the ability to turn a certain lap time, that gives the Fast Guy his amazing speed and status?

I think not. No, belay that qualification. I know not. The thing that makes the Fast Guy fast is denial. Denial that anything could be waiting around that blind curve he's entering at triple-digit speeds and maximum lean angle. Denial that he has any responsibility whatsoever to other motorists to ride responsibly. Denial that the rules apply to him in any way, shape, or form. Rather, the Fast Guy's main trick is to memorize the road from years and years of riding it, and behave as if nothing will ever happen. Yes, there is a modicum of skill involved, but nowhere near that demonstrated by even midpack club racers. On the rare occasions when fast guys sign up for a track day or riding school, they are invariably bested by moderately skilled club racers on machines much older and smaller than their own. No, it's not skill, it's denial—and luck.

Luck notwithstanding, Fast Guys are frequently involved in tragic circumstances, even if the crash is not their own. The Fast Guy is often at the head of a pack where a rider or two crashed trying to keep up. Or maybe he's chopped off another rider to show him who's best, angering one or more of the group with his irresponsible actions. Either way, he's generally mixed up in the kind of mischief that leads to accidents, citations, lawsuits, and tragedy.

But every Fast Guy's luck runs out one day. It may take decades, but all Fast Guys eventually encounter a set of circumstances well beyond any rider's ability to manage, regardless of the lap times they can turn. I can think of five "Fast Guys" right now, and for each there was a different way to die. For one, it was a locked snow gate, impacted at 90 mph. For another, it was a 30 mph turn taken at 130. For a third, it was a stalled bus in the apex of a blind turn. There was the hidden layer of fine sand for a fourth, and a vicious high-speed tank-slapper for the fifth. All dead, and all because they had doubled or tripled the speed limit. There was no time to react and no room to maneuver at the speeds these riders were traveling.

Fast Guys may enjoy local notoriety, and attention from slower riders that approaches deification. But in the grand scheme of things, they've earned nothing. They endanger the lives of others, scoff at common sense and the basic speed law, and generally believe they are above and beyond the rules that apply to ordinary people. But they are not. The odds always catch up with them one way or another.

What the Fast Guy has done for us is to show us what not to do, and where not to do it. High speed belongs on the racetrack, not the street. There is a long list of corpses that, if they could speak from the grave, would likely agree.

[DreamNofR1]

I do have to say, I have mixed feelings about this as well. I completely understand that no one is immune to anything, anyone or any type of condition. However, to say that they have "earned nothing" isn't right IMO. They've obviously earned the skill from riding and respect from others by doing so - but there are certain circumstances where I can see someone being too cocky and not paying enough attention to detail (like unexpected sand or gravel spots). Good article, all-in-all.

[Carwhore]

just expect at one point you will go down. It's inevitable. No matter how good of a rider you are.

[blue03636]

Pretty damn cool that we've probably crossed paths before. That was a HOT day. IIRC air was 96-100 degrees and the track was hot as hell. We had a 24pk of 16oz waters and some Gatorade and I didn't piss ONE TIME! I was soaked all day long.

Hell yea, I remember seeing these pics somewhere before.

I do remember it was hot due to my buddy eating the rest of his subway sandwich that was left in the truck (windows up) and it had mayo on it. I can't believe he didn't get sick.

[DreamNofR1]

just expect at one point you will go down. It's inevitable. No matter how good of a rider you are.

I've already been down. The first time I went to Lancaster/Hocking Hills on my R6, years ago, was the time I went down. I pushed myself too hard and ever since then, learned my boundaries and learned that I should not play catch-up. Although I do have to say, it's a lot easier to judge corners and the path following someone rather than being far behind. Just like champ01 posted in this thread (the guy that rode with me this past Sunday), "you didn't ride above your ability."

[champ01]

Let me know if you go ride in the Coshocton area. I live up that way.

[DreamNofR1]

I'll definitely keep that in mind. Just like I told someone else on here, I've been wanting to ride that area - just haven't made it out that way quite yet.

[Mykill]

I'll definitely keep that in mind. Just like I told someone else on here, I've been wanting to ride that area - just haven't made it out that way quite yet.

Free Saturday or Sunday?

[redkow97]

Nelson is a piece of shit track, but it's still better (safer) than 99% of public roads. If you or your friends are that nervous about the track surface, come watch a MotoSeries day or a WERA race there. You can do a track walk after the day is over, and see how fast the Sam Gaiges, Eddie Krafts, and Jeff Wrobels of the world get around that "sketchy" track. I consider 1:10 - 1:12 to be a pretty fast lap there (that would win you a Novice C superbike race for sure). The three guys I listed are in the 1:07's. Most riders in the beginner group are lucky to break 1:30.

to SpeedyTriple's point, the track is a more conducive learning environment BECAUSE you're doing lap after lap. It affords you the opportunity to practice a given turn until you get it right. It's like taking batting practice in baseball - you don't stop after 1 pitch, or even after 1 hit. The idea is to get it right EVERY time.

The skills learned from the 9-15 turns on any given track prepare you for virtually any street riding scenario.

To go back to a baseball analogy, if you've spent all day learning to hit a pro pitcher's curve, change-up, and fast ball; when you encounter a high-school pitcher (on the street), it will be a pretty safe bet that you can handle everything he can throw at you, even though you've never seen it before.

[DreamNofR1]

Free Saturday or Sunday?

Sunday would probably work best. I am supposed to help a friend move on Saturday, which shouldn't take long, but I think they are also calling for storms that day as well. Sunday is the better bet.

[Uncle Punk]

EveryONES luck runs out one day. It may take decades, but all RIDERS eventually encounter a set of circumstances well beyond ANY rider's ability to manage. The odds always catch up with them one way or another.

High speed belongs on the racetrack, not the street.

Fixed the article for you but condensed it to the basic message. I don't know where the author chooses to draw a line but it sounds like the speed limit is where it's at for this guy which probably works for him. If he has a problem with a fast guy he should have a problem with all fast guys because for the most part riding is dangerous for anyone pushing on the street and not being the local fastest guy doesn't make you safer.

At what percentage of the speeds involved would the people he described demise not taken place? Would the same outcome taken place if they were all adhering to the posted limits?

[blue03636]

Nelson is a piece of shit track, but it's still better (safer) than 99% of public roads.

Nelsons is like the crack whore of tracks. Yea it's rough, but it's cheap and fun.

[MidgetTodd]

Just like champ01 posted in this thread (the guy that rode with me this past Sunday), "you didn't ride above your ability."

You never know where your ability ends until you ride above it.

I'm free to lead you around Coshocton Sat or Sun

[Warlock]

Just ride your ride...don't worry about anything except killing yourself.

[alienpi]

There is going to be a kawasaki test ride at Mid Ohio on July 22-24th. It's on the Kawasaki website.

[DreamNofR1]

You never know where your ability ends until you ride above it.

I'm free to lead you around Coshocton Sat or Sun

Sunday maybe? I've got stuff going on Saturday, plus their calling for storms that day. PM me your info and I'll get in touch with you to try to make it happen. Thanks man!

[Mykill]

^ kinda what I was thinking. I can tag along Sunday.

[DreamNofR1]

^ kinda what I was thinking. I can tag along Sunday.

Since we're so close to each other, maybe we could meet somewhere on Polaris and head out to Shock Town together?

[Mykill]

Since we're so close to each other, maybe we could meet somewhere on Polaris and head out to Shock Town together?

Yup. Let me know what time you and Todd come up with.

[MidgetTodd]

The Cedar st KFC at noon?

[DreamNofR1]

Sounds like a plan. Although, I'm only pulling up a KFC on N 2nd st? Do you have an address for the one on Cedar St?

[Mykill]

I know where it's at. It takes roughly 45 minutes to get there.